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For those who don't know, 1:87 scale is the slightly eccentric scale also known as HO gauge; it originated with railway modelling, but Roco (an Austrian model train manufacturer) began producing plastic 'minitanks' in this scale to compliment the railway subjects, and it became something of a niche scale for military modellers and wargamers. It's noticably larger than BF's 15mm (1:100) scale, but still fairly petite. The advantages over 15mm is that the models, being larger, are a bit more sturdy; AFV models are a bit more detailed than 15mm (although PSC has levelled the field in that regard) , and softskins tend to have full interiors and transparent windscreens. You also get access to the huge range of HO scale scenery that's available. The disadvantages of this scale are that the model range is rather limited, with a heavy emphasis on German equipment, and the models tend to be hard to get hold of. I haven't compared the cost, but they're definitely more expensive than PSC's 15mm vehicle kits.

I have a substantial collection of WWII stuff in this scale, including a number of Soviet tank models that were, unfortunately, discontinued a few years ago. Preiser, a German company, have cranked out quite a wide range of figures which tends to focus on the Eastern Front, and includes some very nicely detailed German and Soviet troops in winter uniforms, as well as interesting stuff like German horse-drawn supply wagons and artillery. They even do German and Soviet PoWs. Here is an example of their 'Advancing Grenadiers':

http://www.eurorailhobbies.com/erh_detail.asp?erh_find=Grenadiers&stock=PR-16557

I think the figures look much better than the 15mm ranges, although they are more fiddly (as they tend to come with separate arms and even heads).

Does anyone use this scale for FoW?

Why wouldnt you just use 20mm?

If you want to change scales why not go for one with more variety than 15mm.

Hi Big P.
Is 20mm= 1/72nd scale?
Because there are loads of options available if it is...

Big P wrote:Why wouldnt you just use 20mm?

If you want to change scales why not go for one with more variety than 15mm.

I think 15mm offers the biggest range of models, although my preference is plastic which narrows things down a bit. 1:87 scale has a few advantages over 1:72 scale.

1. 1:87 is still much smaller than 1:72 scale (even if it doesn't sound as though it is), so the simplified tracks etc are perfectly acceptable. One you get to 1:72 scale, the simplified kits look rather crude (I'm speaking from experience here, having bought some of the examples available). Most recent 1:72 scale kits are fairly delicate, and have a lot of parts (especially Dragon's), and most wargamers would prefer not to spend the time required to assemble them (again, that's from experience, having built an Afrika Korps force in 1:72 scale). And the older ones (like Arifix's) just don't cut it anymore. Of course, PSC's 1:72 scale range may (slowly) change that.

2. Similarly, because the models are quite small, you don't have the WH40k issue of battlefields that look like parking lots.

3. As I said, you get access to a vast amount of terrain (all of the stuff they do for railway layouts, much of which is perfect for the WWII era). There is some excellent terrain available in 1:72 scale - especially Italeria's bunkers and houses, but nothing like what's available in HO scale.

4. Preiser does some figures in 1:72 scale, but not many. It's really the quality of the figures (and, again, the fact that they're plastic) that attracts me. PSC is obviously making inroads here as well, although the 1:72 scale versions of their 15mm figures tend to show up the flaws in the sculpting.

I'm really just interested in whether anyone is playing FoW in this scale - I'm not arguing that it is preferable to 15mm.

20mm = 1/76th and 1/72nd


And it has thousands more models than 15mm... But thats cos its been around for 60 odd years.

I also dont agree that fast-builds are crude...




They also dont have lots of parts, many resins, like the one below are two part models...



As for figures... Well in 20mm you have AB Figures that blow all out of the water...




Having a table that looks like a parking lot is nothing to do with the scale, thats the fault of the players... Seen plenty of 15mm games that look like a parking lot.

Agreed. 20mm WW2 gaming has been around alot longer then 15mm, has a huge range of choice from hundreds of manufacturers (far more then 15's) and is easily the most popular scale amongst historical gamers.