Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Or, exactly, which powers are best for libby in doublewing? I think that "Scrier's gaze"is somehow mandatory, but not sure which second power I should take.

I know that for Deathwing Divination is the psychic talent tree that I prefer. Prescience is a massive boost for Thunderhammers and Powerfists, or on the Lightning Claw Terminators (allowing to reroll to hit & to wound is just nasty, especially if they have the bonus attacks from the company banner).

The new version of Doom I think is one of the least useful from Divination for Deathwing, as you are ignoring most armor.
Precognition is also nice, having a Libby that can handle challenges can be a serious lifesaver, especially if it's in your oponents turn. This would allow you to activate your force weapon, while still having your rerolls. (DA libby's are actually more dangerous in their oponents turn because of this).

As for the synergy of Doublewing, I can't really say as I don't have any bikers. At least rerolls are always nice, but with the biker's twin linked bolter you have some rerolls anyways on shooting. I think in that case, your Scrier's Gaze would work best with the biker portion of your army.

Just my two cents, take it for what it's worth.

Dark Angel librarians are bad, just do not take them.

You are either talking double FOC as you'll have Sammael and Belial, or you are looking at allies.

So BA divination or blood lance and unreleased rage are probably better for deathwing, Rune priest use jaws or lightning.
Vanilla librarians I think I would prefer nullzone as they can not have divination.

You wouldn't have to run two FoC's to run double wing, unless you absolutely need (read as want) Belial & Sammael. You could just run Beliel as your HQ for Terminator Troops, then use your Fast Attack slots for Ravenwing squads. Being that I'm not a competitive player, would that still be considered Doublewing?

DA Libby's do have some downsides as well as some upsides however:
Pro - 1 pip extra in WS and BS characteristics
Runes of Warding or a Psychic Hood within 6" are the only means of preventing your librarian from buffing a unit (iirc)

Con - Ld9 makes Perils a bit more likely, and more difficult to defend against the Psychic Hoods from Vanilla Libby's and their base 10 Ld.
DA Libby's can only cast 1 psychic power a turn, however they have two powers to start with.

I think in 6th they got a little bit of a boost, nothing truly amazing, but if used right can work to your advantage. They have never been the best of psykers compared to other marine armies, but still can be used as a force multiplier.

ummm.... LD 9 is much less of a big deal. Hoods no longer rely on LD they simply extend the range of Deny the Witch (which if you are running Divination powers does not really matter.)

LD 9 makes perils any less likely (it is 1/18 for any Psyker)

LD 9 does make is slightly more likely that you will fail your powers (LD 10 fails 1/12 times, LD 9 fails 1/6)

Most pskers unless you buy an upgrade all marine psykers (excepting special characters and Grey Knights) only cast one power.

DA Librarians Got a big buff in this edition.

1.) Hoods got worse so LD 9 matters less.
2.) They have a better statline (other than LD than other libbies.)
3.) They have access to 4 Disciplines including Divination and Telepathy (easily 2 of the top 3 disciplines, though given the Libby stats Biomancy would have been nice.)
4.) Their book powers were terrible, so the change to book powers is a no brainer.
5.) Ezekiel got better as he gets 3 powers (though still only Mastery level 1, but at least he has a good chance of getting the good powers.)

In the ranks of Marine Pskers the current Rank would be this IMO

1.)Rune Priests- access to some of the best BrB powers, and best psychic defense, and good codex powers
2.) GK Libby- A bit expensive, but can be ML 3, gets Divination, and has good codex powers.
3.) Blood Angels- Decent codex powers, Access to Divination, can get ML 2
4.) Dark Angels- Upgraded stats, Access to divinaiton
5.) Codex marines- No access to divination, only so so Codex powers (null zone is situationally great, but beyond that they are all meh)

Breng77 wrote:DA Librarians Got a big buff in this edition.

Not really?

Their hoods are worse than before. Yes, all hoods are worse. But it most certainly not a buff.
Then their hoods were great as they had infinite range but Ld9 meant it was not fool proof.
Now you have mastery level 1, so the hood works just as well as before but only for units that are close by and that are being attacked by a power.

So before you would only dream of taking Ezekial as his hood could stop all powers, now it doesn't do as much.

In terms of powers, they have indeed improved but mastery level 1 holds this back, as leadership 9 and the DA units will not be boosted that much by divination.

Ranking a vanilla librarian, the HQ which finds it place in many a list, above a DA librarian, which does not appear in many at all, is just weird.

Yeah, you have to look at the math of a leadership 9 power going off against runes of warding, which is everywhere this edition.

You drop from a 50% passrate at leadership 10 to a 37.5% passrate. In my opinion, not acceptable.

I do like ezekiel though. He is leaderhsip 10, he has a 2+ armor save, and his fearless bubble is still listed as "friendly units" so he does well with allies.

I'm getting a lot of mileage out of a drop pod filled with company veterans, ezekiel and azrael believe it or not. Prescience and misfortune are a blast with that unit, and you've got a few power fists to work over those pesky paladins.