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Trying to build a really cheesy list for a big tournament coming up.

Primary Detachment--Guard
Company Command w/ 4 plasma guns
Meltavets in Chimera
Infantry Platoon
-Command w/ Autocannon
-Infantry Squad w/ Autocannon and grenade launcher
-Infantry Squad w/ Autocannon and grenade launcher
-Hvy Weapons w/ 3 Autocannon
-Hvy Weapons w/ 3 Autocannon
-Hvy Weapons w/ 3 Missile Launchers

Manticore 160
Executioner 190
Demolisher 165

Allied Detachment--Grey Knights

Coteaz (Pyromancy) 100
6 Psykers 60
Dreadknight w/ Teleporter, Incinerator 235
10 Purifiers w/ 4 psycannon, 2 halberds, 1 hammer 279



Fortification: Bastion with Quad Cannon (125)


Total:
1999 Points

This is a static gunline with forward assault elements, forcing the enemy to make tough decisions about which target to shoot, with enough AP 1/2 to take down the Terminator lists that I already know I'll be seeing plenty of (at least 3 deathwing players at the tournament I'm practicing for). Coteaz will be swapping his (situationally useless) psychic powers for the Pyromancy discipline or perhaps a roll on Divination as well. Hoping for Molten Beam since it's so freaking awesome and will even shoot down flyers. Generally speaking he and the Purifiers will team up and shoot the hell out of anything that comes in from reserve. There are enough Psycannon shots coming from that unit to even take down zooming flyers as long as I don't roll terribly. Meltavets will range up slightly ahead of the main line along with the demolisher to saturate approaches. Psyker squad holes up in the Bastion with their witchyness coming out of a fire point at S8 AP1. The Dreadknight will normally range ahead with its teleporter shunt on turn 1 and hose down a vulnerable unit with the Incinerator, typically after most of my units have already fired so that it picks off anything hiding in craters or ruins, or clear out a bastion of any offending infantry. The Executioner is on Terminator Patrol, and if my opponent fails to have anything similar, it will just spam its 3 turret shots at whatever vehicle/infantry it pleases.

It looks okay to me, just do not over heat the plasma cannons on the Executioner, it will glance itself to death.

Plasma beats melta this edition. You could go vets with 3x plas 1x auto cannon in a chimera with hb and stubber for mass str 4-7 within 24-48" take primaris with a pbs to lower ld to 1 and then make em take 3d6 worth of no armor save auto hits for however much they fail by. Take harker to outflank and destroy annoying heavy infantry. Id say whatever to gk and take a sm libby for the nullzone make wraiths cry.

riverhawks32 wrote:It looks okay to me, just do not over heat the plasma cannons on the Executioner, it will glance itself to death.

Executioners main gun does not have the "gets hot" rule. Only the Plasma Sponsons do. His list doesn't include the sponsons.

I'm sorry, this list is kind of bad. You have nothing that can claim objectives in the middle of the table, and your missing some key things that both IG and GK do....I mean come on where are your psydreads, where are your psybacks, where are your vendettas?

You want a cheese IG/GK combo....try this on for size: http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2012/07/nova-list-2/

That list is just a 5th Ed list with allies. Sigh.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Meaning stelek's

I agree, I have a lot of issue with Stelek's list. But I'd be much more affraid his than the OP.

darwinn69 wrote:I'm sorry, this list is kind of bad. You have nothing that can claim objectives in the middle of the table, and your missing some key things that both IG and GK do....I mean come on where are your psydreads, where are your psybacks, where are your vendettas?

You want a cheese IG/GK combo....try this on for size: http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2012/07/nova-list-2/

You don't need the psydreads, the psybacks, or the vendettas to win. Just the other day I saw the most insane Guard list, no fliers and had the rarely used units. Won 5/5 games against the top tier armies. I don't think the list is bad, just not hyper focused on objective play (aggressive objective play that is).

darwinn69 wrote:I'm sorry, this list is kind of bad. You have nothing that can claim objectives in the middle of the table, and your missing some key things that both IG and GK do....I mean come on where are your psydreads, where are your psybacks, where are your vendettas?

You want a cheese IG/GK combo....try this on for size: http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2012/07/nova-list-2/

That list is pretty "meh" to me. It's just a bunch of melta guns with BS3. Lots of objective grabbing, but that doesn't matter if they've served up enough super fragile kill points. The only point I agree with is that I don't have a lot to claim middle field objectives. Instead, I aim to kill everything that the enemy would be sending to claim those same objectives. My play style has always focused on killing first and foremost, which is good because the tournament uses a combination of Kill points and objectives to decide the winner in every game. To address a point someone else made, the Executioner plasma cannon doesn't have the Gets Hot rule, so no worrying about glancing myself

As for the whole "Vendettas or GTFO" thing, I don't think they have the same punch anymore. Their big thing last edition was scouting up and dropping meltas on your face on turn 1. This edition they have to start in reserves so I wont see it til turn 2 or 3, and by then most of their army should be dead. And there will be a big bubble around Coteaz that a Vendetta can't dare enter when it comes in, less it wants a face full of psycannon. Then there's the quad-cannon on the bastion, and I think that gives me enough anti-air for those. I'd have taken a Hydra, but they don't have Interceptor so they're no good against ground units anymore.


@michaelcycle: Those are pretty good ideas but what would you suggest I take out of the list to pay for all that?

I love my psykers bossfearless but 1 unit won't cut it due to the significant unreliability of a single unit. It only has a 30ish % chance of doing anything in a turn. That's why I run 3 of them to bump the % up to 70ish.

Perhaps swop them for 3 plasma cannon servitors for Coteaz to babysit? That's what I would use if I were to have a Bastion. Plus I'd try to squeeze in a naked acolyte with that servitor unit to man one of the emplaced Heavy Bolters.

Finally, you have no searchlights which cuts out a turn of firing.

I was going to go through your list and explain in detail, but I realized that would take way too long. So I'll just give you some general pointers:
1. Don't rely on HW teams to live, and even with orders don't expect them to do much. LD7 and Instant Death will screw you, and BS3 ain't going to cut it unless you really saturate them...this is far from saturation.
2. Buildings can and do get destroyed. It sucks when your entire army is trying to get a 4+ save suddenly has to take falling damage. Or don't and just build the army to be resiliant enough that a 5+ cover is enough.
3. A single T7 W2 model is not going to stop flyers, if its a flyer heavy army it's going to die.
4. Vendettas are for their three twin linked lascannons, their transport is just gravy. It doesn't have to get anywhere near Coteaz to do its job.
5. For god sakes give purifiers a transport. 10 marines die when they are on foot, expecally high priority targets like them who are your only real threat moving forward. Frankly your probably better off with Terminators.
6. How many meltas and plasmas are people packing now a days? You expect that dreadknight to live how long? It's not like their is any place for him to hide.
7. More dudes....alot more dudes.


All I can say is get some games in against good players with good lists and start from their.

Blaggard wrote:

riverhawks32 wrote:It looks okay to me, just do not over heat the plasma cannons on the Executioner, it will glance itself to death.

Executioners main gun does not have the "gets hot" rule. Only the Plasma Sponsons do. His list doesn't include the sponsons.

Hey, its 40k. I'd take the sponsons and if the Executioner goes down, it will be a laugh.

Sethorly wrote:I love my psykers bossfearless but 1 unit won't cut it due to the significant unreliability of a single unit. It only has a 30ish % chance of doing anything in a turn. That's why I run 3 of them to bump the % up to 70ish.

Perhaps swop them for 3 plasma cannon servitors for Coteaz to babysit? That's what I would use if I were to have a Bastion. Plus I'd try to squeeze in a naked acolyte with that servitor unit to man one of the emplaced Heavy Bolters.

I went with 1 squad of Psykers because I was out of points to do anything more significant. The squad is only 60 points, is scoring, and has a chance at firing a S8 AP1 large blast weapon. No, it's not great, but if I stick em in the Bastion they should be safe-ish from enemy shooting. Also, don't own any plasma cannon servitors and I think the Executioner will have the plasma spam niche in my army covered. I can't think of something that would work better for the points but I'm sure it exists.


@darwinn69: Well, let's look at it one thing at a time since you seem to have taken offense at the concept of my army.
1: The Hvy Weapon Teams are not there to be amazing powerhouses, they're there to spam autocannon shots and camp out in cover.
2: Yes, yes they do. But if they're concentrating on the Bastion then they aren't focusing on the bigger threats in the list.
3: A single model wont stop an entire army? I'm shocked. Yes, the idea of a total flyer spam army is probably my biggest weakness, but every army has one and just harping on it over and over doesn't change things.
4: Don't own a Vendetta, and even if I did they don't have the Interceptor rule which is a poor imitation of Coteaz's rule. I'm not taking Coteaz for magical anti-air, I'm taking him for outflank/deepstrike-denial, rerolls to sieze the initiative, a cheap effective troops unit, 2 psychic powers a turn, the list goes on since he's such a good value and the 2nd cheapest HQ option available to the GK.
5: No extra points to put the purifiers in a transport, and they're not moving forward anyway. You seem to have mistaken my play style for another where a shooting unit walks up the middle of the board instead of sitting still and shooting.
6: The Dreadknight is not meant to live, he's meant to sell his life dearly. His superior maneuverability granted by the teleporter allows him to dally outside the range of meltas and yes, you actually *can* hide him if you're in a city (which local tournaments tend to favor). The DK is there to present a target that can't be ignored, forcing the enemy to split off a chunk of their force to deal with it.
7: I already have a bunch of dudes on the table, and most of them are already peons. Adding "a lot more dudes" will force me to sacrifice my decent units to spend the points on useless bodies. There are only a few places where I'm considering cutting an expensive unit for something more numerous, but it won't be used to field more generic dudes. Got enough of those.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So I just glanced over the roster for the tournament as it stands right now. The field is mostly marines of various sorts. Out of the 50 or so people already entered there are 5 IG armies and 3 Necron armies. Given that it's only 2000 points I doubt I can expect to see more than 3 Vendettas in an IG list (more likely a bunch of footsloggers with one flyer is what I expect) and of the Necrons I would expect only one of the 3 to be a Scythe list, since most necron players I know built their current armies based on their old footslogging lists from 4th/5th. So there'll probably be one guy who built his list off the internet with a bunch of scythes.

Tl;Dr There are probably only 2 players in the tournament who will be running an actual air force list, and it's pure happenstance if I will even play them. But then, there's still a couple months to go until then so who knows, I could have to tailor to beat a bunch of flyers.