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HQ
Lysander - 200 points
with Terminator squad

Elite

Dreadnaught with Assault Cannon- 115 points

Terminator squad 5 marines 2 chain fists - 210 points


Troops

Tactical Squad 10 marines with Lascannon - 180 points

Tactical Squad 10 marines with Flamer and Multi Melta - 170 points
Rhino + storm bolter - 45 points


Scout Squad 6 marines snipers - 88 points
Razor back twin Lascannon - 75 points


Fast Attack

Space marine attack bike with multi melta - 50 points

Space marine attack bike with Heavy Bolter - 40 points


Heavy

Devastator Squad 10 marines, 1 lascannon,2 plasma cannons,1 Heavy Bolter and sergeant - 270 points


Total 1713 points




Can someone comment on if this list is any good i have a few spare points before i reach 1750


Also thinking of getting a land raider or other tanks to bring it up to 2000 any suggestions?

If you can put a Multi-Melta on that second attack bike instead of the Heavy Bolter, that would probably be good. Though I do love me some plasma cannons, I might be tempted to drop the devs in favor of another Tactical Squad and Rhino and then hand out some teleport homers to as many sergeants as I could. Lysander and 5 terminators hoofing it across the board will probably have a pretty tough time, especially with all of the low AP weapons around. Teleporting them in close to the enemy may alleviate some of that; the down side is that you're at the mercy of reserve rolls to get your heavy hitters into play. And speaking of the terminators.. If possible, I'd swap them for Assault Terminators. Any points leftover could be used to beef up that scout squad or add a Heavy Flamer to the dreadnought.

Don't forget that Lysander has a special ability allowing him to fortify a single ruin, increasing the cover save granted by the ruin by one point. So instead of a 4+ cover save, units in the ruin get a 3+ cover save. You can combine this with camo cloaks on scouts to give them a 2+ cover save while in the ruin. Keep in mind that some boards don't have any ruins, so getting that 2+ cover save is never a sure thing.

Last thing about Lysander: don't forget he makes everyone stubborn. Quite often that means that any of your units in close combat will be there for a very long time, as they won't fail their morale checks as readily as they otherwise might. Having additional troops adds redundancy, and can relieve some of the disadvantages of Stubborn.

I would take a few guys off the devastator squad and switch the unit so it's either entirely anti-tank, anti-elite or anti-infantry, as having 3 diffferent weapons types makes the majority of the squad near useless when you fire against a tank or horde of orks.

I dislike Lysander as I love combat tactics and he doesn't make for losing the skill.
Apart from that I am really not fond of your list. There is no synergy but no killiness; these are just words I know but I mean better units that work together.

I would give a CML to your termies, so they can walk up with the dread but can still be in range. The dev. squad could do with less members and Missile launchers to keep the cost down. The rhino would be better as a razorback in your list.

I think attack bikes work better as pairs, not fond of the heavy bolter.

The dread is a little too short ranged.

Telion is awesome you should think about getting him.

In general though how do you want to play your army? It looks like a fairly defensive outlook to me which is good but you should build a list to make that work if so.

Defensive would be the way id like to pay i also want Lysander rather than Telion as id like them to be strictly Imperial Fist.

baldrat61 wrote:Defensive would be the way id like to pay i also want Lysander rather than Telion as id like them to be strictly Imperial Fist.

Its not a rather than kind of thing, you can have Lysander and Telion. Telion doesn't even count towards your HQ or elites allowance. And for the benefits he bestows... I'd do it.

I Second MFletch, CML's are certainly nice to have if you have the points, and you seem to have enough ill-spent points to reallocate them to CML's. Pairs for bikers, maybe drop a MM on there just because... well you may need it.

I don't need to tell you that it is difficult to make Dev's worth their points, as there are other units that do what they do cheaper, better, or both. If you insist on them... if you just like them, then you WON'T drop them, and I respect that- stand by 'em brother... but please tool them out a little better. They do best to do ALL AT, all AI, or ML's to bring enough to play in either court. 10 guys, with 5-6 having bolters... I've never seen the point, they dont score, theyre there to lay down RANGED fire from a relatively secure location (perhaps bolstered by Lysander), why have more points invested in 5-6 boltgun's with legs, ask not what you can do, what can they do for you?

I've always fancied Lysander with dakka terminators, the bolter drill is nice touch, there is some synergy there. The bolster ruins can be useful with scouts as pointed out, more so with scouts+telion.

Above all, IMHO priority #1 is rectifying that footslogging Lysander-Termies situation. If I were your opponent, and I saw that... there would be an inordinate amount of death sent that-a-way in a single turn, best case scenario: your eternal warrior would be walking around 6" at a time for the rest of the game, trying to throw his helmet at my Landraider.

Good luck bub!
Whether you change it or not, let us know how it plays!

If you want to stay to the character of the imperial fists, just say that Telion is one of the scout sergeants of the imperial fists, such as hilts from sons of dorn

Thanks for all your advice i think ill buy Telion and trim back my devastator squad.
HQ
Lysander - 200 points
with Terminator squad

Elite

Dreadnaught with Assault Cannon- 115 points

Terminator squad 5 marines 2 chain fists - 210 points
Land Raider Crusader with Multi Melta 260 points

Troops

Tactical Squad 10 marines with Lascannon - 185 points

(Combat squad 4 and lascannon
Combat Squad Melta gun,sergeant 3 bolters -
In Razor back twin Lascannon - 75 points)

Tactical Squad 10 marines with Flamer and Multi Melta - 170 points
Rhino + storm bolter - 45 points

Scout Squad 9 marines + Missile Launcher - 88 points
Sergeant Telion


Fast Attack

Space marine attack bike with multi melta - 50 points
Space marine attack bike with Multi Melta - 50 points


Heavy

Devastator Squad 5 marines, 1 lascannon,2 plasma cannons,1 Missile Launcher and sergeant -190 points


Total 1750 points


Im relatively new to this i haven't played in 15 years so am not completely clued on the most recent rules.

baldrat61 wrote:Thanks for all your advice i think ill buy Telion and trim back my devastator squad.

Tactical Squad 10 marines with Lascannon - 185 points

(Combat squad 4 and lascannon
Combat Squad Melta gun,sergeant 3 bolters -
In Razor back twin Lascannon - 75 points)

Tactical Squad 10 marines with Flamer and Multi Melta - 170 points
Rhino + storm bolter - 45 points

Devastator Squad 5 marines, 1 lascannon,2 plasma cannons,1 Missile Launcher and sergeant -190 points

Im relatively new to this i haven't played in 15 years so am not completely clued on the most recent rules.

This is looking much better man!

If I can drop a couple last minute, food-for-thought kinda... thoughts:

That first tactical squad... you've got the combat squad, heavy weapon hangs back, while sarge and the comat squad runs up thing. This combo works brillaintly... but take a look at your transport, the razorback. You've dropped an extra 35 points to put a TLLC on that thing, which you likely plan to send towards the enemy. So you have a big-ass boomstick on a box with guys carrying smaller boomsticks in it, and brother that box is not as strong as you may think. Your opponent is going to see a pretty potent weapons platform, carrying scoring MEQ's into battle. The fact that it has a lascannon on it makes it a priority, the fact that it has enemies in it makes it a priority, the fact that they are scoring... am I painting a picture here?

What would I do? Go dakka. Drop that lascannon, the HB isn't so bad, and its free. The extra points will allow you to purchase a PF for your sgt. I myself am of the school that you should have a PF in every squad. Some will argue points-cost isn't worth it. But even if it never gets used, that could be a good thing by itself. Think of it as insurance. Any commander is going to think twice before sending a walker or IC at that squad, cause that PF is dynamite. If nothing else, try it out a game or two, see what fits.

Now, the second squad: I like the setup, but your rhino already has a storm bolter as default armament. There's no need to drop 10 points on another SB. So dont drop it. That done, you should still have the points from trimming the LC Razorback to purchase... you guessed it: another PF!

For the devastators, this setup is better. Honestly dude, I'd say just get two devastator kits, and make enough marines to where you can swap them out as you get a feel for them. Or just proxy them... beer bottle caps work btw. You may find an even more optimal setup, its going to depend on how you wind up playing your army. You may even decide to re-allocate some points and put them in a TLLC razorback, or the las/plas combo. These are pretty nasty if kept safe.

Maybe a smaller scout squad, with cloaks and possible sniper rifles could work better for you as well, idk, depends on how you use them.

Overall, welcome back! It may have been 15 years brother, but keep details like this in mind, you'll be golden. Opportunity cost is the name of the game sir, like I said, look at your list and literally ask: what can these units/upgrades do for ME? Keep it up sir, and keep posting! I'd like to see how this army performs, as its quite different from mine, and I'm the only SM player amongst my 40K friends.

Good Luck!