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Thoughts?

Captain- Bike, Artificer, Combi-Plasma, TH/SS
Command Squad- 4x Plasmagun
5 Bikes- Plasmagun x2, Combi-Plasma
5 Bikes- Plasmagun x2, Combi-Plasma
5 Bikes- Plasmagun x2, Combi-Plasma
Tactical Squad- Plasmagun, Heavy Bolter, Combi-Plasma
2 Attack Bikes- Multimelta x2
2 Attack Bikes- Multimelta x2
2 Attack Bikes- Multimelta x2
5 Devs- ML x3, LC x1
5 Devs- ML x3, LC x1
5 Devs- ML x3, LC x1

No need for a combi-plasma imo. If you are gearing for CC, save the 10 points on a 1 shot gun. SS is debateable, already haveing a 4+ invuln is good, but if you need a few points, drop the SS. The TH reduces your I to 1. Yes it is awesome, by doubleing your strength, but you are stirking at the same time as other weapons which can ignore your artificer armour. A relic blade is better, imo, it gives S6 (so 2+ on MEQ), and you strike at I5. Yes you cant kill terminators effectively, but you should not be in combat with terminators AT ALL. Use your command squad to kill the termies.

The command squad is good. It will get shot to bits, fyi, so maybe 1 or 2 SS just to absorb the ap1/2 shooting? If you dont have the points for that, dont worry.

Your bikes are solid. I do like having a Attack Bike in my bike squads, but with 3 plas they should handle light tanks acceptably. Maybe a cheap CC weapon, just to give the captain a little kick in combat.

Take the Tactical Squad out and add more bikes. You can get another bike squad for their cost.

The attack bikes are solid. Try running with 1 in a bike squad, jusst to see how it preforms and how you like it.

Not sold on the Devs. Maybe drop 1 squad for another bike squad. Drop another squad for a bastion and quad gun. Then place the remaining devs in the bastion and get the higher los. Failing that, i'd rather take more bikes.

 Brometheus wrote:
Thoughts?

Captain- Bike, Artificer, Combi-Plasma, TH/SS
Command Squad- 4x Plasmagun
5 Bikes- Plasmagun x2, Combi-Plasma
5 Bikes- Plasmagun x2, Combi-Plasma
5 Bikes- Plasmagun x2, Combi-Plasma
Tactical Squad- Plasmagun, Heavy Bolter, Combi-Plasma
2 Attack Bikes- Multimelta x2
2 Attack Bikes- Multimelta x2
2 Attack Bikes- Multimelta x2
5 Devs- ML x3, LC x1
5 Devs- ML x3, LC x1
5 Devs- ML x3, LC x1

Lose the 3 devastators and the tactical squad. Go to 3 minimal scout squads with bolter and heavy bolter or bolter and missile launcher. Gives you a lot of squads to hold objectives, still gives you 3 squads to hit MCs or tanks. Then increase your bikesquads to maximum 8 bikes + 1 attack bike with MM. I believe you can then combat squad them. Something like:
1 Captain on Bike
1 Cmd Squad
8 Bikes w 2 Plasma, 1 Attack Bike w MM
8 Bikes w 2 Plasma, 1 Attack Bike w MM
8 Bikes w 2 Plasma, 1 Attack Bike w MM
5 Scouts 1 HB
5 Scouts 1 HB
5 Scouts 1 HB
2 Attack Bikes w MM
2 Attack Bikes w MM
2 Attack Bikes w MM

Another option would be to replace one pair of attack bikes with a unit of scout bikers. Let them booby trap some of the terrain just to make the enemy reluctant to just go into terrain. (Where you don't want to go in the first place.)

I like the full squad idea.

Not a fan of the scout squads.

Scout bikers with grenade launchers could work. Thats a handful of rapid fire S6 shots. Not to mention the cluster mines

DAaddict wrote:

1 Captain on Bike
1 Cmd Squad
8 Bikes w 2 Plasma, 1 Attack Bike w MM
8 Bikes w 2 Plasma, 1 Attack Bike w MM
8 Bikes w 2 Plasma, 1 Attack Bike w MM
5 Scouts 1 HB
5 Scouts 1 HB
5 Scouts 1 HB
2 Attack Bikes w MM
2 Attack Bikes w MM
2 Attack Bikes w MM

I'm not sure why this would be an improvement?

By buying more bikes and combat squadding you're basically gaining 3 mobile multimeltas, and a lot of small scoring units. But you're paying for it by losing 9 MLs, 3 LCs and a pretty solid scoring unit. Is that really a good trade?

Nice suggestions and good points all around.

Tacticals are only in because they're complete and well painted, and 10 bucks per bike hurts. Only have 3 units anyways.

The army is not fully complete though, so I will sit on these suggestions for another week or so.

Thanks everyone.

I personally like the list.

I do think the tac squad is a bit out of place. I do actually like the idea of the Devs giving the bikes support. I am not sure why everyone dislikes that. I think it helps the bike army pretty good. Bikes have a hard time dealing with alot of armor and the devs will help mitigate that issue.

Anyways neat list, good luck with it.

Multimeltas that are mobile beat the snot out of sit-in-place missile launchers. Having 9 scoring units also adds to the threat level versus 4 or 5.

If I want an army to have speed, I would just rather have all the units having speed. I don't like having an anchor to my army.

It is a matter of personal choice though. Just offering my opinion. Not saying it is the only way to skin a cat.

 Brometheus wrote:
Nice suggestions and good points all around.

Tacticals are only in because they're complete and well painted, and 10 bucks per bike hurts. Only have 3 units anyways.

The army is not fully complete though, so I will sit on these suggestions for another week or so.

Thanks everyone.

I really like this list. Experiment and don't be discouraged if it doesn't work straight away - bike lists are fickle to use.

On the other hand wish I was only paying $10 for a bike - over here they're $20!

More fickle than a Thousand Sons list?

 Brometheus wrote:
Nice suggestions and good points all around.

Tacticals are only in because they're complete and well painted, and 10 bucks per bike hurts. Only have 3 units anyways.

The army is not fully complete though, so I will sit on these suggestions for another week or so.

Thanks everyone.

I find bikes expensive. £8 for 1?! But, i look to Ravenwing Battleforces. The box is £70, and contains 6 bikes, an Attack bike and a LS. Saves around £10. But, i go to a webstore and get the battleforce for 25-30% discount, drops the price to around £55. All of a sudden, your saving £25, you could even buy the bikes for the discount, and just get what you need. But i find the battle force is great for that cost, because it covers the bikes and attack bike well and you can sell the LS and DA ugrade sprues on.

Upon second look of your Original List, it will be really good for when you can buy Flakk missiles. But the TAC squad still seems out of place

I like the scouts idea, in 6th edition its all about the troops. If your bikes can take all the fire, the scouts can grab objectives and shot 3 missiles to boot. I also recommend dropping a attack bike squad for a stormraven. Yes, its the worst flyer in the game, but what else do SM have in the anti-flyer department?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 balsak_da_mighty wrote:
I personally like the list.

I do think the tac squad is a bit out of place. I do actually like the idea of the Devs giving the bikes support. I am not sure why everyone dislikes that. I think it helps the bike army pretty good. Bikes have a hard time dealing with alot of armor and the devs will help mitigate that issue.

Anyways neat list, good luck with it.

Because the points you spend on the devs=another bike squad=more chance of winning
Attack bikes are there for a reason, they are bike army dev squads

Why do armies have to be so cookie cutter? Bike armies lack at armor destruction. The devs provide that. What would you rather shoot at? The bikes or the devs? It's a hard Choice to me.

But I guess we have different ideas of tactics.

The bikes provide a more imminent threat. I'd gladly take 12 missiles a turn to destroy the bikes. Not only is that threat gone and the opponent troop less (unless scouts are being used), but I can spend the rest of the game picking off the devs.

The bikes in fact DO have armor destruction, meltaguns, combi-meltas, PF , Meltabomb, Multi-melta attack bike thats relentless. Not to mention Land Speeders and Stormravens. THESE are what kill armor

The whole strategy behind a bike list is throw everything you have at the opponent, forcing him to pick out the most imminent threats and ignore everything else. A dev squad just can't do that. I'd rather take a scout squad or two and another bike squad with the points. A scout squad can take objectives, can survive well due to stealth, and can pop a missile a turn. Yes, the missile is BS 3, but the ability to take the objective balances it out.

Also consider SM dev squads are the worst dev squads in the game. Its funny to see people trying to copy SW long fangs, which are not only cheaper but also have a boatload of awesome special rules.

And as for cookie cutter lists, bike lists are never cookie cutter. Its always up to the player. After the obligatory captain and bike squads, the player is free too configure the list to his personal preferences. Attack Bikes, Land Speeders and Stormravens all fufill an anti-armor/anti-infantry role. Scout Bikers can be nice harrassment units, and Scouts in Storms can take objectives with the best of them. Librarians, Chaplains and Techmarines can be mounted on bikes. Command squads can provide a combat buffer or a way to take 4 special weapons. Its all up to the player how his or her army is built, plays and wins

To conclude my very long post:
Static gunline units such as dev squads have no place in fast moving armies such as SM bike lists. To replace them, a player has a wide array of units to choose from, all of which keep the heat on the opponent and force him to prioritize and sacrifice in order to even have a chance at winning.

Ok, all good points.

I don't see how the bikes are the more immediate threat. I guess it really depends on the army that you are playing. Bikes are or can be a pain but with the low numbers in the units it might be second on my lilsty of threats.

But its not a fast moving army. Its a mixed army the way he has it. So I think they do have a place.

Meltas and PF's on bikes are the wrong thing to do. You have to get to close to use them and there for get drawn into assault which is a bad place for bikes to be. Especially now with the 2d6 charge range. Sure I agree with the MM, but you are losing half of its effectiveness with being 24 inches away. So is it really the best option? Its a nice one but maybe not the best.

I myself have done a bike list with terminators in it using Khan. It works pretty well.

I guess we agree to disagree.

true, nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree

I personally think a mixed list will just crash and burn. When I say immediate threat, I mean 3+ armor, 3+ cover as well, armed with special weapons hitting weak points in my army. I guess a nice assualt would be fine if I could reach them.

Quite frankly, to the OP, if your going for a bike list, do ravening. There is new codex is on the horizon and will most likely be out by the time your army reaches 1500 pts. (unless you already have a lot). Then you could use Deathwing and make a terrifying Death-Raven Wing Army