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I have a friendly 2k tournament coming up, and I have yet to play a game of 6th edition. I was contemplating what I could put together with the models that I have, and I got to thinking that I would love to model up some more Rune Priests ( I already have three). Here's the corresponding list that I came up with:
-=HQ=-
#1 Rune Priest: Divination/Telekinesis
#2 Rune Priest: Divination/Telekinesis
#3 Rune Priest: LL/SC, Runic Armor, Chooser
#4 Rune Priest: LL/JotWW, Chooser, Meltabombs
#5 Rune Priest: LL/ TW, Chooser
-=Elites=-
4x Wolf Guard: Power Sword, Meltabombs
-=Troops=-
7x Grey Hunters: 1x Melta, MotW, Wolf Standard, Rhino
7x Grey Hunters: 1x Melta, MotW, Wolf Standard, Rhino
8x Grey Hunters: 1x Melta, MotW, Wolf Standard, Drop Pod
8x Grey Hunters: 1x Plasma, MotW, Wolf Standard, Drop Pod
-=Fast Attack=-
3x Thunderwolf Cavalry: 2x SS, 3x Meltabombs
-=Heavy=-
6x Long Fangs: 5x ML
6x Long Fangs: 5x ML
6x Long Fangs: 5x ML

So, here is the game plan: Rune Priests 1 and 2 twin link whichever two of the three LF packs needs it most. I figured this was a pretty sound way of dealing with the flyer menace without purchasing a dedicated unit or resorting to allies (which are allowed in this tournament). They may also have the opportunity to blast away with telekinetic goodness, but they are mostly there to buff.
Priest #3 comes down with the melta pod turn one near an objective, or in a strategically important point. Priests #4 and #5 roll on in the rhinos. The last pod will hopefully come on as late as possible for endgame objective contesting or re-enforcing. The thunderwolves are really just there to be a bullet magnet, and to act as a harassment unit. I thought about giving one of them a fist, but 3 meltabombs ought to take care of most threats.
Any C&C would be greatly appreciated.

Hey pal.

I'd like to share some things as a Thousand Sons player who encounters 2-3 space wolves players a couple times each week.

1. Plasma. If you can double up, do so.

2. Rhinos/Pods aren't needed. Just throw a priest/terminator with a 2+ save in front of the GHs and laugh as you make saves + Look Out Sir. AP3 bolters really hate SW 2+ saves.

3. Of course, don't change your heavy support section.. Though I'd consider putting the priests with 2+ saves in front of each squad to soak up small arms and keep the weapons firing.

4. Take the Primaris for Dvinination, and then just a roll on Telepathy. Shriek is a good offensive power, but Terrify can wreak havoc on a unit of Thousand Sons (for example).

5. Wolf Standard is just as important as before.

The list looks fine as you posted it, but the above suggestions are from 30+ games since 6th came out against Space Wolves. I lost every single one and they all had the same stuff I listed. Very frustrating (but simple) lists to fight, and I am not running a push-over Chaos list. Again, your list is great but I do not feel it is taking advantage of the boost SW got in 6th. It definitely side-steps some of the powerful things you can do (like the walking Plasma pewpew GHs)

Good luck.

Thanks for the feedback!
On to your points:

1. I agree, I think that there is a 5th edition bone caught in my throat, and it isn't letting me give up my meltas. Probably need to get over that. My main thought is that with three Living Lightning Priests on the board, and 15 missile launchers, I am kind of looking good for standard S7-8 shooting, and wanted something that could punch armour from some kind of distance.

2. I think that having some kind of mobility will work better in a tournament environment. How am I going to capture my opponent's objective if I don't have a ride? Foot slogging works, but I would rather resort to Look Out Sir shenanigans after I have made it halfway across the board.

3. Neat trick, this is the kind of stuff that I like to know about, mechanical roles of the models. The only issue I see is that it also puts my RP in the greatest danger of getting hit with heavy weapons. I can lose three Long Fangs for the cost of one RP.

4. Wolves can't roll on Telepathy. Telekinesis, Biomancy, and Divination, I am afraid. Telekinesis has some really awesome powers in its own right. The nova power would be great for a LF unit that is about to get swarmed (d6 S3 auto hits on every model within 12"? That's ridiculous, S3 or not..)

5. Yup, pretty much great.

I will definitely take the advice and try to shoehorn in more plasma and runic armour. Unfortunately, points are kind of tight, and I am wondering what could go on the chopping block?

Yep, I consider armor to be a significant threat. My recent approach (and the approach of my peers) has been to remove armor from my list, especially restrictive Transports. Maybe in your area there are some serious armored armies so having melta is just fine.

Every rhino being able to move 12" + 6" in the moving phase is still a good enough reason to have them in a list. Your point on mobility is true, and I agree.

With Look Out Sir being 2+ for Rune Priests, you can manage it in a way that you can decide whether or not that priest would even take a wound in the first place. Don't forget the mandatory pack leader can take his wound for him.

Oh, right no Telepathy for SW. My bad! I am too stuck in my Heretical ways and that must be flooding out through my typing. A chance for Gate of Infinity sure would be nice for a 2nd roll (for ALL priests). LF's about to get charged? Gate. Need to contest or hold an objective in Big Guns Never Tire? Gate. Ironically, my favorite way to remove LFs is to Gate near them and rapid fire since I usually have at least one sorcerer roll it.. but I digress!

Yeah points are tight.. Hmmm. The problem (if you can even call it that) is that the list is so good as-is. I suggest a play test before you implement changes. If you think about it, everything truly is bare-bones. That will allow you to address problems that we might not think about here on the interwebzzzz

I am into the notion of armour being restrictive, it is the kind of philosophy that I am trying to get my arms around. In 5th, I would not have gone with 2 rhinos and 2 pods in a GH heavy list, usually 3 or 4 of one or the other so that everything was moving in a solid wave. I think that the more chaotic and fast paced nature of the game in 6th lends itself to armies that can respond quickly to a changing board. No matter what, 15 Long Fangs make a solid fire base, and having up to 10 of them TL'd per turn is even more of effective.

Gotcha on the Look out sir functionality. RP in rune armour protects the unit from small arms fire, unit protects RP from the mean stuff.

Gate of Infinity is probably the pick of the litter, but almost all of the powers would be helpful. Crush has a pretty good chance of taking out a vehicle within 18", same for Objuration within 24". Shockwave is just badass, nova powers are like something out of Final Fantasy. Telekine Dome... 5+ invuln for Long Fangs that can walk and snapfire? Re-positioning gold. Vortex is ruthless, but a little too dodgy for my tastes. Dice hate me, and I know I would end of vaporizing my own guys.

I have had to teach myself to keep it bare bones, especially hard with this list, because there are so many HQs. I wanted to tailor each Priest to a specific role, but I think that it is better to keep them a little more rounded.

Dont forget you need something to differentiate the wargear on your first 2 Rune Priests.

i have a slighly different appoach to wolves. pods are great not disembark 6" you will be in melta range. rhinos are still effective they get you to where you want to go.

you are wasting 555 points on HQ choices thats a 1/4 of your army thats way to much. i would lose 3 of them and if you feel you need more out put take master of runes using divination and runes is pretty awesome expecialy when you misfortune the enemy then guide your unit.

how are you going to handle flyers- quad gun. for 2 reasons
1) gives your long fangs guarented cover and will help with flyers.

@karlosovic: On it. Didn't think of naked RPs needing to be differentiated, but it makes sense.
@clark10: Good point with the pod wolves, maybe I will give them the meltas instead of the rhinos packs. 555 is alot to spend on HQs, but you are getting five of them. It is not uncommon for people to run a single thunderlord that costs up to 250 points. With this set up, you are essentially doubling the effective firepower of the long fangs, and putting three models on the board that collectively put out 3d6 S7 shots per turn for three hundred and change points, not to mention their other powers.
If you are okay with spending another fifty points on MotR, why not go whole hog and buy another Rune Priest? If I had the points, I would love to make one or more MotR, but it seemed to make more sense to just get another body on the table. The problem with MotR and the codex powers is that you can't really make two shooting attacks a turn, unless you go with an anti-infantry combination, which just seems like a waste. If I have LL and JotW, sometimes I will run across a situation where I could use both of them on the same target, but it is pretty unlikely.
I am going to handle flyers with up to 10 TL'd missile launchers, and another 5 non-TL'd. I would happily drop the 50 points to get an emplacement, but I don't have the model. That being said, fortifications and flyers are not the only way to take out flyers.
If I dropped three Rune Priests, that would be a standard GH-spam list with 2 RPs, a pack of 5 TWC, and LF missile spam. Kind of defeats the purpose of doing something different.

You can make the priests different when you select psychic powers from the main book.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, a Priest with the Chooser somewhere (and a 2+ save) is the best way to handle fliers when you stick him on a quad gun.

Brometheus wrote:You can make the priests different when you select psychic powers from the main book.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, a Priest with the Chooser somewhere (and a 2+ save) is the best way to handle fliers when you stick him on a quad gun.

The wargear and psychic abilities both have to be different. Easy fix, give one of the meltabombs, or scrounge up enough points to give one of them rune armour. Agree, BS 5 Priest on quad gun is solid. Honestly, though, I am not that worried about flyers. Other than a completely flyer-centric list, I think that there is plenty on S7-S8 shooting to take down a couple of flyers. If they bring six flyers, I have six units that can shoot at them (3RPs, 3 LF packs). Granted, that isn't ideal, but one quad gun isn't going to take that down either.

Im not worried about fliers either. Good call

Brometheus wrote:You can make the priests different when you select psychic powers from the main book.

Actually that's not enough. Their wargear has to be different too. (See page 81 of the codex.)

Yup, they all have to have different gear and psychic abilities. For the most part, not too expensive to kit them out differently while still being effective. The 2+ small arms magnet business makes this an even more attractive option. The only other counter to flyers that I have a model for is a Rifleman dread, and he just doesn't seem worth his points in the new edition. I would also consider taking advantage of the 2 FOCs that I am working with and getting another pack of long fangs, but that just seems extra cheesey.

Yeah...And as if 5 rune priests wasn't cheesy enough! ( I hope you're not trying to make friends.)

Grugknuckle wrote:Yeah...And as if 5 rune priests wasn't cheesy enough! ( I hope you're not trying to make friends.)

I don't think that it ranks up with some of the truly cheesey builds that are possible with 2 FOC, allies, and flyers. 6 vindicators? 6 long fang packs? Flyer allies? These are all legal builds that I would be butthurt about facing. As you can see from several of the above posts, spamming HQs is not really considered an optimal way to spend points. I just think that the concept is a cool one that could be effective.

I was so confused about 5 priests at first forgetting about 2x FOC. Anyways yah one of the first 2 needs melta bombs and your golden. Although I'd personally drop 1long fang to give him rune armor. Other than that I like this list. Seems fairly destructive.

I realised that some of my point values for the Grey Hunter packs were off, which prompted a re-write. Here is the revised list:
-=HQ=-
Rune Priest: Divination/Telekinesis, Meltabombs
Rune Priest: Divination/Telekinesis
Rune Priest: LL/SC, Runic Armor, Chooser
Rune Priest: LL/JotWW, Chooser, Meltabombs
Rune Priest: LL/ TW, Chooser
-=Elites=-
3x Wolf Guard: Power Sword, Combi-Melta, Meltabombs
-=Troops=-
8x Grey Hunters: 1x Plasma, MotW, Wolf Standard, Rhino
8x Grey Hunters: 1x Plasma, MotW, Wolf Standard, Rhino
8x Grey Hunters: 1x Plasma, MotW, Wolf Standard, Drop Pod
10x Grey Hunters: 2x Plasma, MotW, Wolf Standard
-=Heavy=-
6x Long Fangs: 5x ML
6x Long Fangs: 5x ML
6x Long Fangs: 5x ML
5x Long Fangs: 4x MM, Drop Pod

I fear that this may have strayed into the land of straight Gouda. I am only abusing the FOC chart by one rune priest and one Long Fang pack, so probably not too bad? I thought about exchanging the MM LF pack for a MM dread, mostly because I would rather have one shot on 3+ than 4 shots that are snap firing on the turn that the pod drops. Whichever unit I go with, this is my replacement for the thunderwolves. I figured that I needed some thing that could respond to a shifting board quickly, and that could reliable take out a raider. Thunderwolves were just too expensive when I am tying up so many points in RPs.
Any thoughts?

I dunno about 'Gouda', but it's pretty f...ing boring

karlosovic wrote:I dunno about 'Gouda', but it's pretty f...ing boring

Well that's constructive. Any recommendation to make it less so? This is still for tournament play, so I am not throwing in blood claws for giggles. I think that if I had spent 500+ point on a thunderlord and a TWC pack there would be no gripe of it being boring, but that has been done to death. When you drop 1/4 of your points on five models, the rest of your army kind of has to be built around supporting that unit. It is fine to start criticism with"I hate this", but at least say why you think it would be boring, and for extra point maybe make a suggestion.

Twinkle Starchild wrote:

Grugknuckle wrote:Yeah...And as if 5 rune priests wasn't cheesy enough! ( I hope you're not trying to make friends.)

I don't think that it ranks up with some of the truly cheesey builds that are possible with 2 FOC, allies, and flyers. 6 vindicators? 6 long fang packs? Flyer allies? These are all legal builds that I would be butthurt about facing. As you can see from several of the above posts, spamming HQs is not really considered an optimal way to spend points. I just think that the concept is a cool one that could be effective.

We'll see. I'm just sayin' - most people really hate to be on the receiving end of 3 Rune Priests with JotWW. They'll cry cheese I promise.

Anyway...If this is for a tournament, I honestly think you'll have more success with 3 RP's and 3 LF squads than you will with 5 RP's and 4 LF's. You only have four troop units. One or two of them will be wiped out in an average game which leaves you with not enough scoring units. So here are my suggestions.

1) Drop two rune priests - Having 5 rune priests is going to make people whine and hate you AND three is more than enough to do a great job. I personally would never take more than two. Did you ever think about how often you're going to get perils of the warp with 5 (five!) psykers? Then exchange one of the rune priests for a wolf priest (so you're left with 2 RP and 1 WP).

2) One chooser of the slain is plenty. Unless you know that your opponent has a boat load of infiltrators (and you don't because this is a tournament list), three is a complete waste of points.

3) Drop the multi-melta long fangs. The way you have it set up now, it is a suicide unit. Not worth it. Besides, four units of long fangs is going to get cries of cheese. Stick with three units of ML's - which is plenty - and your opponents will still cry, but not as bad.

4) Make your drop pod Grey Hunters a 10 man squad with two meltaguns, or a 9 man squad with one meltagun and a wolf guard with combi-melta, power-fist (or power weapon or wolf claw) and meltabombs. Deck this squad out with MotWW, Standard, AND power weapon. This is the squad that pods in, melta's your opponent in the face and then takes a counter charge. This unit will likely be just as effective as a drop pod with 5 MM LF's but it could also threaten to contest an objective. It probably won't survive if it drops in alone BUT, in order to destroy this unit your opponent will have to devote a considerable amount of attention to it. That will buy some time for the rest of your units to close in.

If you decide to do this (#4), consider exchanging the two rhinos for drop pods. Droping in two GH units (instead of one) will increase their threat and their survivability. One unit with melta and the other with plasma.

5) That's going to save you about 375-ish points. You could get 1 more squads of grey hunters, or a bunch of TWC or both. You do NOT need a thunderlord. I would suggest one 5 man unit of GH (for holding objectives in your deployment zone) with a plasmagun and nothing else. That's 85 points. Add a Rhino to your foot sloggers. That's 35 points. Then use the rest of your points (about 250 pts) on TWC (with at least 1 but no more than 2 storm shields). Try to get at least 4 models. Include a good CC weapon on one of the models with a shield. Claw, Fist, Hammer - it doesn't really matter which. The other cavalry should remain with bolt pistol & CC because that will give them 5 strength 5 rending attacks which is already way better than MotWW.

Now...2 of the three drop pods land on turn 1 and tie up the enemy. Hopefully vaporizing an big tank and/ or decimating an infantry unit. Meanwhile the rest of your army advances. Missiles shoot. TWC closes in to rescue the GH's.

That's a better list and while still not screaming variety, it's got more than:
HQx5
Troopx4
Heavyx4

I'll admit we Space Wolves are a bit limited on viable troops choices (or even non-viable troops choices)... but that's where the limitations should end. There are so many great units in the codex and so many more fun and interesting options.

Do you only ever drink water? or do you sometimes like to have a soda, or a beer, or f$%^ it - why not tequilla shots sometimes?

I guess my main point is I've been playing Space Wolves since I started 40K in 1992. That's 20 years, and I chose this army because it's so full of raging, proud, crazy, characterful options.
And then the internet boil it down to however many RP + GH + LF fits into the points limit.
It takes the fun out of the hobby

@Grugnuckle:
1. I agree, more troop options are needed.

2. I was taking the likelihood of perils into account. It is a 2 in 12 chance each turn, so there is a likelihood that with five there will be one perils every other turn or so. Who knows, could roll the dice and get nuked turn 1. That is one of the reasons that I like this list, there is some risk involved. It is really based on trying out the new lay of the land when it comes to psykers. Honestly, I would consider making one of the priests the new rulebook powers just to try them out further.

3. I mostly take choosers for the +1BS, especially past the first one. Having 1/6 more shots land for 10 points is a reasonable expense. Unfortunately, it does little to help with flyers.

4. Point taken. I was considering having a Drop Pod Dred with MM, what do you think of that as an option? Played with one at all?

5. I like the 10 man melta pod unit. I have generally run my GHs with a WG, but I am into switching that up.

6. Can't exchange the rhinos for pods, I only have two pods. I am into having to pod units though. One melta to drop in and pop something, then the other w/ plasma to act as back up.

7. I am still trying to figure out a way to keep the core of this list and still fit in TWC.

@Karlosovic: Firstly, the limitation for me is primarily one of having the models to run the list. I have two drop pods, 2 rhinos, 1 LRR, 2 dreds, 6TWC, and a mess of infantry. I do not have any allies, I do not have an ADL or any other kind of fortification. I am trying to build a tournament ready list for 6th where I am more than likely going to be running into all of these as challenges.

Unfortunately, I think that you have the wrong impression as to what I am trying to accomplish here. If I was trying to run a classic Space Wolf army build, I would probably build exactly what Grugnuckle is proposing. I have run lists with every named character in the book. I have run lists with 1,2, or 3 Rune Priests. I have done Wolf Guard in a raider, I have done a Ragnar mob in a raider, and I have run Loganwing. They are all a lot of fun. I am really not trying to power game here, and if that is what you think, then I will point out the inherent weaknesses of this type of build:

1. Low model count (duh, there are 560 points wrapped up in 5 models)

2. While the HQs in this list can dish out an impressive 3d6 S7 attacks at unlimited range against up to three targets, each of those three sets of attacks has to first pass a psychic test, then roll to hit, and finally manage to wound or penetrate. That is a lot of what if's. The Divination priests have the awesome ability to twin-link the long fangs (or any unit within 12"), but they also have to pass a psychic test to do that. Every time any one of them uses a psychic power, they run the risk of perils. Don't get me started on what can go wrong against Tyranids.

3. None of the rune priests have invulnerable saves, even with the 20 point upgrade they only get an invuln against psychic, which is kind of cute considering what runic weapons already do against psychic powers.

4. 6th Edition character sniping. 'Nuff said.

I could keep going, but I think that you (should) get the point. Like I stated, whenever you put that many points into 5 models, you are going to have to tailor the rest of the army to support them. In this case the RPs need bodies to hide in, and long range support to defend them. Voila, GHs and LFs. The original list had TWC in it. I have also mentioned putting in a drop dred.

As for this being an internet boiled down list, I have not seen anyone here on dakka, or anywhere else for that matter, touting 5 RPs as the next way to go. It is taking what is otherwise considered one of the top codexes and turning it into a glass hammer. I am here fishing to find out if it has a chance to be effective. That is generally why people originally post lists to this forum, and I think that generally most people post replies to provide some kind of constructive criticism. You know, making suggestions at to how a concept can be improved, not just tearing down the framework. If in your twenty years of playing (I started playing 40k somewhere around 1990) you have developed and maintain a certain opinion, namely that you just don't like the idea, more power to ya. Move on.

Finally, if the fun is being taken out of your hobby...well, I don't even know where to do with that one. I guess you might as well go to work. At least then you are getting payed.

Mate, I just meant you don't have any interesting units in there and no variety. I do work, don't get much time to game, and when I do - I want to play with the fun stuff (even if it loses), not copy-pasta.

Fair enough though if you're just trying to get a solid handle on the core of your army during the change to 6th ed.
You're not going to want to run that list for ever, though, and I'd still be trying to see how they combine with and support other elements.