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Hi. Has anyone noticed how Eldritch storm, the psychic power for the eldar ad their ONLY psychic shooting attack has a terrible statline and would struggle to kill a guardsman?

The statline is 18" eane S:3 AP:- large blast, pinning.

This to me seems far too weak for a power that "summons a corona of crackling energy that strikes out with arcs of lightning"

I would imagine it to be someting like S:5 AP:4 or maybe simalar to the chain lightningy power that primaris psykers get because at the moment I don't see the point in it.

Post what you think the statline should be or argue why it should stay the same.

Yeah from what it says, it ought to be a lot stronger. How about S5 Ap5, 5" Blast with the Arc rule?

lightning thus far has been shown to have str7-8, but that would be a bit much, so i sugest this


range 24"
Str 7
Ap5
Large blast, rending, pinning

and the spin thing, cos i like it

Rending's a bit too excessive.

Valkyrie wrote:Rending's a bit too excessive.

Statistically speaking, rending is the most bloody useless USR ever, a one in six chance of being a power weapon with extra dice to penetrate is nowhere near as nice in practice as it seems on paper.

Eldritch Storm is fine as it is; it is solely meant to spin vehicles around so that the Eldar's plentiful S6 weaponry can rip open side/rear armor. It isn't a bad spell, it is just so outclassed by the utility of Fortune, Doom, and Guide. It works wonders against parking lot IG and Razorback spam lists.

Kain wrote:

Valkyrie wrote:Rending's a bit too excessive.

Statistically speaking, rending is the most bloody useless USR ever, a one in six chance of being a power weapon with extra dice to penetrate is nowhere near as nice in practice as it seems on paper.

I disagree, rending has done great for me. It helps in boundless ways and is something not to be laughed at. It is especially great on things that get plenty of hits(like genesneakers templates or hordes)

Rending is what makes shooting that assault cannon at that Land Raider viable

Henners91 wrote:Rending is what makes shooting that assault cannon at that Land Raider viable

Which I have done.

And won.

Rending is great for things with a lot of die to roll. Having a Thunderwolf Squad with rending is a good bet, but something like a lone dread with a Ass Can is not going to go far.

Eldritch Storm would be interesting if it was infinite range and barrage, and strength more in line with Shadow Weaver.

Henners91 wrote:Rending is what makes shooting that assault cannon at that Land Raider viable

Assault cannons have decent statline and low price to begin with, rending tips the scale to make it from a decent to an excellent weapon. When you're using a 100+ pts model that must pass a psychic test in order to shoot it, well... the Assault Cannon in comparison isn't anywhere near that price range.

All I'm saying is that Rending is an interesting mechanic, but it's not a magical ointment that will solve all problems.

Ridealgh wrote:Hi. Has anyone noticed how Eldritch storm, the psychic power for the eldar ad their ONLY psychic shooting attack

I hadn't noticed because Mind War is also a shooting attack.

the reason i gave it rending isnt to make it uber (because it doesnt) its because that many lightning strikes hitting your unit will mess you up, my other idea was this, but its kinda out there

Eldrich storm
Range 48"
Str 6
AP 5
Heavy 4 blast barrage, Haywire

It's a large blast that does not scatter. It spins vehicles around while doing not so bad damage to their side armor values. It can be shot without LoS, can cause pinning on said guardsmen, and is cheap to bring. I think it serves it's purpose without issue and does not need a buff.

Farseer Mael Dannan wrote:It's a large blast that does not scatter. It spins vehicles around while doing not so bad damage to their side armor values. It can be shot without LoS, can cause pinning on said guardsmen, and is cheap to bring. I think it serves it's purpose without issue and does not need a buff.

wait what? it hits side armour?? cant say i ever noticed that, and doesnt scatter? doesnt need los? its a normal psy shooting attack isnt it, so it must do, pinning... meh, no one uses it compared to all the other powers, that alone indiacates why it does need a buff

Farseer Mael Dannan wrote:It's a large blast that does not scatter. It spins vehicles around while doing not so bad damage to their side armor values. It can be shot without LoS, can cause pinning on said guardsmen, and is cheap to bring. I think it serves it's purpose without issue and does not need a buff.

- It scatters just like all other blasts in 5th edition.
- It does 2D6 + 3 dmg to vehicles with AP-... which is garbage
- Despite not requiring LoS, it can't be used while inside vehicles
- Being an extra power it competes with being cast over the other choices of Fortune and Doom. No brainer which is better no to mention that 20pts is a weapon upgrade on a serpent.

If you want it to be similar to the storm found in the DoW video games it should be:

24" Range Str6 AP4 assault Large Blast, Rending, models hit by the storm treat all terrain as difficult/dangerous on their next turn.

BlueDagger wrote:

Farseer Mael Dannan wrote:It's a large blast that does not scatter. It spins vehicles around while doing not so bad damage to their side armor values. It can be shot without LoS, can cause pinning on said guardsmen, and is cheap to bring. I think it serves it's purpose without issue and does not need a buff.

- It scatters just like all other blasts in 5th edition.
- It does 2D6 + 3 dmg to vehicles with AP-... which is garbage
- Despite not requiring LoS, it can't be used while inside vehicles
- Being an extra power it competes with being cast over the other choices of Fortune and Doom. No brainer which is better no to mention that 20pts is a weapon upgrade on a serpent.

thought as much lol

Since you are summoning the storm, you are hitting top armor which should be counted as side, and though the penetration isn't good that helps a lot unless you are gonna be trying to hurt a LR. Eldritch storm does not scatter, it specifically says WHAT to do with the scatter dice. The scatter dice chooses the vehicle position, on a hit you get to choose. No scatter, auto hit.

You'd have to link otherwise, but since it specifically tells you how the scatter dice is used when you roll it, and that it is only used for the position of the vehicle it should not scatter. Codex > Rulebook

it doesnt seem to give you the ability to ignore scatter, it just adds a scatter die to spin the vehicle, also from what i can find there are no rules in the brb that acount for hitting "top" armour so it doesnt hit the side, the scatter one may be argued (in the rules forum) but the top armour one can not, now if it did work that way, it may be worth taking, but as it stands it doesnt... this may be because of age of the book to be honest, as alot of "lightning" attacks seem to do just that

Formosa wrote:it doesnt seem to give you the ability to ignore scatter, it just adds a scatter die to spin the vehicle, also from what i can find there are no rules in the brb that acount for hitting "top" armour so it doesnt hit the side, the scatter one may be argued (in the rules forum) but the top armour one can not, now if it did work that way, it may be worth taking, but as it stands it doesnt... this may be because of age of the book to be honest, as alot of "lightning" attacks seem to do just that

The Scatter rule from a quick google appears to be pretty argued, with no clear ruling being made. I guess you take it at however you would read it, but personally I don't see it as Scattering (and I would say a larger amount of google results would support this). If you don't feel like it should be top armor all the time, it for sure is if you shoot it out of LoS as any barrage weapon used as such would hit top armor.

Fairly sure that's barrage weapons. IDK if Eldrich Storm is a barrage weapon or not though.

Rending would be awesome, but with 2d6 armor pen already, I'd say a higher strength, at least s4 (to make it easier to toss a bunch of wounds on a Tac. Squad). and make it twin linked.

So, ...
Eldritch Storm
S4, Ap-, Large Blast, pinning.
player may re-roll the scatterdie.
2d6 armor penetration
spins the vehicle to a random direction (chosen on a hit).

This change alone would make it much better.


........


On a separate note, I might add that it always achieves a glancing hit to a vehicle; that way, you can always guarantee it at lest prevents one vehicle from shooting and causes havoc by spinning their vehicle in a random direction.

I'd like to compare the Eldritch Storm to the Night Spinner. I know, one is HQ and the other is Heavy. One is infantry and the other is vehicle. One is slow and one is fast skimmer. One is short range and the other is long range barrage. One is vulnerable to all psychic power defenses while the other negates a large portion of cover. One is low strength the other is mid-strength rending.

Why is it that they are so close in price again?

Now, not only does it need to be usable, it needs to be a valid alternative to Fortune and it needs to be better than throwing a Singing Spear (without negating the benefit of the spear!). The spear's main target is MCs and vehicles, other than that it's a cheap alternative for Fortuneseers. In other words it needs to be better against infantry specifically. Not only that, it needs to be valid compared to more recent codexes.

I'd say.
Inf range. S4 Ap5 Assault 1, Barrage, Rending, Large Blast. (Absolutely extra no special rules against vehicles.)