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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/06/05 06:30:19
Subject: Starting Eldar [Advice Needed]
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Infiltrating Broodlord
New York
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As some may know I recently inherited an Eldar army from a friend and I'm looking around the forums for guides and stuff on eldar, but the 'search' feature was not being kind to me for whatever reason. So if anyone can pass me a link or just post up their own unit analysis and stuff it would be much helpful.
What I'm interested in (all opinions geared for 5th ed..yes i know 6th ed is on the way):
1. Best load outs for the models I now own. (wargear/weapons/etc)
2. Army Composition suggestions (which units work well together, combos/synergy)
3. How to improve on what I currently own in an economical way (i'd potentially buy a few things to fill in gaps but def not looking to say...buy 5 new vehicles for an army i got free)
4. Any other important aspect I may have overlooked with Eldar
This is what I currently own, I "added" the 20 dire avengers and 2 wave serpents from a separate trade to boost the army.
Also note I'm willing to buy weapon bits so pretend that all weapon options are available for each unit when making suggestions.
Unlimited Pts - Eldar Roster - June 4th 2012
3 Autarch w/Jetbikes
4 Dark Reapers
. . 3 Dark Reapers - Reaper Launcher
. . 1 Dark Reaper Exarch - Tempest Launcher
20 Dire Avengers
. . 18 Dire Avengers - Avenger S-Catapult
. . 1 Dire Avenger Exarch - 2 Avenger SC
. . 1 Dire Avenger Exarch - Power Weapon; Shimmershield
1 Falcon
2 Farseer
30 Guardians
. . 20 Guardians - Shuriken Catapult
. . 10 Guardians - Close Combat Weapon; Shuriken Pistol
8 Howling Banshees
. . 7 Howling Banshees - Banshee Mask; Power Weapon; Shuriken Pistol
. . 1 Howling Banshee Exarch - Banshee Mask; Shuriken Pistol; Executioner
3 Vyper
3 Warlock
2 Wave Serpent
2 Wraithlord
Total Roster Cost: 2776
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/06/05 06:31:25
1. Tyranids - 15,000 pts
2. Chaos Space Marines - 7,100 pts
3. Space Marines - 6,000 pts
4. Orks - 5,900 pts
5. Dark Angels - 4,300 pts
6. Necrons - 4,600 pts
7. Grey Knights - 3,200 pts
8. Eldar - 3,400 pts
9. Blood Angels - 3,200 pts
10. Chaos Daemons - 3,200 pts
11. Tau Empire - 3,000 pts
12. Space Wolves - 2,400 pts |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/06/05 07:03:05
Subject: Starting Eldar [Advice Needed]
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Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator
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Well, Eldar is best played mechanized these days. Banshees, Guardians, and Dark Reapers are rarely seen in such armies, up to Storm Guardians which can fit a role.
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Former moderator 40kOnline
Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!
Illumini: "And thank you for not finishing your post with a " " I'm sorry, but after 7200 's that has to be the most annoying sign-off ever."
Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/06/05 09:55:46
Subject: Starting Eldar [Advice Needed]
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Longtime Dakkanaut
New Zealand
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Unfortunately while you might have nearly 3000 points of stuff its going to be very difficult to build a viable army out of that. Eldar really don't work very well as a combined arms force, you really need to go completely mech or completely foot. I would advise against going completely foot though, some people have done well with it recently at tournaments but its a very challenging army to use.
Autarchs are an ok HQ choice, although they usually only taken as a second HQ (after a Seer) mostly just for the reserves buff. Personally I'm not a fan of the idea, but a single Autarch on Jetbike can be used to boost the offensive output of a JetCouncil. Since you don't have a JetCouncil these 3 guys don't have much use though (you can only use two max anyway).
Reapers still drop Marines very nicely, but suffer due to the combination of the 5th edition cover rules halving their damage output and their inability to move and fire (so they can never move to better positions to possibly remove cover). In a mech list they give you a static element you don't want and their role can easily be filled by Prisms, Night Spinners, Falcons etc which can keep up with the rest of your army. In a foot list you really have to get as much anti tank firepower from your heavy slots as you can (since you don't have Serpent heavy weapons and Dragons aren't particularly effective without delivery systems), which means Wraithlords and Walkers.
Avengers are probably our best scoring unit, but that isn't saying much. They work best as 5 man units with no upgrades, basically just there to make a Serpent or Falcon scoring. 10 man units are passable anti infantry, but get outclassed by cheaper Flamer Guardians. Like most Eldar infantry units they need a transport or they disappear very quickly.
Falcons are solid with Holos, just don't use them as offensive transports. Put 5 Avengers in there and hang back to shoot from long range and provide fire support.
Seers are your default HQ choice, Warding is an auto include and then Doom and/or Guide (with Stones if you take both) are your default powers. Fortune is obviously an auto include if you are running a Council but is otherwise not massively helpful since Eldar infantry tends to die once its out in the open either way. Its definitely worth considering upgrading to Eldrad at 1750+ points.
Guardian Defenders are pretty terrible, BS3, basically no armour and Ld8. They get used in foot based lists because they at least bring a heavy weapon and you can get around some of the Ld issues with a Avatar. Storm Guardians on the other hand a pretty useful with 2 Flamers + Destructor Warlock out of a Serpent, they roast GEQ and do pretty well against MEQ by simply dumping wounds on them. Without a Serpent to put them in they are probably worse than Defenders though.
Banshees are ok, but not great in a competitive environment. Aside from the obvious issues that they are only S3 (so really need Doom) and also compete with Dragons for Elite slots they are still hamstrung by the lack of an assault transport. With the access point at the rear of a Serpent the lowish threat range combined with the inability to move, disembark and assault they are very difficult to get where you need them. It should go without saying that they need a Serpent, in the open they will just get shot off the table.
Vypers are ok, but generally don't see much use except to fill out points in mech lists. Walkers offer more firepower and surviability for the same cost and most of the time your points will be going into essentials like scoring units and anti tank units (i.e Dragons) first. The Hornet outclasses it completely if you can use Forgeworld stuff.
Wraithlords are ok in a foot based list, but far too slow for a mech list. They give you BS4 heavy weapons which don't stop firing until the model is completely gone, but do tend to just get deleted against a number of matchups (Venom Spam Dark Eldar being the most obvious one).
So basically to get a competitive mech army out of that (assuming this is 1750-2k) you still need 2-3 units of Dragons, more Serpents and some more stuff to fill your heavy slots (Prisms, Falcons, Night Spinners etc). To get a reasonable foot based list you need another Wraithlord (or 3 Walkers), probably the Avatar and a unit of Harlies (for a counter punch unit that can survive without a transport).
Hope this helps.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/06/05 15:31:27
Subject: Re:Starting Eldar [Advice Needed]
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Infiltrating Oniwaban
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I agree with a lot of what Powerguy has written, but given your parameters for not spending to expand your free army with expensive toys, you really can't go all mech. You don't really have the stuff for footdar either. So that leaves a hybrid.
I'd run something like this:
Eldrad (one Farseer counts as)
Farseer, (fortune, guide, stones)
8 Banshees incl exarch with executioner, warshout, acrobatic
10 Dire Avengers w exarch, power weapon, shimmershield, defend. wave serpent, w cannons
10 Dire Avengers w exarch, dual cats, bladestorm wave serpent w cannons
10 guardians, scatterlaser, warlock, spiritseer, embolden
10 guardians, scatterlaser, warlock, embolden
wraithlord, brightlance, EML
wraithlord, brightlance, EML
Falcon, EML, shuriken cannon, holofields
Vyper squadron 3x Vypers w/ shuriken cannons (x2)
That comes to around 2000 points (I'm not sure on the farseer points as I don't have a codex handy as I type this).
Guardians camp backfield objectives. Warlocks get embolden since you don't have the avatar to give them fearless. Wraithlord camp as well near the spiritseer so you don't have to roll for wraithsight. I put the avengers in the serpents, but you can move one over to the banshees. In this scheme I had the banshees in the backfield to work as counterassault. They're ok in this role as most opponents won't shoot at them early. They're not as good as harlies because they can be seen. I've got the Falcon operating strictly as a shooting platform in place of another lord or squadron of war walkers. With holofields it can be a bear to take down.
The serpents can zip around for the cover save and with fortune up they can be hard to take out too. I'd put the DAs in them along with Eldrad and the other farseer. The PW/Shimmershield squad can be an effective tarpit with defend and a re-rollable 4+/5++ from fortune, but they won't do much damage in return and will eventually run or get swept. The other squad is oriented towards shooting. Dumping them out, using guide, bladestorm and dooming their target (the full monte) can hurt most infantry units pretty hard (about 22 wounds against a t4 target).
The vypers are fast, but very fragile. Best to keep them well away from enemy shooting as even bolters can take them down. They can crack light transports and contest objectives in the late game.
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The Imperial Navy, A Galatic Force for Good. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/06/05 15:49:10
Subject: Re:Starting Eldar [Advice Needed]
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Sybarite Swinging an Agonizer
Charleston, SC
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With sixth edition right around the corner you might want to wait a month before you start putting any sort of a list together. The rumored changes to power weapons and psychic powers are going to mean that Howling Banshees and Farseers might be stuck with drastically different roles than they presently have. For example I've often seen Banshees being used to counter hard close-combat units like terminators, but if power weapons become AP3 this makes them useless against that particular enemy (unless Eldar power weapons are given a break.
That said; If you want to build a list focusing around 5th edition I highly suggest you go with some of the good advice offered above. I can't think of a lot I can add to it, but I will throw in that I feel a Farseer with Doom is almost mandatory. That single power is quite possibly one of the best force multipliers in the game and can turn mediocre units like Howling Banshees into killing machines.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/06/05 15:55:41
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/06/05 21:57:55
Subject: Starting Eldar [Advice Needed]
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Infiltrating Broodlord
New York
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Powerguy thanks very much for the breakdown but kinda left me hoping to see some list building options with what i own
however
thank you very much Arsch that was pretty useful and picked up right where powerguy left off so i'm keeping both of your advices in mind.
Seems like im closer to building a foot centered eldar army than a MECH eldar list any other suggestions on what units to get to fill out footdar?
Avatar, Warwalkers/Wraithlord, Harlies anythin else?
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1. Tyranids - 15,000 pts
2. Chaos Space Marines - 7,100 pts
3. Space Marines - 6,000 pts
4. Orks - 5,900 pts
5. Dark Angels - 4,300 pts
6. Necrons - 4,600 pts
7. Grey Knights - 3,200 pts
8. Eldar - 3,400 pts
9. Blood Angels - 3,200 pts
10. Chaos Daemons - 3,200 pts
11. Tau Empire - 3,000 pts
12. Space Wolves - 2,400 pts |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/06/05 22:01:32
Subject: Re:Starting Eldar [Advice Needed]
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Infiltrating Oniwaban
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There's a new thread on footdar where I posted my list I've been using and Reecius' list who made it into the top 16 at Adepticon.
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The Imperial Navy, A Galatic Force for Good. |
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