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Space Marines
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155 Captain Plasma Pistol, Power Sword, Artificer Armor, Digital Weapons
100 Librarian Null Zone, Avenger

135 Dreadnought Twin Linked Lascannon, Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon w/Storm Bolter
135 Dreadnought Twin Linked Lascannon, Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon w/Storm Bolter
125 Dreadnought Assault Cannon, Dreadnought Close Combat Weapon w/Heavy Flamer

205 10 Tactical Marines x7 Bolters, Multi-Melta, Melta Gun, Sergeant w/Power Weapon, Plasma Pistol
35 Rhino ***Dedicated Transport***
180 10 Tactical Marines x7 Bolters, Lascannon, Flamer, Sergeant w/CC Weapon, Bolt Pistol
35 Rhino ***Dedicated Transport***
180 10 Tactical Marines x7 Bolters, Lascannon, Flamer, Sergeant w/ CC Weapon, Bolt Pistol
35 Rhino ***Dedicated Transport***
220 10 Tactical Marines x7 Bolters, Missile Launcher, Melta Gun, Sergeant w/Powerfist, Combi-Melta
***Deployed in LandRaider****

125 Vindicator HK Missile
85 Whilrwind -
250 Land Raider -

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So, I updated my marines for 6th ed. I took out Lysander, Termie Chaplain and 10 Terminators, and added a Captain and Librarian, a 3rd Dreadnought, and 2 More Tactical Squads with varied loadouts. The final result was very enjoyable. I forgot how much fun 5 attacks on a charge were, plus having 40 tactical marines means 10 -20 can be expendable and relied upon to actually fight.

What'dya think?


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1st game: (4th game of 6th ed)
I played a game against a Legion of the Damned Army (3 squads of 10 Legion of the Damned, each with Plasmagun, Multi-Melta, Powerfist and Meltabombs, with some small squads in Razorbacks and Tigurius), and won pretty hard with a Big Guns Never Tire, Dawn of War game. I had an advantage having heavy scoring units, though he did pop 2 of them, but overall all he did was tarpit half of my army in a corner, while the other half was free to take and hold 3 objectives. Not a very ideal lineup for him (great for me), but overall the game made me feel more confident with my list. the Score was 12-3, after holding 3 primary and all 3 secondary objectives (He got 2 heavies and linebreaker).

Drop the pistol and PW for a fist, give each squad a fist. Fist and combi-weapon always goes down well nowadays, since RF is so much more useful and Fists are made even more annoyingly useful.

Be wary about the placement of that 49 point sergeant, though.

If you're taking those marines, have you considered Assault termies? I mean, they aren't always the best, but now they get their 2+ save most of the time. the 3++ doesn't hurt.

This list is actually very similar to mine. Excpet I run Vulkan and Predators in place of libby, cap'n and dreads.

Well, I should be clear the power weapon is a power axe (as modeled on the Veteran model I use as the sergeant) so S6 ap2 Unwieldly is pretty good as I get a bonus attack, vs a powerfist. I could care less about assaulting tanks as they're far more flimsy and I already bring 6 Lascannons (4 of which are twin linked), not to mention a meltagun/Multimelta squad, and 3 dreadnought CCW's.

I wouldn't mind giving each squad a Fist, but I felt I wanted long range firepower first and foremost, so I figured the 2 squads who would probably stand back and snipe could afford not having a PF. plus, If I am assaulted by an Ironclad Dreadnought, I can still claim "My weapons are useless!" and fail my Leadership.

Just out of curiosity, what extra usefulness do you see Powerfists having with 6th ed? The Trade off between A Powerfist and a Poweraxe is 2 strength, vs 1 bonus attack.

I have played with terminators a lot (My old list had Lysander, Termie Chaplain, and 10 Terminators w/ 2 Cyclone MIssile Launchers), but it gets old having such a chunk of my army being terminators. I really like having 4 solid scoring units I can go beat face with. So, the whole point of this list is 1) No terminators!

I guess a fun option for Sargeants would be the option of ONLY a Combi-Plasma, for extra shooty squads. That way, its less expensive and you can benefit from more shots.

I am not sure fists are that great anymore, we'll have to see, I think it will depend on challenges.

Whirlwind still doesn't do it for me.
The landraider is expensive and doesn't do enough for your list.
I think 2TLautocannon dreads are actually better than before and are reasonable antiflyer duties, which you currently lack.
Stormtalons are hard to hit at the moment.
The captain doesn't do much for you.

As such I would add 2 vindis, telion and some scouts, 2 stormtalons, change dreads to 2TLautocannon keeping one with lascannon just in case. Dropping raider, captain and the loose tactical squad.

The transport capabilities of an LR is wasted if a weakly Tactical is transported.

Alll c&c is welcome, and duly noted. I must say, I like AP2 on the Lascannons, plus Twin-Linked makes Snapfire @ Flyers not SOO bad ...

The Captain is quite survivable and helps keep my Librarian alive by being a beefier target (challenges are great for avoiding scary weapons in assaults). I feel bad for my captain - I purchased the plastic kit and magnetized his arms, painted him up all pretty, and he's sat on the shelf in lieu of shinier HQ's - Lysander, Terminator Chaplain, etc. I want to see what sort of mileage I can get out of him. Yes, I could Drop the 10 Tactical Marines for Say, 5 terminators, but I'm tired of my Termies for now. I can put them back in later and see how I like the difference.

I do feel like I could survive on 3 Scoring Units, however I really like 4 and the Landraider is still a Landraider, and it seems as good as anything to put a scoring unit inside if simply for protection until needed. Squishy? Sometimes. A firetarget? Always. Fun to use? Oooh yeah.

I guess this list for me is what I really enjoy playing with, and right now with my meta at the FLGS, this works pretty well. If I pickup some new models (Storm Talons, for instance), I might add some in, but it's fun to use a whirlwind for the simple reason my opponent says "You're using a WHIRLWIND?!!!???"

More Vindicators? Maybe, if had them.

Mate, you're making a mistake here. You're asking for our assistance then ignoring it. I know it seems like our suggestions are silly, but if you just say "no, I don't like that" to everything, then you'll get nowhere here.

Trust me, I've done this before

Also, as much as I hate to admit it, LR are a lot weaker than they once were. There was never ever a time when a single unit of long fangs had the power to decimate a LR in one phase of shooting, yet now they have that power.

Trust me when I say this, you will struggle. Dual LR cannot work without terminators any more (they're just not survivable enough to be damage soakers any more) And since you're running what you are... have you considered flying toaste- I mean storm talons? Those things are flimsy, but, by god six of them would be hard to shoot down. And think about it like this: four of them is the same HP as two LR, only they can only be hit on sixes. Sure, they'll take less damage to fall out of the sky and you don't have the models for them,but the flyers rules just make them deadly.


I'm sorry if I seem condescending here, I just know what you're doing to yourself.

If you don't feel you need the advice, you don't need to take a list to us, now do you?

I am not trying to be dismissive of anyone's replies. It's good to know what I should expect against different armies, and and it's true that certain drastically different loadouts are more effective.

I guess my replies fell in the range of "I like this unit, so I'll use it anyways," which isn't meant to insult anyone who suggested other units, I agree those changes would probably make the list more competitive. I guess it's making the most of what I have, which I probably won't be buying lots of new models in the near future.

We all know units that have worn out their fun factor or just disproved themselves for being effective, and those we always cycle out. That's what i did with my Terminators and Special characters.

I guess it boils down to I should be more clear in what feedback I want. Suggestions for unit changes are clearly useless if I don't intend on buying or building the army to include units I don't have (the recommendation of "buy 6 new models for $300, that will make your army better" is obviously going to help the list, but how feasible is that?), so I'm sorry I wasn't clear In what I wanted/needed.

I do appreciate the advice, and seeing everyone's thoughts definitely helps mold my list building and decisions for the future. :-) Should I decide to increase the size of my SM collection, all notes are duly noted.

Not sure why no one has pointed this out but here it goes... Power axes are only +1 to strength... So you are going at the same time as a fist... but you are a measley strenght 5. Not worth the trade off if you ask me.

evildrspock wrote:I am not trying to be dismissive of anyone's replies. It's good to know what I should expect against different armies, and and it's true that certain drastically different loadouts are more effective.

I guess my replies fell in the range of "I like this unit, so I'll use it anyways," which isn't meant to insult anyone who suggested other units, I agree those changes would probably make the list more competitive. I guess it's making the most of what I have, which I probably won't be buying lots of new models in the near future.

We all know units that have worn out their fun factor or just disproved themselves for being effective, and those we always cycle out. That's what i did with my Terminators and Special characters.

I guess it boils down to I should be more clear in what feedback I want. Suggestions for unit changes are clearly useless if I don't intend on buying or building the army to include units I don't have (the recommendation of "buy 6 new models for $300, that will make your army better" is obviously going to help the list, but how feasible is that?), so I'm sorry I wasn't clear In what I wanted/needed.

I do appreciate the advice, and seeing everyone's thoughts definitely helps mold my list building and decisions for the future. :-) Should I decide to increase the size of my SM collection, all notes are duly noted.

I completely agree with this sentiment. I appreciate your position and I understand where you're coming from. sometimes, it is gonna be necessary to buy one or two cheap models or at least proxy them

jose kantor wrote:Not sure why no one has pointed this out but here it goes... Power axes are only +1 to strength... So you are going at the same time as a fist... but you are a measley strenght 5. Not worth the trade off if you ask me.

Actually it's definitely worth the trade off. Using marines as enemies 3 attacks at s5 kill more marines than 2 attacks at s8, mathhammered out of course the 2 PF attacks kill .8333 marines, while the 3 PA attacks kill 1 marine. On the charge the fist will kill 1.25 marines while the axe will kill 1.33 marines. For 10 points less you have more killing power against infantry, since meltaguns and krak/melta bombs are good enough for vehicles. Remember, even though most armies played are a variant of space marines, most models in the game are actually toughness 3 so you still wound those models on a 2+.