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Ok, big question I have for my favorite unit of the necrons

1 Destroyer Lord (IC, Jump Infantry) joined to a squad of Wraiths (Jump Infantry)
Wraiths have this wonderful rule: "wraiths ignore all difficult terrain tests and automatically pass all dangerous terrain tests"

The issue I get here is when partially charging through terrain.
Here is the example

This squad wants to charge, The DLord has a straight path to assault, clear of terrain. But some of the wraiths will have to move over the terrain to get into assualt. Am I penalized by difficult terrain? I see two possible outcomes to this, which do you think is right?

1. As I see it, no one in the squad is affected by the terrain (wraiths ignore and the Dlord is out of it) so there is no penalty to charge distance or to I.
2. The other side of the argument is that because at least one model has to move over terrain and not everymodel in that squad ignores terrain, they are subject to charging through terrain. (no matter if the Dlord crosses terrain or not).

Sorry for the wordiness, but opinions wanted/needed!?

As per the rules on P.22

If one model moves through Difficult terrain then your strike at I1

Wraiths only ignore the difficult terrain tests, they do not ignore the fact that they moved through the terrain.

DeathReaper wrote:As per the rules on P.22

If one model moves through Difficult terrain then your strike at I1

The issue here is that wraiths ignore terrain and the Dlord is positioned so that his charge will not go through terrain. So does this count as going through terrain?

Actually wraiths are: "...never slowed by difficult terrain, and automatically pass dangerous terrain tests."

Would you consider having your initiative reduced by going through difficult terrain to be 'slowed' by it?

That said your question is an interesting one, i'm also curious about the answer.

Moronic Nonsense wrote:

DeathReaper wrote:As per the rules on P.22

If one model moves through Difficult terrain then your strike at I1

The issue here is that wraiths ignore terrain and the Dlord is positioned so that his charge will not go through terrain. So does this count as going through terrain?

The wraiths do not ignore terrain, they are just never have their movement slowed by difficult terrain.

Important difference.

Neorealist wrote:Actually wraiths are: "...never slowed by difficult terrain, and automatically pass dangerous terrain tests."

Would you consider having your initiative reduced by going through difficult terrain to be 'slowed' by it?

That said your question is an interesting one, i'm also curious about the answer.

Thanks for the real wording, I couldn't remember it exactly.
this question has been burning me up. I really want an answer, any definitive answer will do.
That said, I also really want that answer to be result #1, no terrain test, and no reduction of I

I think there are two issues here.

Do they strike at I1?

Do they have to make a Diff terrain test?


They will strike at I1, because a model went through Diff terrain, he wasn't slowed by it, but still went through it.


I don't think they should have to roll the test... but I think RAW says they do.

Sadly upon review of the charging rules on page 22: "...if at least one model in the charging unit moved through difficult terrain as part of its charge move, all of the unit's models must attack at Initiative step 1..." appears to indicate that the unit you've described still has to go at initiative step 1 as it 'moved through' difficult terrain.

I'd prefer that 'never slowed' by it meant that it effectively ignores that part, but i can see no rules-legitimate stance for that position.

coredump wrote:I don't think they should have to roll the test... but I think RAW says they do.

No real point to rolling a difficult terrain check as they'd ignore it's results. (all a difficult terrain check does is determine the distance the unit can move)

Neorealist wrote:Sadly upon review of the charging rules on page 22: "...if at least one model in the charging unit moved through difficult terrain as part of its charge move, all of the unit's models must attack at Initiative step 1..." appears to indicate that the unit you've described still has to go at initiative step 1 as it 'moved through' difficult terrain.

That is correct.

if at least one model in the charging unit moved through difficult terrain as part of its charge move, all of the unit's models must attack at Initiative step 1

That is clear RAW.

The Wraiths Strike at I1 in your example.

ok so I reduce to 1, I can deal with that.

What about the charge range? will they have to do the 3d6 subtract the highest because of the DLord?
or will it be a normal 2d6 charge range?

I think the wraiths are slowed. It gives a reason for the difference in wording, and makes sense with the change of the trigger for having your initiative reduced.

Ignores difficult terrain - No DT test, no initiative reduction.
Is never slowed by difficult terrain - No DT test, but initiative is reduced to 1.

Maelstrom808 wrote:I think the wraiths are slowed. It gives a reason for the difference in wording, and makes sense with the change of the trigger for having your initiative reduced.

Ignores difficult terrain - No DT test, no initiative reduction.
Is never slowed by difficult terrain - No DT test, but initiative is reduced to 1.

The above is correct.

Ok guys, here is the thing with wraiths now and the change to jump infantry (at least how I see it)...

If wraiths use their jump packs or whatever to assault into or out of terrain, they take (and pass) dangerous terrain tests and go at Initiative 1.

However, if you do not use the jump packs and "walk" into assault then you still roll for difficult terrain but it is just a standard roll and not 3d6 discard the highest. You go at initiative 1.

Wraiths got (from my perspective, and I hope I'm wrong) kinda screwed with this change and made whip coils almost mandatory now.

I'm afraid units only move as fast as the slowest model, so if the Dlord is with the wraiths and they charge through terrain they do have to roll 3d6 because the lord is slowed by terrain.