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So I was looking at the Swiftclaws in my Space Wolf army and while I'd want some bikers I'm wondering, Are they worth their points? I mean they are only WS and BS 3 and are armed only with Bolt pistols and close combat weapons. Do you take them in your army? If so how many do you take and what extras do you buy for them? Attack bike or not?

I take them in my army and they've been working well for me, the new hammer rules really helps them because its an auto hit attack at I10.

You've got a relly good chance to kill 1 or 2 guys before they can do anything, as long as they charge you've got a load of attacks and if your dice obey probability your going to inflict roughly 10 wounds.

Against something like a tac squad you can reasonably expect to kill 5 at least, against anything in lighter armour the carnage will be really impressive.

Sure SM and orcs can hit them on 3's but they still have a high toughness and a 3+ save to handle incoming attacks.

You can put a wolfpriest in there for the re-rolls if you like and to make em fearless but its alot of points and not really needed.

What makes me hesitate is the fact that they got 1 less WS and BS then normal marine bikers, And have to charge if the enemy is within 6 inch, Yet they cost the same as normal marine bikers.. How many would you take in a group? What heavy weapon would you take for them? And would you take an attack bike? If so, Heavy Bolter or Multi Melta?

If you have no plans for the ally, you can always add SM bikes as the allied force.

They have 4 attacks each on the charge + an I10 Hammer of Wrath each. They now get Jink and are a good last minute 'contest the objective' unit. WS3 and BS3 doesn't matter because you hit on 4's most of the time and the Bike has a TL Bolter. The only major down is that quite a few things hit you on 3's. But then you're T5.

IMO they are worth it for just one squad.

I havent seen anywhere in the codex saying the bike has a twin linked bolter, I can only find the bikers having Bolt pistols in the Space Wolf Codex.. Maybe I'm blind, Or stupid.. Either one.. As for allies, I have no plans for allies..

Anyways, How many bikes would you take in the squad? And would you take the attack bike or not? You can have 3-10 bikes plus 1 attack bike.
I realy like the models and think Bikes would be fun to have in the army.

Hmm.. Space Marines gets it all for the same price when it comes to Bikes.. so maybe get Space Marine allies for a Space Marine Bike squad to get the full WS and BS..

Thats an idea, Kor'Sarro Khan + 8 Bikes and 1 Attack Bike for a max bike group, Kor making them troops, 460 points of Space Marine Allies

All Space Marines bikes come equipped with TL Bolters. I don't have the SW codex but I'm sure someone can direct you to the page. Try looking on the page with all types of armour. It might be there.

Page 62 of the Space wolves codex under upgrades and other equipment. Last bit of the Space Marine Bike entry says they have twinlinked bolters.

Merellin wrote:I havent seen anywhere in the codex saying the bike has a twin linked bolter, I can only find the bikers having Bolt pistols in the Space Wolf Codex.. Maybe I'm blind, Or stupid.. Either one.. As for allies, I have no plans for allies..

Anyways, How many bikes would you take in the squad? And would you take the attack bike or not? You can have 3-10 bikes plus 1 attack bike.
I realy like the models and think Bikes would be fun to have in the army.

Hmm.. Space Marines gets it all for the same price when it comes to Bikes.. so maybe get Space Marine allies for a Space Marine Bike squad to get the full WS and BS..

Thats an idea, Kor'Sarro Khan + 8 Bikes and 1 Attack Bike for a max bike group, Kor making them troops, 460 points of Space Marine Allies

The big difference though;
a) Swiftclaw bikers are speedy, higher toughness assault troops.

b) Space marine bikers are speedy, higher toughness shooty troops who are no hittier than tactical marines in combat!

For the same cost, the Swiftclaws will shoot almost as well thanks to the twin-linked weapons on the bike, but they will hit infinitely harder because they get 4 attacks each instead of just 2 each! Plus, the Swiftclaws get the added perk of being able to take power toys/fists on their squad, which can then be backed-up by even more specialist attacks from a Wolfguard pack leader and/or an attatched HQ.

I would not go for an attack bike on Swiftclaws however as their BS3 for the cost likely isn't worth it. Overall you want these guys zipping arround the enemy's flanks & backfield, assaulting the shooty units while you main attackers like Grey Hunters, Thunderwolves, Wolfguard, etc... hit the enemy's main threats head-on.

Actualy Swiftclaws get 2 attacks normaly and 4 on charge while normal Space Marine bikes gets 2 attacks normaly and 3 attacks on charge so not counting charge they got the same ammount of attacks and only slightly more attacks on the charge..

Merellin wrote:Actualy Swiftclaws get 2 attacks normaly and 4 on charge while normal Space Marine bikes gets 2 attacks normaly and 3 attacks on charge so not counting charge they got the same ammount of attacks and only slightly more attacks on the charge..

Swiftclaws are A1 base + 1 attack for having a pair of ccw's + 2 attacks for their 'headstrong' charge = 4 attacks each when they assault.
Space Marine bikers are A1 base with only bolt pistols + 1 attack for charging = 2 attacks each when they assault.

Both units get the auto-hitting I10 HoW attack when they assault.

Both units will also typically be hitting their targets on 4's as WS4 is average in 40k since most armies are MEQ's or else Xenos. (IG, Tau, Eldar guardians, Gaunts and likely the new Chaos Cultists being the main WS3 horde units... But overall most units seem to be WS4 nowadays)
So outside of wonky dice, Swiftclaws will kill a sheadload more in assault as they will almost always fight with double the attacks that their codex counterparts get.

Merellin wrote:What makes me hesitate is the fact that they got 1 less WS and BS then normal marine bikers, And have to charge if the enemy is within 6 inch, Yet they cost the same as normal marine bikers.

Unlike C:SM bikes, they have an extra CCW, and +2 attacks on the charge, for a total of 4 attacks per bike. C:SM bikes have half as many attacks on the charge.
TL bolters make the BS 3 less of an issue.

Merellin wrote:How many would you take in a group? What heavy weapon would you take for them? And would you take an attack bike? If so, Heavy Bolter or Multi Melta?

I would go with 8, including an IC (wolf/rune priest)

The attack bike is a cheap way to add ablative wounds to the squad. They can take the first 'look out sir' hit. The HB is all you need, but if you have the spare points floating around you can upgrade.

Experiment 626 wrote:

Merellin wrote:Actualy Swiftclaws get 2 attacks normaly and 4 on charge while normal Space Marine bikes gets 2 attacks normaly and 3 attacks on charge so not counting charge they got the same ammount of attacks and only slightly more attacks on the charge..

Swiftclaws are A1 base + 1 attack for having a pair of ccw's + 2 attacks for their 'headstrong' charge = 4 attacks each when they assault.
Space Marine bikers are A1 base with only bolt pistols + 1 attack for charging = 2 attacks each when they assault.

Both units get the auto-hitting I10 HoW attack when they assault.

Both units will also typically be hitting their targets on 4's as WS4 is average in 40k since most armies are MEQ's or else Xenos. (IG, Tau, Eldar guardians, Gaunts and likely the new Chaos Cultists being the main WS3 horde units... But overall most units seem to be WS4 nowadays)
So outside of wonky dice, Swiftclaws will kill a sheadload more in assault as they will almost always fight with double the attacks that their codex counterparts get.

I thought normal spacemarine bikes had a close combat weapon too.. Hmm, Must have missed that then, Oh well. thanks for clearin that up ^_^

Merellin wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:

Merellin wrote:Actualy Swiftclaws get 2 attacks normaly and 4 on charge while normal Space Marine bikes gets 2 attacks normaly and 3 attacks on charge so not counting charge they got the same ammount of attacks and only slightly more attacks on the charge..

Swiftclaws are A1 base + 1 attack for having a pair of ccw's + 2 attacks for their 'headstrong' charge = 4 attacks each when they assault.
Space Marine bikers are A1 base with only bolt pistols + 1 attack for charging = 2 attacks each when they assault.

Both units get the auto-hitting I10 HoW attack when they assault.

Both units will also typically be hitting their targets on 4's as WS4 is average in 40k since most armies are MEQ's or else Xenos. (IG, Tau, Eldar guardians, Gaunts and likely the new Chaos Cultists being the main WS3 horde units... But overall most units seem to be WS4 nowadays)
So outside of wonky dice, Swiftclaws will kill a sheadload more in assault as they will almost always fight with double the attacks that their codex counterparts get.

I thought normal spacemarine bikes had a close combat weapon too.. Hmm, Must have missed that then, Oh well. thanks for clearin that up ^_^

Nope, normal Marines are sensible and keep one hand on the handle. Space Wolves are - well... crazy.

phantommaster wrote:
Nope, normal Marines are sensible and keep one hand on the handle. Space Wolves are - well... crazy.

Nope, Space Wolves are just real men!

Experiment 626 wrote:

phantommaster wrote:
Nope, normal Marines are sensible and keep one hand on the handle. Space Wolves are - well... crazy.

Nope, Space Wolves are just real men!

Not to mention SW bikers look more like the bikers you can find at you local biker bar.