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Ok... so unless i'm reading the rules wrong, if I have an independent character with a 2+ save in a squad of guys with a 3+ save, as long as the guy with the 2+ save is in base to base contact with someone swinging at this initiative level, I can take saves on the 2+ armor character until he dies.

So, as an example... Astorath + 10 death company vs 5 grey knight terminators with halbreds.

Astorath is in base to base with at least 1 halbred guy. The halbreds swing first, and score 7 wounds. I can chose to allocate first to astorath, and take 7 saves, one at a time, on him, until he's dead?

Correct, although you are risking your character dying. And in the case of LoS and different saves, you can only take LoS before the regular save is rolled. So you can't roll 2+ saves and then LoS any failed saves away.

Yeah, you can do that.

Challenges can sometimes help mitigate the effect though.

right, its not always best, but the MAIN worry I have in my death company list is squads packing power weapons... namely GK and a few Xenos equivalents.

If I have astorath in the squad though, and they manage 4-5 AP3 wounds, I'd rather take 4-5 2+ saves on him than rely on my death companies 5+ FNP saves alone.

If they challenge, couldn't I just decline, and still allocate wounds to him?

No, if you decline a challenge, the opposing player may select any character in the combat and he plays no part at all.

If you had a sergeant or other character as well as Astorath then they could accept the challenge and you'd be okay.

And keep in mind you would have to roll those 2+ saves one at a time. Because if Astorath dies he can't take any more saves, and the rest will pass on to the Death Company.

According to the rules, which I just re-read, a character refusing a challenge can't strike blows, and the squad can't use his leadership. Everything else should be as normal... including allocation of wounds.

So yea, it looks like its gonna be super important to include at least one 2+ save character in each squad.

I could throw in a techmarine, I suppose, in the squads that don't get astorath with them.

Yeah, you're right (though I suspect the rules FAQ might change that).

Blood and Slaughter wrote:Yeah, you're right (though I suspect the rules FAQ might change that).

Why?

It doesn't mention anything other than he can't strike blows because he's busy trying to get away from / defend himself from the enemy character looking for him... fluffwise, that could mean he's open to attacks from the rest of the enemy, or he's just parrying all their swings and has no time to attack, hence the refusal and his current inability to attack or lead.

Allocating wounds to a refusing character sounds legit to me

Oh I think it's completely legit as things stand. I'm just not quite certain it's the intention, it may well be, but it feels off to me is all. I don't especially mind either way as in general declining a challenge and so losing attacks from a 'killy' model seems punishment enough.

Yea... but it certainly seems like adding techmarines to squads where I don't have an HQ is going to be especially awesome now. Every 2+ save I make on him would save a death company marine from taking a 5+ save, and against squads that are not using power swords, he still gets 2 power ax swings + a power fist. Not bad for 65 points. Also, the ability to repair stormravens might be pretty cool.

A bit confused...

I thought that in CC wounds were allocated to nearest model, just like in shooting. Meaning that if say your 10 man death company are all in base contact with the GK squad, they should be taking wounds as well. The exception being that if multiple models are in base contact with the model attacking you "random-roll" to figure out who gets it.
I don't remember being able to allocate wounds for models with different saves...

No, they are just allocated amoung models in BtB first. No restrictions about which models in Btb though.