Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Just a couple of questions for those more experienced than I.

I'm looking for two things -

1) Something that I can base my Vampire Counts army with that resembles dead grass.

2) I don't really know how to explain it, but I'm looking for something that I can spray onto my models after I'm finished painting them that won't change the way the model looks AT ALL but which gives a final clear coat that will protect the model from general handling.

I normally use Citadel stuff, but I'm more than willing to use something better and/or cheaper from another company if anyone knows of anything.

Well you can use static grass that has the color of dead grass. Its best to mix a few colors into it to give it more depth. Also for a great clear coat testors dull coat works wonders. But I have seen people use a product called future. It will give a gloss coat that can be knocked off with a matt coat that is applied later.

I just ordered some static grass from GF9. Any more information on the Future product?

Dont think you can get future floor polish here, and youd still need matte varnish afterwards anyway.

Citadel purity seal is a good choice and easy to get so id stick with that.

Johnson's Klear i am pretty sure is available in the UK, or it may have been renamed into Pledge too.

Honestly, I would avoid Purity seal, lots and lots of people have noted particular frosting problems with it. Try to pick up Tamiya flat clear or testors dull coate.

there are a lot of variants in static grass that resemble dead grass. any matte varnish will do for the protection of your miniatures, and you can add some gloss coat to teeth, tongs, open mouths, eyes, open wounds etc.

What exactly is matte varnish, and what does matte mean? Is this the stuff that dulls down the colors?

Matte - flat
Satin - slight shine
Gloss - high shine
Testors Dullcote - very matte :p

Purity Seal will actually give a satin finish rather than a matte one but it's hardly noticable, the frosting issue is the main reason to keep away from it though.

Yeah Future polish is called Klear in the UK, i use it on my Parade boots so i get a nice high gloss sheen, beats bulling my boots lol!!
Yes Klear is gloss so you may need a matt varnish to finish, but on a sidenote it is very good stuff for cockpits and eye lenses.

Foxfyre wrote:Matte - flat
Satin - slight shine
Gloss - high shine
Testors Dullcote - very matte :p

Purity Seal will actually give a satin finish rather than a matte one but it's hardly noticable, the frosting issue is the main reason to keep away from it though.

What is the frosting issue?

I bought some satin stuff a few months ago from a german guy who didn't know how to explain in english what it was. I tried it on some test models and it was almost as though I sprayed some snow onto them. Is this the frosting issue?

pretty much that, the frosting is like spraying it with snow..

Does that happen a lot with satin finishes or something? Or are there lots of bad cans?

It's usually high humidity causing the varnish to dry as it covers the model. Just follow the instructions on the can and it should be fine.

I tend to use a satin varnish (Wattyl estapol spray, furniture I think works nicely though and doesn't yellow which is nice). Also whenever I use flock I apply it after the varnish. Not sure if it makes any difference, but just the way I've always done it. Sort of paranoid in a way that the varnish would sort of mess it up by spraying it over it.

Is the testors dull cote stuff available in the UK? I'm scared to use GW satin again with what happened the first time.

http://www.antenocitisworkshop.com/testors-dullcote-spray.html

http://www.firestormgames.co.uk/3302 <- out of stock

They're the only two sites I've found so far unfortunately.

I just ordered a can from Antenocitis. Thanks for the link!

So do most people only spray the dull coat or do you spray something else beforehand?

In order to represent dead grass I would have used dried tobacco from a cigarette. You can even burn it a little so that appears defiled by your vamps. It's free and easy to find...

You can get tons of different kinds of static grass and flock and whatnot from Woodland Scenics. They have several dark colors of static grass (Black / Browns and Yellow / browns) that would look like "dead" grass.

http://woodlandscenics.woodlandscenics.com/show/category/GroundCover

At $12.49, it might look expensive, but you'll get a lot for the money (945 cubic cm - almost one liter).

Ah, that's a good idea.

Also check out the field grass

http://woodlandscenics.woodlandscenics.com/show/category/FieldGrass

It's like static grass that is 2-3 inches long. It's really good for "tall" grass.

Dang, that's really tall.

Clear coats will always change the sheen levels of a paint job to match that of the clear applied.
GW paints are veryy matt finish, maybe every so slightly satin finish, definatly not gloss, glos will leave glare on a bunch of surfaces in the figure when held at nearly any angle.
I'm going to assume you want matt finish lacquer.
Cellulose lacquer would be best, applied by airbrush. If you have a local car panel and paint supply shop they may well do rattle cans of it, of at the worst could mix you up a custom can full.

If you want to avoid thinners and solvent paints, try liquitex acrylic products, they do a selection of varnish products. But none of the water based ones will provide the same degree of protection as cellulose will.
If applied correctly then it wont melt your paint work or your figure with its solvents; the trick is to do a 'tack' coat, which is a very dusty fine layer that dries almost on contact and allow that to tack up before going heavier.
I would avoid using a brush to apply any clear coat as it will likely leave brush marks (worse with gloss though) - definatly airbrush for the win and spray cans on a budget for premium quality finishes

edit; the frosting issue mentioned above is likely bad spray technique, or poor environment for spraying. If the humidity is too high, or the temperature is too low (or both) you can get what is known in the car painting trade as 'solvent popping' where the solvent is getting trapped inside the paint film before it all evaporated away, this can cause frosty area's or bleached lookin area's or even bubble up the paint. This only really occurs with solvent paints, and is illeviated by spraying inside a controlled environment (a spray booth xD ) for you'r mini's use a hair dryer to warm up the figures literally just before you plan to spray, do it somewhere dry and not freezing cold and your problems may well dissapear.
I

For good protection, I would recommend Testor's Glosscote (though, if you have an airbrush, Future applied straight is supposed to be great, and a lot of vehicle modelers swear by it).

After that, a GOOD matte varnish like Testor's Dullcote will knock back down the shine (and you can apply Future or any gloss varnish) to get back a shiny/wet look on any parts desired. As aways, pay attention to humidity, and don't varnish clear pieces like windows (though Future makes those look thinner, and clearer, through some magical process).

The gloss varnish is a more protective 'shell' than the matte, so it's important to apply first. Of course, if you have slimy, wet models, like Nurglings, you could just stop there!

I'll definitely have slimy parts on stuff like zombies. I just got the dullcote but do multiple coats of different types not function differently? I mean, will a gloss coat first make the dull coat look weird?

no it wont.. You will be putting the gloss coat over the parts you want to retain the gloss coat after you dullcoat the model..