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Firstly, apologies for yet ANOTHER YMDC thread - got my first tourny this weekend, so I'd prefer to be clear cut on these things

Anyway - let's paint the picture.

An assault. Player A has a unit of terminators, plus an IC with a 3+ Invul save in combat, against Player B's unit of Incubi.

The incubi target the Terminators (NOT the IC), strike first, and deal, say, 5 power weapon wounds. None of these wounds can be allocated to the IC (with his 3+ invul save) since he is treated as a separate unit in close combat. It would be the equivalent of not being able to allocate wounds taken by one friendly unit, to another friendly unit within a multi-assault combat.

Is this correct?

Seems correct, but it's only something I've actually realized yesterday. No idea how often an opponent has incorrectly played this (if ever), but it's a neat little "trick" to know.

On to part 2:

Assuming the above is accurate - how would this affect universal rules for IC's? If an IC grants FNP, would it affect a unit he is with, while they are in CC? It seems to contradict certain unit-wide boons when they enter a CC situation.

To give another example: Waaagh Banners grant +1WS to a unit. In CC, would that mean the Warboss would not gain this benifit since he would be treated as a separate unit?

This seems somewhat hypocritical - particularly if the IC is the one granting the boon.

Part 1 is correct. Common tactic.

I'm not sure if it is RAW, but I believe most people play that things that benefit a unit (such as a Painboyz FNP, or a Waaagh! banner) affect the IC as long as he is part of the unit (even if treated as a separate unit for attacking). So if you had Mad Dok charge on his own, and a unit of Boyz charge the Boyz would not get FNP, but if Dok was with the BOyz, then they would.

Part 1: Correct. But, if you have a Incubi that is only in Base-to-base with the IC and not a terminator, he has to attack the IC.

Part 2: The IC is still part of the unit, but you just treat him as if he isn't for that one brief moment in CC. So, any wargear or special rules that effect the unit will crossover and effect both the IC and the rest of the unit.

Cool, thanks for the quick replies guys. Appreciate it!

The IC is still part of unit, so special rules still work. They also must flee with the unit if it's broken.

But yes, in an assault they temporarily count as a seperate unit. Also it's worth noting that the IC must be in base-to-base to attack, being within 2" of his squad isn't enough.

That one is debatable, as the IC is not a separate unit until after you determine who can attack.

Happyjew wrote:That one is debatable, as the IC is not a separate unit until after you determine who can attack.

Not sure where this is from, you treat it in a similar way to multiple combats.

If you look at P49 under 'Independant Characters & Assaults' second paragraph (in the middle somewhere) it says the IC must be in B2B to attack.

Bad memory from too much drinking trying to understand RAW. Previous post retracted.

Part one is a very good tactic to make an uber IC suffer a bad check at the end of combat. If you wipe the squad, the IC still must take the test at the negative modifier of however many models were in the squad, which is normally how I do it with my wyches. Its a pretty decent way to get rid of an IC without having to actually fight them.

Remember that any models that are only in base with the IC must attack the IC

Yes, yes, I have been playing for 3 years, I know a bit about how units target IC's xP

For some reason I've just had a brain fart in terms of how the enemy allocated. It's good to know to watch out for it, though.

Happyjew wrote:Bad memory from too much drinking trying to understand RAW. Previous post retracted.

So RAW drives one to drink? It had to be good for something.

What happens when the IC is the only in B2B? At the point at which they attack, the unit clearly does not have a model in b2b with the enemy. But when you work out who is engaged, it's still one unit, right? So are the models within 2" of the IC engaged and so can attack even though none of them are in B2B with the enemy? Did I use enough question marks in this paragraph?

kmd1066 wrote:

Happyjew wrote:Bad memory from too much drinking trying to understand RAW. Previous post retracted.

So RAW drives one to drink? It had to be good for something.

Only the ones that are poorly written.