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How does the Tank Hunters special rule interact with Gauss and Rending weapons? Does it change the 5s to 6s and the 6s to 7s, causing Rending and/or Gauss to basically trigger on natural 5s instead?

I can see why gauss might not, due to the wording, but it seems rending would interact well with Tank Hunters.

Tank Hunters just (effectively) adds 1 to the STR of the weapon - nothing to do with Guass or Rending's special abilities.

Armor penetration becomes (for rending anyway):
Str + D6 + 1. If the D6 is a 6, it becomes Str + 6 + D3 +1. Not sure how Gauss weapons work, as I don't have the codex.

Happyjew wrote:Armor penetration becomes (for rending anyway):
Str + D6 + 1. If the D6 is a 6, it becomes Str + 6 + D3 +1.

IIRC there is language somewhere saying it is Str + 6 +1 + D3 +1
I don't see it in a quick search, but I will try and find it later.

Everyone I ask this seems to be taking the "effectively" route to answering my question. Tank Hunters states "+1 to penetration roll". Rend States "penetration roll of 6".

I'm hoping there's a more cut and dry reason for why they don't interact, because I'd like to give Tank Hunters to a unit of Canoptek Wraiths so they can take down vehicles easier (for flexibility).

Gauss' wording is more specific in that it references the penetration attempt's "d6 roll of a 6", which feels like it's referencing the natural roll, but again, a little vague in my opinion.

foolishmortal wrote:IIRC there is language somewhere saying it is Str + 6 +1 + D3 +1
I don't see it in a quick search, but I will try and find it later.

wat

You've included +1 twice in there. I don't think you meant to do that.

Stygian Juggernaut wrote:Everyone I ask this seems to be taking the "effectively" route to answering my question. Tank Hunters states "+1 to penetration roll". Rend States "penetration roll of 6".

I'm hoping there's a more cut and dry reason for why they don't interact, because I'd like to give Tank Hunters to a unit of Canoptek Wraiths so they can take down vehicles easier (for flexibility).

Gauss' wording is more specific in that it references the penetration attempt's "d6 roll of a 6", which feels like it's referencing the natural roll, but again, a little vague in my opinion.

Tank Hunters adds one to the total. As in, the normal armor penetration formula is Strength + d6, and TH makes it Strength + d6 +1.

Rending and Guass only trigger when the d6 roll is a 6.

Mannahnin wrote:

Tank Hunters adds one to the total. As in, the normal armor penetration formula is Strength + d6, and TH makes it Strength + d6 +1.

Rending and Guass only trigger when the d6 roll is a 6.

QFT.

Tank Hunters doesn't add to the Armor Penetration ROLL, it adds to Armor Penetration; that is, it makes an addition of 1 to the total Armor Penetration value, which is normally calculated by adding a d6 roll (the Armor Penetration roll) to the Strength of the weapon. It's entirely independent of the roll, and has no effect on it.

Also, please note that even if Tank Hunters DID add to the roll, it wouldn't actually change the odds of Rending occurring, because Rending occurs on a roll of 6, not a roll of 6 or over. If you were to add the +1 to your roll, roll a 6, and get a total of 7, Rending would not trigger because the roll was 7, not 6. So even if you don't agree for some reason that Tank Hunters does not affect the roll itself, nothing actually changes.

p76 BRB
"Tank hunters ... They add +1 to their armour penetration rolls whenever they hit a vehicle"

foolishmortal wrote:p76 BRB
"Tank hunters ... They add +1 to their armour penetration rolls whenever they hit a vehicle"

Ah, all right. That's what I get for replying without having the book at hand. . .

But, as I noted above, that still doesn't change anything. Rending kicks off on a roll of 6, not 6 or above. So while you could argue that a Tank Hunters unit with Rending weapons triggers Rending on an AP roll of 5 instead of 6, the odds don't change at all.

On a side-note, that also doesn't mean that Rending weapons add the Tank Hunters bonus twice, because the d3 is not an Armor Penetration roll, it's a Rending roll.

BeRzErKeR wrote:

Mannahnin wrote:

Tank Hunters adds one to the total. As in, the normal armor penetration formula is Strength + d6, and TH makes it Strength + d6 +1.

Rending and Guass only trigger when the d6 roll is a 6.

QFT.

Tank Hunters doesn't add to the Armor Penetration ROLL, it adds to Armor Penetration; that is, it makes an addition of 1 to the total Armor Penetration value, which is normally calculated by adding a d6 roll (the Armor Penetration roll) to the Strength of the weapon. It's entirely independent of the roll, and has no effect on it.

Also, please note that even if Tank Hunters DID add to the roll, it wouldn't actually change the odds of Rending occurring, because Rending occurs on a roll of 6, not a roll of 6 or over. If you were to add the +1 to your roll, roll a 6, and get a total of 7, Rending would not trigger because the roll was 7, not 6. So even if you don't agree for some reason that Tank Hunters does not affect the roll itself, nothing actually changes.

As quoted above me, the book at least states it's the roll, not the result.

In regards to not increasing the odds, this is true, but a tank hunting wraith would now get a Str 6+ 6(5+1) AP +1d3 Rend (minimum 13) on a natural 5, while having a Str 6+7(6+1) AP, also a 13. Where as if TH doesn't apply in this manner, it would be an 11 and a minimum 14. This could effectively double their effectiveness in assaults against AV 11 through 13, while still being possible to penetrate 14 (though rarer).

So I guess until it appears in a FAQ it'd be safe to add Tank Hunters to a unit of Canoptek Wraiths to smash a vehicle then?

Why wouldn't it be?