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So I've got 2k of grey knights already, it's a mixed list of razorback spam and terminators all led by an Inquisitor. So far its been pretty successful, the cheap HQ allowing me to field 1 more squad than I would otherwise. However I'd like to play around with the HQ choices a bit more and so I'm going to build a grand master and a librarian for a bit of variety, and to stop my friends getting to used to my list

However I've been having problems trying to get a well rounded list at 1000 points with these guys. This is what I have so far:


HQ - 215

Librarian - Master Crafted Nemesis Warding Stave, Digital Weapons, Quicksilver, Warp Rift, Might of Titan, Sanctuary, - 215pts

The master crafting and digi weps are extra to how I planned to set him up but I had points left over, the stave may seem a bit pricey but according to the most recent FAQ he gets the 2++ save in combat against everything including wounds not caused by the combat, so long as hes in it (ie 2++ against perils). He'll be attached to the terminator squad.

Troops - 515

5 man Terminator squad - Psycannon, 2 swords, 2 halberds, 1 demonhammer, psybolt - 245pts

Pretty standard termie squad set up, I wanted to run another squad (dropping psybolt on both so 225pts each) but couldn't make the points work out. The psybolt was only as I had 20pts to spare.

5 man strike squad - psycannon. w. razorback, psybolt ammo - 160pts

A bit of mobility here and extra fire power, good for locking down part of the board.

5 man strike squad - psycannon - 110pts

Ideally these guys would have a razorback too, but couldn't find the points.

Heavy Support - 270

Dreadnought - 2 x Twin-Linked Autocannon, Psybolt Ammunition - 135pts

Dreadnought - 2 x Twin-Linked Autocannon, Psybolt Ammunition - 135pts

Pretty Standard GK heavy support, very nasty, especially now I can glance everything to death, not sure of their durability in 6th ed.


Total - 1000

I also have a Grand Master to switch out with the libby with the following loadout:


Grand Master - Master Crafted Nemesis Force Sword, rad grenades, digital weapons, blind grenades - 205pts



Any input would be appreciated, I'm also aware that there's no anti-air, but atm none of the people I play have fliers.

Might want to double check the wording on Perils of the Warp, from what I read if you Perils you just take a wound... no saves of any kind.

You don't get armour against perils, but you do get invulnerable saves, though if you pass your invulnerable you have to re-roll it (only once, but its very annoying making the first one and failing the second). Hence a 2++ would be immensely handy.

Corinthius wrote:You don't get armour against perils, but you do get invulnerable saves, though if you pass your invulnerable you have to re-roll it (only once, but its very annoying making the first one and failing the second). Hence a 2++ would be immensely handy.

I'm pretty sure that was 5th edition.

Has that changed for 6th? I thought it was still the same, if anyone has the new rulebook to hand could you clarify what happens with PotW? I've gone and lent mine to someone

Stoffer wrote:

Corinthius wrote:You don't get armour against perils, but you do get invulnerable saves, though if you pass your invulnerable you have to re-roll it (only once, but its very annoying making the first one and failing the second). Hence a 2++ would be immensely handy.

I'm pretty sure that was 5th edition.

Indeed, now you simply take a wound, no saves allowed, plus the 2++ from the warding stave is only against Close combat attacks.

Actually it says you get saves against all wounds taken while in close combat, rather than from close combat. This was clarified in the FAQ which says:

Q: Can the save granted by a Nemesis warding stave be taken against all Wounds suffered whilst the wielder is engaged in close combat and not only against Wounds caused by close combat attacks? (p54)

A: Yes.

Does the rulebook say specifically that you don't get invulnerable saves? "No saves allowed" usually means no armour saves, unless they say "no saves of any kind".

Corinthius wrote:Actually it says you get saves against all wounds taken while in close combat, rather than from close combat. This was clarified in the FAQ which says:

Q: Can the save granted by a Nemesis warding stave be taken against all Wounds suffered whilst the wielder is engaged in close combat and not only against Wounds caused by close combat attacks? (p54)

A: Yes.

Does the rulebook say specifically that you don't get invulnerable saves? "No saves allowed" usually means no armour saves, unless they say "no saves of any kind".

Yes it does.... that is why i said it.

Damn, will have to rethink his equipment then.

Here's a list I would use at 1k

Ordo Malleus Inquisiter- Terminator Armor, Psychic Mastery lv 1 Hammer Hand Force Sword 90 pts

Terminator Squad- Psycannon/Sword, 3x Sword, Daemon Hammer 225 pts
Terminator Squad- Psycannon/Sword, 3x Sword, Daemon Hammer 225 pts
Terminator Squad- Psycannon/Sword, 3x Sword, Daemon Hammer 225 pts

Nemisis DreadKnight- Heavy Incinerater, Personal Telaporter 235 pts

It has 3 Scoring Units, A cheap Hq, and a beast of a heavy support assualt unit that can last minit contest an objective with its 30 inch shunt move

Better off giving the Inquisitor a Psycannon I think.

Like I said in the OP, I'm already running an Inquisitor (termie armour, psycannon) but want to try out some of the other HQ options, so want to try the GM or Libby. Just can't seem to make the points work out, though maybe they'd be better at 1500?

To chime in; in 6th edition 'perils of the warp' does not allow a save of any kind (explicitly including invulnerable) so you wouldn't be able to use the stave for that anymore for that though you can still use it for any other type of wound your librarian would suffer while in close combat.

As for my favourite HQ for a 1000 point list? Cortez. Certain henchmen (crusaders, death cult assassins, heavy weapons servitors, and psykers mainly) are pretty brutal in a lower point game. The more conventional grey knight troop choices tend to run into 'cost a ton for their board presence and survivability' i've found.

Slightly reworked the list to get in more termies (will be combat squaded), thinking they are going to be much more of a threat in 6th, and if the libbys squad is getting torn up he can always move and join the other squad. Still not entirely sure about his loadout, I was going to take the stave out but then thought it could be super handy in challenges (as lots of squad leaders have something the EQ of a powerfist) so might stop him being instakilled, still not sure though.

HQ - 215

Librarian - Master Crafted Nemesis Warding Stave, Digital Weapons, Quicksilver, Warp Rift, Might of Titan, Sanctuary, - 215pts

Troops - 650

10 man Terminator squad - 2 Psycannons, 4 swords, 4 halberds, 2 demonhammers, psybolt - 470pts

5 man strike squad - psycannon, psybolt ammo. w. razorback, psybolt ammo - 180pts

Heavy Support - 135

Dreadnought - 2 x Twin-Linked Autocannon, Psybolt Ammunition - 135pts

1000pts on the nose

I do not deny that terminators are a bit more survivable in 6th (especially against other gray knights, hehe) but you are definately suffering from a lack of too many ways to control the board. Your opponents will probably just focus-fire on your terminator combat squad + librarian as they slowly work their way up (or wherever you deepstrike them into) and that will likely be that long before you get within 24 inches of anything.

The one psyfleman dread is bound to be an MVP, but is it and the razorback really enough long-ranged fire?

I wonder if you could fit a reasonably cheap ordo malleus inquisitor in a terminator suit with a psycannon and a chimera for your Librarian and (reduced) terminator squad to hitch a ride in? Would likely get them where you want them even if the chimera eats it after a turn or two. Costs a reasonable amount less than the full 10 man squad but has just about the same amount of shooting and melee presence.

From there you could probably take another dread maybe? Especially if you drop the warding stave, 40 points is a lot for something that only functions in close combat which if your opponent is on the ball will be very difficult to stick your librarian into.

I could go with something like:

HQ

Librarian - Nemesis Warding Stave, Warp Rift, Might of Titan, Sanctuary - 200pts

Ordo Malleus Inquisitor - terminator armour, psycannon, nemesis deamonhammer - 80pts

Troops

5 man Terminator squad - Psycannon, 2 swords, 2 halberds, 1 demonhammer - 225pts

5 man Terminator squad - Psycannon, 2 swords, 2 halberds, 1 demonhammer - 225pts


Heavy support

Dreadnought - 2 x Twin-Linked Autocannon, Psybolt Ammunition - 135pts

Dreadnought - 2 x Twin-Linked Autocannon, Psybolt Ammunition - 135pts

Total - 1000pts

I'd like the chimera, but am worried the henchmen squad I'd have to take would just be wasted points as they'd all die as soon as anyone looked at them funny. That would be 76pts minimum for the henchmen and chimera with the models I have.

where the problem lies here is in the modal count.

8 modals worked at 1000pt when you where rolling pallys (ish), but now you have one wound terminators that rely on melee to put down your opponents. three psycannons and 2 psy dreads won't be enough to cover the shooting.

each wound is going to be very painful. vendetta spam, crons, fateweaver, mind war, true born venom spam or a biomancy flyrant will give you a hard time. heck a spam of henchmen out of the same codex will cause you problems.

i respect the idea of terminators strong-arming the battle field. and i think it can be done, but at 1000pt you spread yourself way to thin.

Hmm. Have you considered some acolyte henchmen? 3 of them by themselves (sans upgrades) counts as a henchman band, and only costs 12 points. They'd be functionally useless as anything other than a mild distraction or possibly contesting something for a turn, but at least that way you save yourself 60 points or so on a proper band.

Failing that, a small group of death cult assassins and/or crusaders are a scary assault/counter-assault unit in it's own right, but that sort of wanders away from your focus a bit.

Like I said in the last post with the models I have a 3 man henchmen squad and chimera would be 76pts. I think I might leave the GM and libby for bigger games, more like 2k, as they just eat up too many points so I have to lose a whole squad for 1 of them, and I can't seem to get a good balance with the remaining points.