Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Quick version: Thinking about getting back into 40k after not really being into it for a good decade or so. Have things gone downhill or is it a better time than ever to return?


Optional, Longer Verrsion: Hey Dakka Dakka people. My girlfriend almost got me back into the game about 2 years ago, but after she picked up a bunch of Space Marines...they heroically went ahead and collected a crapton of dust for the Emperor.

As of today however she's been entirely intent upon coming back and trying to actually go through with 40k SO LONG AS she can play Chaos, and given the announcement of the codex today and all I caved, and she's since bought a squad and has already cracked it open, gone through all of it, and seems quite enthused.

She's making me more enthused as a result as well, but I'm not sure if I should just work on old unpainted models or let myself also get as into the hobby as she is (I'm really thinking of getting into modelling mini's, for instance - maybe terrain creation, etc.). But you guys could influence this quite a bit. What *is* the state of 40k, the hobby, and the like these days? I understand prices have increased a bit, but we tend to do alright so I think we can afford it. What do you all think? Is GW suckier than ever, or is 40k more fleshed out than ever, with better paint sets available, etc? Is the 6th edition kickass? Or generally what's good and bad these days with it all?

Buy a Dark Vengeance set and split the models. Sounds like a win-win!

Prices are higher, but so is the standard of the minis (except for finecast, stay away from those. That's a whole other story). I am finding 6th edition to be fun, with lots of new ways to spice up your games.

I'd suggest it. I've found the game is more entertaining now.

It will be different, but if you can find a battle brother to throw down with, then by all means. As it's been said, get a starter set, split the forces, share the rulebook.

I also forward the notion to stay away from finecast. If you see something you like, look at the older iterations and try to find some in the swap shop, or scratch build something.

However, if you don't have someone to play with, go to a FLGS and ask about a trial game. Get a look of the people around you who play. If you invest in it, and you've got noone to play against (or all the ones that do are unfavorable opponents), you're not going to be happy.

Just as a note on Finecast, my personal experience is that the quality of the model for new releases (essentially, models that were never released as non-finecast) is generally quite good (while not as reliable as plastic, it was perhaps slightly better than the old metal models). However, for models that were originally metal and then were converted into finecast, more problems seem to arise. The biggest problems seem to be transitioning an old mold to a new material.

I am curious actually...can any of you guys give me the run down on the finecast stuff? I was in a local shop today and I saw them in person for the first time, and I got the impression they would be far more easily moddable/more malleable than ever before. Are they...incredibly flimsy or something?

They are easy to mod/cut/mess with.

They are also prone to having bubbles or melted areas/miscasts/missing bits from a failed molding.

I dislike the stuff, as a whole, but i don't hate it. Some models are nicer in finecast, as the metal ones were so stupidly topheavy (looking at you, zoanthrope! )

If you have a dodgy one,. take it back to the shop and ask for a replacement. It might take several tries.

Or you could just come on here and whinge about it being the worst thing since they cancelled MASH

One thing that has vexed folk is that when a model goes to finecast it's cost generally goes up, which when combined with having to return it a few times to get a good cast can be very aggravating.

I've only had one or two problems with finecast, the occasional minor bubble that needs filling with superglue or liquid greenstuff pales in comparison to the vast number of metal vents in inconvenient places or the need of a hacksaw just to construct a model (I'm looking at you thunderfire cannon) or hell, models that will forever be unbalanced/prone to tipping and breaking/chipping.

Finecast is an excellent material, the details are crisper even on the models where they just switched the mold from metal to finecast and the stuff they've made with finecast in mind has in many cases been absolutely stunning detail wise. As has been said...if you happen to get a model with actual missing detail (you know...not OMG THERE'S A PINHOLE BUBBLE IN THE LEG BURN FINECRAP!) it's no different than miscast/mispacked metals, you take it back or call them and they give you a replacement.

Ahh...well if you can generally bring it back to a GW store for a replacement then indeed that doesn't sound too bad! So am I assuming that they aren't weak or flimsy, and as such they are generally - when their molding did not fail - of good or great quality?

A perfect cast is very nice and crisp.

Hard to find sometimes though.

The material is more damagable than plastic, so take care.

Yeah I can see that being a hand-in-hand sort of problem i guess o.o Hard to find? That sucks....gleh. Well one can hope, and hopefully tweak with green stuff...

Thanks anyway sir

My experience with fine case

- Defects in the form of bubbles and thin points are to be expected (this is bad).
- The stuff breaks insanely easy
- This is a total rumor that I have no experience with, but I've heard finecast is damaged by degreasers, which is a prime way to clean off paint and break down super glue fairly quickly.

While I do think some models benefit from being in finecast (like the zoenthrope), that's not enough to make me want to buy it. I also don't like how the stuff is expected to be damaged, and GW now sells that liquid green stuff to fix it. If I'm going to pay a premium for something, I don't expect to have to repair it out of the box, and I don't want to go back to the store to make sure I get a right one, or feel like taking one home without taking it out of the box and inspecting every inch is a requirement. I've never had problems with metal models besides the rare occasion where the mold alignment was bad, but that was simply a matter of sanding. I'm not filling gaping holes and reforming thin pieces like swords and all that.

My advice is take the plunge, get a single figure, see what you think.

Rrg....that is depressing now :( They've been out longer than a year so I'd assume you guys would say they won't be improving for as long as they exist. And personally given how they've been making sure to methodically replace every single one of their line with finecast, I can see the generally angered state of people....grrr.

....

...Well anyway! How about another topic? Rofl - what about 6th edition? What else is new besides pyshic cards and the ability to use grenades as weapons in the shooting phase? I heard something about Allies...?

EDIT/PS: Also I'm mainly an Imperial Guard player; do you guys think the IG will be updated this year? Next? ...any idea at all? If not, do you guys have any idea what armies are to be updated next in line for GW, or where I could go to find out?

Well, 40k, it costs my money, it costs my time, it costs my life (wife).

I doubt guard will be getting a new codex any time soon... theirs was just updated within the last few years. I'd say it'll be at least a few more before their turn comes around again.

Fair enough - I can live with it. I'm thinking mass, mass conscripts...who's with me? >

Also I just heard that in the new edition you can bring your own fortification to a fight or something...? How could that ever fit in your deployment zone? How does it work?

You should really just invest in the Dark Vengence box.

You'll geta bunch of good looking models and all the rules.

To sum up the basic "neat" things:

Allies are indeed available. Questionable alliance choices, limited units from the allied codex.

Fortifications are actually sold as models so they fit in deployment zones just fine.

There are mountains of oddball rules that cause a lot of random rolls and situations.

If you and your opponents like to make your own terrain there are plenty of rules on how to fit basically any terrain type into a terrain piece.

I think it is a great time to get back into the game with 6th edition just released.

Do research into local tournies before throwing too much money into forts. I've seen quite a few local ones that do not allow them.

 DeffDred wrote:
You should really just invest in the Dark Vengence box.

You'll geta bunch of good looking models and all the rules.

To sum up the basic "neat" things:

Allies are indeed available. Questionable alliance choices, limited units from the allied codex.

Fortifications are actually sold as models so they fit in deployment zones just fine.

There are mountains of oddball rules that cause a lot of random rolls and situations.

If you and your opponents like to make your own terrain there are plenty of rules on how to fit basically any terrain type into a terrain piece.

If the lady actually finishes her Chaos squad, then absolutely I will - I'd say it's on, past then Rather psyched about it too; it seems bloody awesome x50. LOVE the models!!!! As in my god those are some downright amazing models. I really hope she finishes that squad lol...

Also I must inquire - I've converted my Conscript idea into basically coming up with a poor, rag-tag militia of civilians banding together to help my Imperial Guard army, and they will fight as conscripts. I've been scouring the GW site for models, and so far it seems like Necromunda stuff may be my best bet...but does anyone have any suggestions for this sort of thing?

Additionally the lady and I generally like to play games that have a lot of lore intertwined with the goings-on; I'm thinking 40k Planetary Empires is the best idea for that...but how does that stuff go? Have you guys ever done anything Dungeons + Dragon's-y for 40k? Or how do you guys inject story into your games/campaigns these days now with 6th edition (house games or what not)?

There is RPG 40k out there.

I've run a Cyberpunk 2020 campaign set in the lower sections of a hive world before also, and a D20 Future game along the same lines

You can always make up your own custom missions/special rules.

The game i played yesterday began as a normal surface fight. until i breached the gates of the hive, then continued for seven levels underground, in a warren built with d and d scenery tiles, defended against my orks by Eldar, Dark Eldar and Space Wolves, until my Orks finally reached the generator room and blew it up (ended game in my favour )

It took 9 hours, and it was gripping. It wasn't just the usual 5 round slog over the planet billiard ball, and the custom rules added spice. Flamers are freaking brutal when your mobs are packed into a 2'' wide corridor maze It also limits the number of folks that could fight, making it possible for a small group of termies to hold the entrace to a room for ages before going down.

 Ascalam wrote:
There is RPG 40k out there.

I've run a Cyberpunk 2020 campaign set in the lower sections of a hive world before also, and a D20 Future game along the same lines

You can always make up your own custom missions/special rules.

The game i played yesterday began as a normal surface fight. until i breached the gates of the hive, then continued for seven levels underground, in a warren built with d and d scenery tiles, defended against my orks by Eldar, Dark Eldar and Space Wolves, until my Orks finally reached the generator room and blew it up (ended game in my favour )

It took 9 hours, and it was gripping. It wasn't just the usual 5 round slog over the planet billiard ball, and the custom rules added spice. Flamers are freaking brutal when your mobs are packed into a 2'' wide corridor maze It also limits the number of folks that could fight, making it possible for a small group of termies to hold the entrace to a room for ages before going down.

God that sounds fun! And we're totally into that stuff - we'd love to see it (the lady + I). But I think we want to inject some story that goes beyond military action, you know? What's this Cyberpunk 2020 thing you did, I'm curious? (And where can I find the other 40k RPG's out there? Which is the best?)

EDIT: Oh yes and also, anyone have any ideas for good models to get civilians haphazardly + recently converted to militia? Basically civilians that don't look crazed, in the Citadel range?

Finecast sucks.
GW hobby supplies still suck.
Prices are higher.
It's still 40k with some tweaks.
Up to you.

Gonna need pics of gf to determine if this is a good idea

 Netsurfer733 wrote:

 Ascalam wrote:
There is RPG 40k out there.

I've run a Cyberpunk 2020 campaign set in the lower sections of a hive world before also, and a D20 Future game along the same lines

You can always make up your own custom missions/special rules.

The game i played yesterday began as a normal surface fight. until i breached the gates of the hive, then continued for seven levels underground, in a warren built with d and d scenery tiles, defended against my orks by Eldar, Dark Eldar and Space Wolves, until my Orks finally reached the generator room and blew it up (ended game in my favour )

It took 9 hours, and it was gripping. It wasn't just the usual 5 round slog over the planet billiard ball, and the custom rules added spice. Flamers are freaking brutal when your mobs are packed into a 2'' wide corridor maze It also limits the number of folks that could fight, making it possible for a small group of termies to hold the entrace to a room for ages before going down.

God that sounds fun! And we're totally into that stuff - we'd love to see it (the lady + I). But I think we want to inject some story that goes beyond military action, you know? What's this Cyberpunk 2020 thing you did, I'm curious? (And where can I find the other 40k RPG's out there? Which is the best?)


EDIT: Oh yes and also, anyone have any ideas for good models to get civilians haphazardly + recently converted to militia? Basically civilians that don't look crazed, in the Citadel range?

I'll have a photo-log of the battle up eventually, when i have more time. Bit busy right now. We had a whole back-fluff written for it too, about an ork Waaagh invading an imperial hive etc

Cyberpunk 2020 is a RPG, like D and D. It is a lot more lethal, and set in the near future as envisioned in the 1980's. The ruleset translates well to dark gritty hive-life, so all it needed was to take the background from Necromunda (set in a hive) and other 40k stuff, rename a few things and play.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberpunk_2020

D20 Future is 3.5 D and D, (more of less) but designed for futuristic games. It will be very familiar to anyone used to D and D 3.0/3.5, with only a few rules differences. My group have adopted a hybrid version, modified for Pathfinder rules in places where we like the rules better.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D20_Future

I've not actually played any of the current official 40k tabletop RPG's (except for one game of Inquisitor, i think) , so i've no idea which is best. I'm sure someone will have an opinion though

Citadel doesn't really do civilians these days, and culties are usually crazed. You could try to fins some of the old Necromunda models. Not all of them look like they are off their meds

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necromunda

Wish my wife was so enthusiastic about 40K /kickrocks

If you have the disposable income and desire/means to play, I say go for it!

With the inclusion of the new edition and especially the leaps and bounds that both FW/GW have made in model quality and the joining of both rulesets to allow for integrated play make it a great time to be a 40k player, fair enough 6th edition does have a few kinks that need Ironed out, but I would say as a wargamer of the past 10+ years, I've never been as excited about the hobbby as I am now, although the new Horus Heresy stuff is a major part of that

(Picked up some Catraphractii Termies and Angron, Pre-Heresy World eaters here I come )