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I am tryign to build a 1500 list and want a CCB+Scythe. I tried out Anrakyr in a CCB the other day and was quite impressed, especially like the Mind in the Machine ability.

However, since then i have had the recent FAQ pointed out to me and it turns out that he cant use that ability while on the barge (don't really see why but thats the way it is so i will have to live with it).

So my dilema:

Is Anrakyr still a valid choice/ or am i better going with an OverLord with MSS, Weave, Scythe (who comes out a little cheaper and is better kitted out for if/when he is dismounted....but has no funky shennanigans to play with).

Anraykr in CCb = 245
OveLord in CCB = 210

I've seen quite a lot recently on here that his ability in the barge has been nerfed by the faq, but I can't seem to find it anywhere in the faq I found lol :/ do you know what it says? It's a shame it sounds awesome riding around in a barge with scythe destroying tanks and taking over more. If you're hoping to ride around in the barge more maybe the cheaper over lord will be better? Better equiped and you wouldn't get many turns of mind in the machine otherwise..?

it is somethgin along the lines of shooting abilities that require LOS having to use a vehicles fire points. And since the open topped barge has no stated fire points, he has to be out of the trasnport to use it.

i would argue that the BRB says that models in open topped may fire from any point. But at the same time, Anraykr is not actually firing anything.

If he did not need LOS and it was just a distance then he could not only use it from the barge, but also measure the range from the barges hull. Doh!

I swear open topped vehicles don't need fire points

Praxiss wrote:it is somethgin along the lines of shooting abilities that require LOS having to use a vehicles fire points. And since the open topped barge has no stated fire points, he has to be out of the trasnport to use it.

No.

The only things that can use firing points are psychic abilities and shooting attacks.
Any's ability isn't either of those.
Therefore you have no permission to trace LoS (which the ability needs).

BRB FAQ wrote:Q: Can models embarked upon a vehicle use its fire
points to draw line of sight to a unit to use special
rules or wargear (other than shooting)? (p66)
A: No.

adam304 wrote:I've seen quite a lot recently on here that his ability in the barge has been nerfed by the faq, but I can't seem to find it anywhere in the faq I found lol :/ do you know what it says? It's a shame it sounds awesome riding around in a barge with scythe destroying tanks and taking over more. If you're hoping to ride around in the barge more maybe the cheaper over lord will be better? Better equiped and you wouldn't get many turns of mind in the machine otherwise..?

The FAQ specifically addresses the point that you can not use a vehicle's fire points to draw LOS for special abilities and wargear that aren't shooting.
Two schools of thought exist regarding whether a CCB, being open topped, has fire points or not. Tip: DO NOT ASK HERE, search and be prepared for a looooong read (and lots of anger on both sides).

To be safe, you cannot draw LOS while embarked on a transport vehicle for special abilities or wargear that requires LOS. So Anrakyr needs to disembark to use Mind in the Machine.

The Infinite wrote:

adam304 wrote:I've seen quite a lot recently on here that his ability in the barge has been nerfed by the faq, but I can't seem to find it anywhere in the faq I found lol :/ do you know what it says? It's a shame it sounds awesome riding around in a barge with scythe destroying tanks and taking over more. If you're hoping to ride around in the barge more maybe the cheaper over lord will be better? Better equiped and you wouldn't get many turns of mind in the machine otherwise..?

The FAQ specifically addresses the point that you can only use a vehicle's fire points to draw LOS for shooting and psychic shooting attacks.
Two schools of thought exist regarding whether a CCB, being open topped, has fire points or not. Tip: DO NOT ASK HERE, search and be prepared for a looooong read (and lots of anger on both sides).

To be safe, you cannot draw LOS while embarked on a transport vehicle for anything other than shooting or psychic shooting attacks. So Anrakyr needs to disembark to use Mind in the Machine.

But it does say in the BGB FAQ that you also need LOS to use non-psychic shooting attacks that require sight to a specific target, like Doom for Eldar for example

GoDz BuZzSaW wrote:But it does say in the BGB FAQ that you also need LOS to use non-psychic shooting attacks that require sight to a specific target, like Doom for Eldar for example

Doom is a psychic power.

rigeld2 wrote:

GoDz BuZzSaW wrote:But it does say in the BGB FAQ that you also need LOS to use non-psychic shooting attacks that require sight to a specific target, like Doom for Eldar for example

Doom is a psychic power.

He said you only do it for Psychic Shooting Attacks, Problem?

Shhhh! Not the place for this arguement again.

Tip: DO NOT ASK HERE, search and be prepared for a looooong read (and lots of anger on both sides).

Anyway, general consensus is that the Overlord is the better option now?

GoDz BuZzSaW wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

GoDz BuZzSaW wrote:But it does say in the BGB FAQ that you also need LOS to use non-psychic shooting attacks that require sight to a specific target, like Doom for Eldar for example

Doom is a psychic power.

He said you only do it for Psychic Shooting Attacks, Problem?

Updated my earlier post to make it clearer.

GoDz BuZzSaW wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

GoDz BuZzSaW wrote:But it does say in the BGB FAQ that you also need LOS to use non-psychic shooting attacks that require sight to a specific target, like Doom for Eldar for example

Doom is a psychic power.

He said you only do it for Psychic Shooting Attacks, Problem?

Bolded my problem.

And yeah, this isn't the place for the discussion. Take it to YMDC if you want.

Praxiss wrote:Shhhh! Not the place for this arguement again.

Tip: DO NOT ASK HERE, search and be prepared for a looooong read (and lots of anger on both sides).

Anyway, general consensus is that the Overlord is the better option now?

I was going to say this haha I didnt mean to start a whole YMDC debate was just looling for some clarification my bad lol.

I reckon so as the overlord offers a bit more for the points if staying in the barge as long as possible

Praxiss wrote:Shhhh! Not the place for this arguement again.

Tip: DO NOT ASK HERE, search and be prepared for a looooong read (and lots of anger on both sides).

Anyway, general consensus is that the Overlord is the better option now?

With the Nerf to his ability, and the fact that he has a Tachyon Arrow included in his cost, is yes, The Overlord is the more competitive choice.

Just give your Overlord a Weave, WS, and MSS if you want, and you are good to go for Barge duty.

rigeld2 wrote: Take it to YMDC if you want.

I don't need to, I know what the BGB says

It's getting quite aggressive here. Rule lawyers seem to be that way.

Staying in the barge obviously feels safer, but why not just do the following.

Sweep
disembark
shoot/control
assault
embark on next turn
sweep
iterate

In that case it seem Anrakyr still works, especially if you position in such a way that the empty barge gives him a cover save against shooting.

Barges are much better sweeping when moving flat-out for several reasons. They get the 4+ cover save, can be in a better position thanks to the extra distance and less vulnerable to counter assault.

An Overlord that is Sweeping from within 12" means even if he doesn't asault he can still be assaulted. In that case you really need to tool him up with all sorts of gear that I would rather not buy. My Overlord has a Warscythe and that's it. Getting him into a CC that is not beneficial to me is inefficient. Of course if you are giving your Overlord the VIP treatment then perhaps getting him into CC isn't such a bad proposition.

Because Anrakyr cannot use Mind in the Machine from the Barge anymore, he is now a less consistent choice. That is, if you are in a situation where MitM can be devastating (IG parking lots, for example, or any armies actually fielding Vindicators) then Anrakyr is going to be the better option. Likewise, if you are lucky enough to get the Tachyon Arrow to actually do anything, then it is obviously worth it.

However, the Overlord will be far more consistent. So that's my judgement: Anrakyr is a great-risk, great-reward choice, whereas the Overlord will consistently do what it is supposed to.

Hmmm, got a firnedly tourney coming up soon. Of my 3 opponents i knwo that one (red Scorpions player) fields a Vindi 90% of the time. one fo the other guys is an IG player and ALWAYS parks all his tanks in the back left corner of the board, but hopefully he is learning.

I'd go for the Character, sounds like a good bet, good luck