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Hi there, I apologise if this has already been brought up, but a quick search showed no results relating to this edition...

I'm not very good at interpreting GW rulings, so bear with me

At the bottom of page 83 of the rulebook it says that
"If a Skimmer is forced to end its move over friendly or enemy models, move the Skimmer the minimum distance so that no models are left underneath it"

Does that mean that when a skimmer(e.g. Monolith) deepstrikes and scatters onto enemy or friendly models, that it doesn't mishap(because it moves away from them)? Or does the scatter not count as the "end its move" part - for instance, the "end" of moving when deepstriking could be regarded as after mishaps etc. have been resolved.

An interesting observation that I've had just now is that the rules for moving skimmers when they end over enemy models do not say that they should be moved at least 1" away - is that just implied or am I missing something?

EDIT: Grammar, punctuation etc.

The way I remember it is that the Monolith never mishaps from troops are vehicles. It just moves the minimal distance.

MJThurston wrote:The way I remember it is that the Monolith never mishaps from troops are vehicles. It just moves the minimal distance.

That was a special rule in previous Necron Codex. With new 'dex Monoliths lost that rule. It was forcing UNIT to move away, not Monolith

Tension wrote:At the bottom of page 83 of the rulebook it says that
"If a Skimmer is forced to end its move over friendly or enemy models, move the Skimmer the minimum distance so that no models are left underneath it"

Does that mean that when a skimmer(e.g. Monolith) deepstrikes and scatters onto enemy or friendly models, that it doesn't mishap(because it moves away from them)? Or does the scatter not count as the "end its move" part - for instance, the "end" of moving when deepstriking could be regarded as after mishaps etc. have been resolved.

I could agree with that logic Need to read it myself when I'm back home (and re-read 6th edition DS rules - wording will be key).

The monolith isnt ending its move, when deepstriking, until after you resolve mishap.

So it still mishaps.

Hmm. My initial thought was to disagree, given that deep striking is not a "move" as such as the models only count as having moved when it comes to the Shooting phase. However, given the wording for Deep Striking units not being able to "move any further" (p36), and that Scattering uses the term "move" throughout the rule (p6), I can definitely see the argument.

So, my gut is still saying "no", but RAW appears to support you.

Other than deepstriking where is a skimmer forced to end it's move on top of another unit?

Currently I cannot think of one, but we may get new psychic powers...

nosferatu1001 wrote:Currently I cannot think of one, but we may get new psychic powers...

Neither could I and it would seem that deepstriking might be what the rule was intended for and actually makes a lot of deepstrike capable vehicles a lot better. RAI I think that it was the intention though RAW it could be argued either way so I'd ask my opponent before risky deepstriking which way they see it.

nosferatu1001 wrote:Currently I cannot think of one, but we may get new psychic powers...

Moving over units at the edge of area terrain, stopping in the area terrain and becoming immobilized, having to be placed at the entrance of the terrain over the models.

Or the inverse of leaving the terrain, so on and so forth...

That's the only other one I can think of, outside of this topic.

This is interesting though, I'll have to discuss this with my group.

Cheexsta wrote:Hmm. My initial thought was to disagree, given that deep striking is not a "move" as such as the models only count as having moved when it comes to the Shooting phase. However, given the wording for Deep Striking units not being able to "move any further" (p36), and that Scattering uses the term "move" throughout the rule (p6), I can definitely see the argument.

So, my gut is still saying "no", but RAW appears to support you.

Is that RAW supporting me in a good way or a bad way? I don't really want to exploit the rules - I just want to have clarification when playing the game so that everyone is one the same page so that we spend more time playing and less time arguing

Herr Dexter wrote:

Tension wrote:At the bottom of page 83 of the rulebook it says that
"If a Skimmer is forced to end its move over friendly or enemy models, move the Skimmer the minimum distance so that no models are left underneath it"

Does that mean that when a skimmer(e.g. Monolith) deepstrikes and scatters onto enemy or friendly models, that it doesn't mishap(because it moves away from them)? Or does the scatter not count as the "end its move" part - for instance, the "end" of moving when deepstriking could be regarded as after mishaps etc. have been resolved.

I could agree with that logic Need to read it myself when I'm back home (and re-read 6th edition DS rules - wording will be key).

Yeah I think the DS rules will hold the key, but I don't have a copy of the rules on me right now.

EDIT: grammar

RAW DS rules have no bearing on skimmers forced move relocate. You still mishap, because movement isnt over for them until after you resolve deepstrike which is after any mishap.

nosferatu1001 wrote:RAW DS rules have no bearing on skimmers forced move relocate. You still mishap, because movement isnt over for them until after you resolve deepstrike which is after any mishap.

Not sure if I agree with your take. Seems somewhat arbitrary. For example, if certain models begin or end their move in Dangerous Terrain they need to make a check. To me this seems similar enough. If a Monolith (via DS) is forced to ends it's move over Friendly/Enemy models the Skimmer relocation rule kicks in and no mishap occurs. Unless there is more to that bit on pg.83, I think you would mishap if you ended over Impassible terrain or off the table.

-Yad

Except the scatter isnt movement. If it were, you would be unable to scatter through enemy models, etc.

The model you place and scatter is a marker - it isnt the unit. Only after you resolve the models final posiiton, which is AFTER any mishap, has the model arrived.

Deep Strike isn't a move, it is deployment.
"If any of the models in the deep striking unit cannot be deployed ..." Page 36.

So if monotlith scatters over unit, it dets hit by mishap.

Luide wrote:Deep Strike isn't a move, it is deployment.
"If any of the models in the deep striking unit cannot be deployed ..." Page 36.

So if monotlith scatters over unit, it dets hit by mishap.

Does that me you can attach a Dispair Cryptek to a unit of Deathmarks and bounce them around the board handing out Marks to enemy units? If Deep Strike is not movement but Deployment then I guess this tactic would now be valid. I'll go back re-read the entirety of the DS rules rather than rely solely on the snippet provided (thought it is appreciated).

-Yad

The process of scattering isnt movemnet, but the same as 5th (and 4th) the unit has moved once it has arrived.

nosferatu1001 wrote:RAW DS rules have no bearing on skimmers forced move relocate. You still mishap, because movement isnt over for them until after you resolve deepstrike which is after any mishap.

Luide wrote:Deep Strike isn't a move, it is deployment.
"If any of the models in the deep striking unit cannot be deployed ..." Page 36.

So if monotlith scatters over unit, it dets hit by mishap.

While this is all well and good, I can't help but wonder what the rule for skimmers is intended to do otherwise.

So the conclusion is that RAW the monolith still mishaps, but RAI it could be either way?

Maybe that ork weapon that can move vehicles, that way a skimmer doesn't inflict the hits on a squad it may be force to "drop" on.

My reading is that the Monolith mishaps just like anything else.