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In earth and steel pg 104 Heavy Platoon, I am tempted to swap out my 12cm Mortars, for a Heavy Weapon Platoon with HMG's and a pair of Smoke Launching Mortar Tubes.

I have noticed that they get Portee, but cannot find a definitive reference in the New V3 book (using the index) furthermore my experience with British 6 pounder Portee were Unarmoured-Tank Teams. If it was in a 251 it would become Armoured (even with value 0). So I am trying to find some definitive references to get my head around these rules and ensure I'm using them to the full. Any help would be appreciated.

EDIT found it pg 49.

Still confused, if it is Portee it can dismount and transport sent to the rear, how can dismount something that is Hull mounted? Or is the dismounting rule not applicable.

Any advice though I would happily accept.

The 251/2 (8cm) is the same as a 251/1 but with a mortar instead of a hull MG. Portee allows you to remove the mortar and use it as a gun team with the usual stats for that weapon, In this instance a GW34 8cm mortar (three dudes, one mortar, medium base).

With the new direct fire rule for 8cm mortars you can use them as ersatz Stummel 251/9 (7.5cm). Since the AT rating isn't used against gun teams, bunkers and dug in infantry and they have the same RoF, range and Firepower (2, 24" 3+).

I never understood why Stummels were denied bombardment since they could do it IRL.

Okay that makes sense, and I have 2 x 8cm Mortar teams anyway so all is good...



So i'll throw in one of Kubelwagens and an Observer team and i'm all set.

If I can fire from the 251 (without disembarking) I would be better off when facing Infantry? As it is an Armoured Vehicle?

Cheers George.

mwnciboo wrote:If I can fire from the 251 (without disembarking) I would be better off when facing Infantry? As it is an Armoured Vehicle?

I'm not sure of the numbers but I think so, especially against rifle and MG fire.

On foot: you have an 11% chance of being destroyed by a successful hit (5+ save, 6+ firepower).
On foot (gone to ground): 5.5% chance of being destroyed by a successful hit (3+ save, 6+ firepower) Note: does not take into account the extra -1 to hit.
Embarked (vs. front armour): 0.69% chance of being destroyed by a successful hit (Bail on a 1, 6+ firepower, second bail required, 4+ (Confident) command check) Note: this assumes only one vehicle is targeted, larger platoons lower chance.

As man packed gun teams GW34 mortars that do not move are concealed in the open so can be harder to hit. Again the numbers above don't take this into account.

Nice kitbash of the PSC Hanomags by the way.

Cheers for the compliment, Yeah the PSC 251's are useful to have around, I keep them on the sprue and then use them whenever. It's cheaper to buy them in packs of 3-4 Box bundles that Will Townsend does.

Still waiting for Pioneer Bridging sections, and some nice Flamm pieces. Thanks for the advice, I might disembark them, as I don't want them falling to auto-hitting air attack in the Open. Plus I can call the transports back if I need them.

Since I run a Heavy Platoon in my Grey Wolf Panzergrenadier list (2 HMG, 2 mortar) I'm tempted to attach the mortars to a platoon and use them to attack hard points. Currently they are used for smoke but this tactic is less useful in V3.

Hey Mwnciboo, where did you get your heavy MGs? BTW I finished painting my first stug, I'll post a pic when I get my new cellphone. My old cellphone I lost the cord that connects computer to cellphone. Anyway does anyone know why sometimes the location for me is USA when I live in Canada.

Hey Danil, I bought the Forged in Battle HMG set (£5 in the UK) so I reckon about $7-$10 in the US. (whoops sorry Canada - nice place went there on Honeymoon best country on earth - Other than Wales)

They are a really good sculpt for such a cheap unit, as are the Forged in Battle mortars. Infact I use PSC for vehicles and Forged in Battle for Gun teams and Infantry stuff.

http://www.forgedinbattle.com/product_info.php?cPath=22_26&products_id=44
(they are labelled wrong, they aren't vickers guns but MG42's!)

It's easy to get in the UK, so i'm pretty sure it will be easy to get out in North America.

Mortar half-tracks got much more useful in V3 and Grey Wolf, as they now have a direct fire that can fire on the move. They also have smoke ammunition, so they can move and fire smoke at something, preventing retaliatory fire and allowing the rest of the half-tracks to advance.

Then on the next turn, you can either bombard, or direct fire with full RoF.

Hey mwnciboo, thank you for the reply. Are the FOB infantry compatible with PSC infantry?

Not really but in my experience very few people notice. As most of my units are over 12" from your eye it's hard to tell. I wouldn't worry about it too much.

Picture paints a thousand words (this is on my painting table)



Close in it's obvious.



At range of 12" very much less so.

I am curious which mortars You used for that nice 251/2 kitbash? The Forged in Battle "German 8cm GrW 34 Mortar Team"?

Your eyes are spot on Cain, Forged in Battle 8cm GrW 34 mortar team.

Just posted this upto you in another forum where you talked on 251/2's

Thanks for that update Yeah, I spotted the loader's pose in Your 251/2 and it matched the FiB product 100%. It appears, that this is the cheapest option for 251/2s. Another, which I had in my mind was using Point of Action halftrucks, but they are a bit longer, and need some crew to look pretty. IIRC four halftracks for a complete platoon are needed, amirite? So with PSC kit + FiB mortars we get complete platoon and have one spare halftrack left. Have You been looking into FiB Kubelwagens - are they good? There is no painted picture of them and google provides some pics of blisters with resin.

I actually bought BF kubelwagens, although I have no idea why? It must have been an impulse buy or something. This is how I painted them...



Not great, but they are decoration.

They look decent! You could splash on some quickshade, but that's optional. You do not know why You bought them, or why You bought BF not FiB product? (I still don't know why I started Imperial Guard army a couple of years ago...)
But at least Kubelwagens appear to be almost mandatory, when taking pioneer and other support platoons, so I was looking into 3-4 of them as well.

The replacement MGs on the SPWs look much better than the weapons that come with the PSC kit. However (and I hate to be a pedant) the SdKfz 251/2 had the 80mm mortar mounted well forward (just behind the driver), and didn't have the forward MG.

TBH I couldn't fit it with the man the right way round, because he would be reaching over the base. So I moved it backwards. Inreality the mortar being that far back would cause issues, nevermind and good spot too.

Edit - @CainTheHunter - Yeah i've actually washed, detailed and Quickshaded + Dullcoted these. This picture is a bit old, Once I've finished all the models I will be going back and re-doing certain units to keep all the force looking Homogeneous.

mwnciboo wrote:TBH I couldn't fit it with the man the right way round, because he would be reaching over the base. So I moved it backwards. Inreality the mortar being that far back would cause issues, nevermind and good spot too.

Fair enough - I think that kind of compromise is acceptable in this scale. Maybe remove the forward MG though? It would distinguish them a bit more from normal SPWs.

Yeah true, plus it shouldn't have one anyway! Snip - snip done!