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(I'm a fairly new player, by the way)

I went to a local pub, and managed to get loads of games in with a few different people. It was really fun, even if I did get slaughtered 9 times out of 10, but there was one player (actually a maths teacher at my sixth form) who played entirely with photocopies in sleeves. They weren't exactly good photocopies either, fuzzy and in black and white, making it hard to see what's what sometimes, especially with lands.

Another thing which was weird (that I didn't know at the time) was that he was using cards from Unhinged and Unglued, and I was wondering why they were so strange.



I certainly would never do it myself (defeats the object IMO) but I'm just wondering how common it is, and what others think of it?

Cards from the Un-sets (unglued, unhinged) are not legal in any format, they are joke cards and were always intended as such. In even the most casual games, it's bad form to put them in without asking people first. It's because they are so silly and/or unbalanced, they are joke cards and not for serious play, you shouldn't use them unless everyone wants that kind of game. You don't use banned cards either in decks, usually the grossly overpowered stuff because it's not fun for anyone except the person using them to have first and second turn wins.

I don't use photocopies myself. I'm aware that with many rarer cards it's impossible to get them on a budget. My local shop allows proxies on certain nights though. But I think they should be printed at a good quality, it's not hard to get the cards off Gatherer and use a colour printer so they don't look complete gak on the table.

I don't really care about it.

It's how you use the deck that really separates the copiers from the strategists, and rare cards are too expensive as it is.

Who really cares as long as it's a legal card. There's no difference between a player who is incredibly lucky to get rare cards, and one who can spend tons of money. The cards function the same. But I am an incredibly laid-back magic player.

I play with a guy that uses copies to tweak the deck. So he'll have a good portion be actual cards and then certain cards will be copies before he puts in the actual card. I don't mind it, and I don't think people should care in casual games.

I'm fine with it if they're doing it to try out a new deck they built with the intention of buying it later if it's good enough.

Each and every one of his decks were photocopies. He even said to us that he no longer used any real cards. I did a quick search and found this - turns out it is illegal (no surprise though).

I wouldn't mind proxies either, as a 'try before you buy' thing, but I feel entire decks (and collections in this case) is too far.

Is it wrong to feel cheated? I was kind of annoyed when I found out about the Unglued and Unhinged cards, but the more I think of it, photocopying decks is just a short cut and cheating in my eyes. I feel it made the game less enjoyable when it's difficult to see what your opponent has on the battlefield.

I wouldn't call myself an incredibly uptight or serious player at all, in fact I'm all for casual recreation, but I believe rules are there for a reason. Whilst this may be to protect WotC's IP, it's also there to keep the game fun, the most important factor for me.

As long as I can use my Power Nine that I don't have to produce for any type of proof, I'm fine with photocopies.

/sarcasm

Are you serious? I don't really care about Wizard$'s IP, but I do care about people being honest about their cards.

Am I serious about...?

That people are actually doing this. Proxies for valuable cards are one thing, but an entire photocopied deck is ridiculous.

Yes, 100% serious.

I've see it too. One guy at our FLGS proxed whole decks to try out, but he tried so many and so much, eventually we other players started picking a little on him and complaining about it. He changed.

My Mirrodin era white weenie deck feels so old these days.

A little off-topic but it's weird getting a sense of nostalgia from seeing all of the older edition cards from when I just collected them (and not played) as a kid. I can remember so many cards I had before I stupidly gave my collection away a few years back (when I thought I'd never play again!).

You reminded me when you mentioned Mirrodin. It may not seem that long ago to some of you folks, but I'm only 18

I remember scrambling around my city trying to buy boxes of Legends when it came out. I worked at a Hobby shop, and we got 3 boxes total. My co-worker and I bought 1.5 boxes each, leaving none for the customers, then we went around town and bought the rest, and still only got about 2 boxes each.

It sold out everywhere. I tried, back in 1993's internet era, to order more from stores and have em shipped, but everywhere was sold out.

Thought you'd appreciate that, Bacon. IRC was the internet, WWW didn't really exist yet, no ebay, no cell phones. A couple of card dealers hung out in some obscure IRC channels I hung out in, and that was about it. LOL.

I still play, and my collection is probably worth north of $30,000 right now. Photocopies wouldnt fly at my kitchen table, but we don't even allow proxies of cards you do own. Our player who tries to use his mox jet has to switch sleeves to use it in his 2 black decks, and if I bothered to put my moxes and lotus in decks, I'd do the same. (But I dont play them...feels like cheating)

I still play, and my collection is probably worth north of $30,000 right now. Photocopies wouldnt fly at my kitchen table, but we don't even allow proxies of cards you do own.

I'd probably just leave then, you sound like a really poor sport to play with anyway.

Just because not everyone has 30k to spend on a children's card game doesn't mean that people shouldn't be able to have fun occasionally...

As much has his statements reek of 'Look how cool I am', you can try to be a bit less dismissive and pay attention to what he said.

He didn't spend 30k on the game, he bought in early when Legends was released. His collection is now worth 30k.

Yes but unless he's prepared to share his cards the he's rather expecting you to have access to the same stuff.

Howard A Treesong wrote:Yes but unless he's prepared to share his cards the he's rather expecting you to have access to the same stuff.

Well, unlikely that we can afford to sit at his kitchen table.

Probably has a 50 buck cover charge.

LOL

I have friends with a deck, and friends with collections that are also worth decent money. I played in Nationals a couple of times, won my regionals a time or two, and generally did well for myself.

I sold my collection back in the mid 90's before getting back in, also. No cover charges here, just friends and "Children's card games". The sort of childrens games that involve $1500 dollar cards, apparently.

If any of you ever come to Halifax, Nova Scotia, let me know, and we'll make a special spot at the kitchen table for you...assuming you bring at least 1 deck with cards you own, and not photocopies of cards.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Howard A Treesong wrote:Yes but unless he's prepared to share his cards the he's rather expecting you to have access to the same stuff.

I certainly trade with my friends. I also build fun decks. I mentioned I dont use power nine and moxes/lotus outside tournaments, which I don't play anymore. Also, I don't see how its much different than friends I have with 6 15,000 point Warhammer armies.

And you don't allow others to proxy to try out a new strategy?

What a jerk.

Nobody in our play circle allows proxies. I'm not the biggest carer in the world on whether you write mox on your forests, but some of the other guys would totally flip their lid.

I like your sig, by the way, Melissia.

Melissia, be nice. I may not agree with interwebs bragging but that's no reason to name call. A group having rules regarding proxies does not make them jerks it just means they have rules.

Tha'ts like saying that someone who has rules banning black people from playing aren't racist, they just have rules.

No, but that's a great false equivalency.

If we bring Hitler up next, I think we win the internets.

Nah, that just means we Godwin'd.

And that'll do.