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i've noticed a growing number of people in my local store (usually people who are not local but still...) coming up with these points in games, just wondered if there is any truth to them, anywhere at all or more precicely - i'm curious why these "rules"/"rumours" started. i should note that i ignore these pretend "rules" people make up, i'm just wondered about their origin:


1) if you have no models on the board you auto-lose the game
(this kinda pwns my daemon and drop pod armies but i keep hearing people saying it, i'm sure it has nothing to do with the rules but it has held up games whilst i plead my case to people)

2) if you assault an enemy who is already engaged, they cannot attack the new target because they are too pre-ocupied with the original assault
(actually had a guy come out with this at a throne of skulls tournie.... i let him do it as i had planned to ignore the model that charged me anyway but i wondered how many people he cheated out with this "rule")


anyone know where these ideas come from???

or am i wrong and they are hidden in the rules somewhere

mrspadge wrote:1) if you have no models on the board you auto-lose the game
(this kinda pwns my daemon and drop pod armies but i keep hearing people saying it, i'm sure it has nothing to do with the rules but it has held up games whilst i plead my case to people)

This is not true.

If all of your models are killed or destroyed, THEN you lose the game. It's called "getting tabled" in certain circles.

However, you can reserve ALL of your units before the game and have nothing on the Table for turn 1. Then, you bring in your drop pods per their rules and the other units you reserved.

Ask THEM to show YOU where this rule can be found in the rule book.

1) Um, no? SOme tournaments have a rule that if you are "tabled" (this specifically refers to killing all your stuff, if you still have stuff in reserve, you are not tabled) you auto-lose, but that is by no means a universal rule

2) I think this may be a holdover of a previous edition. Some old-timers (myself included, but only from 4th) get confused as to minor points between new editions. I think maybe the "frag grenade rule" (I1 if made difficult check and no grenades) doesn't apply when all targets are already engaged. (it's meant to represent the assaultee leaping out from behind cover...not possibles if you're already fighting.)

Not sure where number 2 comes from, number 1 most likely stems from the fact that if at the end of the game (i.e. after the final turn) you have no models on the board you automatically lose.

i should clarify that i fly into a metaphorical berzerk rage at anyone who tries to pull these things on me and never go through with them (except the ToS time i mentioned, because it had no effect on the game for me)

just wondered if anyone else knows about them or has a clue where they come from...

#2 comes from a misreading of the assault rules. Something about not being able to attack someone unless you were engaged with them at the start of the assault.

GW has (I believe) clarified this in the FAQ.

biccat wrote:GW has (I believe) clarified this in the FAQ.

They tried, although the clarification is still a little muddy for some.

The confusion comes from people missing the fact hat the start of the round of combat (which is the point right before you roll attacks for that particular tangle of models) is not the same as the start of the assault phase (which is before any assault moves are declared). You can attack any model you are engaged with at the start of the round of combat. You don't have to be engaged at the start of the assault phase.

Sir_Prometheus wrote:1) Um, no? SOme tournaments have a rule that if you are "tabled" (this specifically refers to killing all your stuff, if you still have stuff in reserve, you are not tabled) you auto-lose, but that is by no means a universal rule

2) I think this may be a holdover of a previous edition.

1. Actually, it is a 'universal' rule, ie it's in the main rulebook and applies to the standard missions. Page 90, Wipeout!

2. Never been a rule that I know of, and I've been playing since early 2nd.