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I always thought it pathetic that 38,000 years in the future humans are still dumb as rocks, fight each other, hold onto dogma, etc. If I time traveled to the year 40,000 and people were still doing that crap I'd either want to live on a moon solo or join some alien culture.

That's kind of the point of the setting. In 40k we've gone through periods of enlightenment and dark ages back and forth over and over, and 40k itself takes place at one of those dark ages. The time just prior to the Horus Heresy is far more enlightened and forward-thinking.

60mm wrote:I always thought it pathetic that 38,000 years in the future humans are still dumb as rocks, fight each other, hold onto dogma, etc. If I time traveled to the year 40,000 and people were still doing that crap I'd either want to live on a moon solo or join some alien culture.

What I hate about the Imperium: Imperial Human Resources. The kind of waste the Terran Admin allows ... just awful.


BTW: Humans are *born* dumb as rocks and need education. Even with education being free in societies, there's still dumb-asses, murderers, ignoramuses, thieves, etc.

Dude, the Star Trek ideal of the Federation's model will *never* happen.

As for alien cultures? Remember, the fluff has the eldar indulging in self gratification so furiously that they created the god of sleaze in a suicidal/genocidal frenzy.

Tau? Paint 'em red and put hammers and sickles on the iconography.

Necrons? I won't comment on them; Ward just frakked them up too much to make sense out of 'em.

Orks? Now *they* make sense. Their society is based on the only model we have to go on: Nature. Survival of the Strongest/Fittest. Bugs, too.

Also, I'm betting that the imperium isn't big on cartoons. Ya gotta have some Bugs Bunny in your life.

[ChaosLordSpeak] It's the vanilla everything. Its sooooo repetitive. Vanilla marines, Grey "cheese" Knights, Black Templars who continuously crusade, but never bother to be different, Dark Angels who are supposedly secretive and yet tell all players everything there is to know about themselves. Even the Blood Angels are just space-vampires!
Then there's the guard: Brave, tough warriors. Standing against all odds. Seriously? BORING!! [/End ChaosLordSpeak]

But really, the imperium is soo boring, repetitive and overused.
Almost everything is about them, fluff-wise and in GW stores.
A lot of them don't even have any particular flavour (Either you're a power-armoured high-horsed posh-speaking selfless defender of humanity, or you're a faceless man among billions, who spend every waking moment getting beaten to death by xenos. And whenever you finally succeed, the glory gets stolen by some vanilla marine with too many lascannons.

I like to have something with real flavour, like CSM's.

Brothererekose wrote:Orks? Now *they* make sense. Their society is based on the only model we have to go on: Nature. Survival of the Strongest/Fittest.

Yeah, but nature has no idea how to gather fossil fuels and develop internal combustion. Orks are best enjoyed with a minimal amount of thinking. There's nothing about them that makes sense. But that's kind of the best part.

We have not changed in 200, 000 years, what is another 40,000? Personally I find the back story of the Imperium to be much more interesting (and believable) than a Star Trek like utopia.

60mm wrote:I always thought it pathetic that 38,000 years in the future humans are still dumb as rocks, fight each other, hold onto dogma, etc. If I time traveled to the year 40,000 and people were still doing that crap I'd either want to live on a moon solo or join some alien culture.

The 40k universe is one where basically we *almost* got the the point where we were all enlightened, and then it got sod all to hell by *something*, and then just as we had a real chance to do it again as the Emperor rose and began the Great Crusade...Chaos.

Human history is rather consistent. We've been around for 100,000-300,000 years or so, but only had any sort of records and permanent settlements for a tiny fraction of that timespan (~5,000 years), and while we've accomplished much since then, it wasn't until the very real threat of outright assured annihilation within minutes that we really ceased large scale conflict, we we still kill each other by the tens of thousands every day. Expecting the far future to be significantly different is a wee bit naieve.

That is the point of 40k, Quite frankly its scary, the fact the human will fall back on what makes them comfortable is scary, the fact the humans do thing progress is bad is worse.
What makes it scary is the fact humans are doing alot of this stuff now and wwe can see it happening.

Vaktathi wrote:

60mm wrote:I always thought it pathetic that 38,000 years in the future humans are still dumb as rocks, fight each other, hold onto dogma, etc. If I time traveled to the year 40,000 and people were still doing that crap I'd either want to live on a moon solo or join some alien culture.

The 40k universe is one where basically we *almost* got the the point where we were all enlightened, and then it got sod all to hell by *something*, and then just as we had a real chance to do it again as the Emperor rose and began the Great Crusade...Chaos.

Human history is rather consistent. We've been around for 100,000-300,000 years or so, but only had any sort of records and permanent settlements for a tiny fraction of that timespan (~5,000 years), and while we've accomplished much since then, it wasn't until the very real threat of outright assured annihilation within minutes that we really ceased large scale conflict, we we still kill each other by the tens of thousands every day. Expecting the far future to be significantly different is a wee bit naieve.

I would not say that we have ceased large scale conflict. We are just taking a breather. After the Napoleonic Wars, it was thought that major conflict was extinct. The 20th century proved otherwise.

I like the Imperium.

I hate the Imperium because the last time I asked a Sister of Battle for a backrub, she started yelling some nonsense about heresy or whatever. Then she dragged me into some weird room where weird people with freaky, hideous implants shoved pokey things into my scales while asking me things. Stupid things, like where I came from and what I was doing there and were there any more like me.

So naturally I just turned off my pain receptors and had a nap. When I came to, I was back with my Master, who explained that he had to liberate me from them while they were dissecting me - apparently they thought I was dead or something, I dunno - and then he used nannites on me. He did mention that my insides were really gross, which was new information for me, since I had no idea what I looked like on the inside.

All in all, it was just an unpleasant experience. Maybe the rest of them are better. I dunno, and I don't really care to.

What i dislike about the the imperium huh? well let me start with the fact they are the imperium...

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Gue%27vesa_Auxiliaries#.T_ej_pFQTUp

I'd probably be one of these

The Imperium is probably a pretty good crystal ball into the future judging from human nature we can see today. People are superstitious, crazy, aggressive, and generally pretty stupid. The Imperium is basically a science fiction version of history, so it's pretty well grounded in actual human nature and thus pretty plausible.

GW has actually done something quite interesting with 40k. Its mearly a logical extension of mankinds history.

Do you really think that some sort of Utopia will ever be developed? One that includes other Alien races?


The point is that mankind's every inclination is self-centered. Sure, people can do good things and control it. But the chance of everyone doing it at the same time for the rest of time is a number approaching zero.

Lets add in other sentient races to the equation. Whats the possability they are any different?

Grey Templar wrote:The point is that mankind's every inclination is self-centered. Sure, people can do good things and control it. But the chance of everyone doing it at the same time for the rest of time is a number approaching zero.

Lets add in other sentient races to the equation. Whats the possability they are any different?

I have no idea. Do you?

TedNugent wrote:
The Imperium is probably a pretty good crystal ball into the future judging from human nature we can see today. People are superstitious, crazy, aggressive, and generally pretty stupid. The Imperium is basically a science fiction version of history, so it's pretty well grounded in actual human nature and thus pretty plausible.

I'd say it's human nature cranked up to 11. It's so exaggerated and frankly pretty silly. It's honestly not too different from Judge Dredd/2000 AD, which was one of the earlier influences on the game. People are superstitious, but in 40k they say a prayer before reloading their gun. Then again, some of this superstition is true in 40k, where if you do scribble a Chaos star on the back of your textbook tentacles will come out and rip your face off before ripping you away into a dimension of pure evil space cocaine. Stuff like that.

TedNugent wrote:http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Gue%27vesa_Auxiliaries#.T_ej_pFQTUp

I'd probably be one of these

The Imperium is probably a pretty good crystal ball into the future judging from human nature we can see today. People are superstitious, crazy, aggressive, and generally pretty stupid. The Imperium is basically a science fiction version of history, so it's pretty well grounded in actual human nature and thus pretty plausible.

Well, the Imperium mostly became the way it is due to Chaos messing everything up, so we probably will never have anything like it in the real world IMO.

DOOMBREAD wrote:

TedNugent wrote:http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Gue%27vesa_Auxiliaries#.T_ej_pFQTUp

I'd probably be one of these

The Imperium is probably a pretty good crystal ball into the future judging from human nature we can see today. People are superstitious, crazy, aggressive, and generally pretty stupid. The Imperium is basically a science fiction version of history, so it's pretty well grounded in actual human nature and thus pretty plausible.

Well, the Imperium mostly became the way it is due to Chaos messing everything up, so we probably will never have anything like it in the real world IMO.

We don't need Chaos to mess stuff up. We can do it just fine on our own, hence the Dark Age of Technology and the Age of Strife.

Why do I dislike the Imperium? Because it is a pale shadow of the glory that Guilliman and the Emperor envisioned, unlike the 500 worlds of Ultramar.

[ducks for cover]

Wow, people took that seriously! Just to clarify, I think mankind is fully capable of still being the way we are or worse in 38,000 years. Not saying it's unrealistic. I'm just saying that if an intelligent race spent 38,000 years after discovering quantum physics and the workings of life itself just getting more violent and dogmatic, I couldn't defend them. Mankind in the 40k universe, imo, deserves to get wiped clean. Again, just my thoughts!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wow, people took that seriously! Just to clarify, I think mankind is fully capable of still being the way we are or worse in 38,000 years. Not saying it's unrealistic. I'm just saying that if an intelligent race spent 38,000 years after discovering quantum physics and the workings of life itself just getting more violent and dogmatic, I couldn't defend them. Mankind in the 40k universe, imo, deserves to get wiped clean. Again, just my thoughts!

TedNugent wrote:http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Gue%27vesa_Auxiliaries#.T_ej_pFQTUp

I'd probably be one of these

The Imperium is probably a pretty good crystal ball into the future judging from human nature we can see today. People are superstitious, crazy, aggressive, and generally pretty stupid. The Imperium is basically a science fiction version of history, so it's pretty well grounded in actual human nature and thus pretty plausible.

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Commissar

I would probably be one of these.

Grey Templar wrote:The point is that mankind's every inclination is self-centered. Sure, people can do good things and control it. But the chance of everyone doing it at the same time for the rest of time is a number approaching zero.

Actually I'd say that number is 1, I think that the universe has infinite time so sooner or later by sheer freekin coincidence everyone would do something nice simultaneously and the universe itself would implode with disbelief....

Grey Templar wrote:Lets add in other sentient races to the equation. Whats the possability they are any different?

I wouldn't even want to guess at this point but I suppose it would be the above idea multiplied by the number of alien races....


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Basically what I mean by that is well... it's the cause of the end of the universe.... universal peace = universal cease....