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2012/10/02 19:57:45
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
He left and she cuddled her first-born and told her to lie on her stomach so she could give her a back massage. “Then I stab her, stab her neck,” she confessed. “She said, ‘No Mom!’ I said, ‘It’s for your good. Let me finish.’ ”
Earlier in the interrogation, Sgt.-Det. Bertrand has asked whether the knife blade was sharp. “No, it wasn’t,” she replied. “I wish it was. I wanted to give her the peace that she needed.”
Bahar survived the attack, suffering serious knife wounds to her head and shoulder. Ms. Kaleki, 40, is charged with attempted murder, aggravated assault and illegal use of a weapon.
Her husband, alerted by Bahar’s screams, rushed downstairs and grabbed the knife from Ms. Kaleki, the court heard. “I said to my husband, let me finish her.’ ” She tried to choke her daughter, she said, and after Bahar escaped, she chased her upstairs and tried to break down the locked door to the bedroom where she was calling 911.
Ignoring the cultural elephant in the room, how utterly FETHED in the head do you need to be to tell attempt to kill your child while telling her it's for your own good?
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
You really should post more of the story if you are going to copy and paste. That snippet just makes it sound like she had a psychotic break, and not some cultural issue.
I'm still fine living on this planet. Where you only see a crazy mom I see a strong girl who fought to survive, and a father, despite being upset with her behavior, that still tried to save his daughter. I don't hold the world responsible for every bad act that ever occurs.
Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
2012/10/02 20:58:14
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
See thats the problem. If you raise your daughters with the proper spirit and physical activity, they don't worry about this, because they could royally kick your ass. In my case, GC could both beat me about the head and face with enthusiasm, and blow me the hell away with an array of firearms, or even just sic Rusty the Tank Dog on me.
GC has been brought up properly.
Usually she just pokes me when I get out of line. Usually.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2012/10/02 21:34:12
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
Woman in the original story is an Aghanistani muslim. Please use the whole quotes to avoid confusing other people. I was going to try to side step it entirely because another rant about how evil Islam must be isn't really needed in the OT, but then this post by Kilkrazy derailed that effort pretty quickly.
Kilkrazy wrote: Ignoring the cultural elephant that only dark skinned people stab their children...
KK's point, to me anyways, is that while both may be psychotic, but you chose to focus on one and ignored the other; it isn't just Islam or Afghanistan that has people that do horrific things.
Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
2012/10/02 23:39:21
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
Umm... it sort of it is, and it sort of isn't, or rather, there is such a thing as Islamic culture, Islam being the name of the religion from which it arises, and/or vice versa. Of course, that really depends on which theoretical model of 'culture' you ascribe to, and how you define the concept. If we mean 'symbolic practices, gestures and ways of living by which we create and apprehend meaning out of our experience of the world' then, yeah, you could say that the commonalities implied by an adherence to Islam give rise to a culture of islam, in a broad sense. In fact, the OP makes reference to this because one particular reading of the story suggests that there may have been a cultural/religious motive for the assault ('it's for your own good'). So called 'honour-killings' are a thing. They occasionally take place within the muslim community here.
Now that isn't to say that Islam is a culturally homogeneous monolith, quite the opposite, because we can understand culture as a vast series of overlapping networks, many of which are acting, and being acted upon by all of us, all of the time. For example, I am British, a musician and a wargamer - three distinct but overlapping cultures there. I am a part of them, and they are a part of me. They are not exclusive of each other, but they definitely exist in the gestures and codes that constitute their haecceity, or 'thisness'.
KK's point, to me anyways, is that while both may be psychotic, but you chose to focus on one and ignored the other; it isn't just Islam or Afghanistan that has people that do horrific things.
I focused on the one that I did in fact know about. Had I known about the other one I would have happily included it and had a more snappy thread title like "October 1st Declared Stab Your Child Tuesday in the Commonwealth" my focus was NOT on the woman being Muslim or from Afghanistan, I specifically EXCLUDED it from my commentary because I really don't give a feth what color she is, what god she worships or where she's from. She's just a fething nutcase who tried to murder her daughter. Same as I don't give a feth about the other guy's background, he's a nut who murdered his children and killed himself. I don't need to know his favorite brand of chips, the name of his invisible best friend or whether or not he was a Manchester United fan or not after that.
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
Many messed up people "project" meaning that what they feel, they assume others are.
Most likely this mother was considering taking her own life "for her own good" and felt it appropriate that her daughter was in pain too and she should "help her" before she goes.
Really would like to see the reasoning of how this lady got to this point. To think you are "helping" your daughter in this way points to a deeply nasty life.
Some people are just deeply nasty pieces of work and are genuinely "evil" people. This one however, was trying to help in her own disturbed way which points to needing to at least figure out what went wrong.
I think as a society we should at least figure out how a person is made to think like this and prevent it from happening ever again.
I have two boys and at least out of shear selfishness I am not going to do all that work and then end them. Like the munchkins too much to do ill to anyway plus who would I game with in my old age.
Deep thought for the day, thanks all.
A revolution is an idea which has found its bayonets.
Napoleon Bonaparte
2012/10/03 20:39:28
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
Frazzled wrote: See thats the problem. If you raise your daughters with the proper spirit and physical activity, they don't worry about this, because they could royally kick your ass. In my case, GC could both beat me about the head and face with enthusiasm, and blow me the hell away with an array of firearms, or even just sic Rusty the Tank Dog on me.
GC has been brought up properly.
Usually she just pokes me when I get out of line. Usually.
Agreed. My Daughter kicks my ass at random when she feels like it. My son is a crack shot, and is usually the one in groups coming up with ideas of games to play. They are on the right track. If I were to attempt to stab either one of them, Id end up in the ER regretting that choice
2012/10/03 20:54:57
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
Talizvar wrote: I think as a society we should at least figure out how a person is made to think like this and prevent it from happening ever again.
You're kidding, right? I think we all know how this person was made to think like this, and exactly what they thought they were doing.
Since Canada does not have capital punishment, the only way to prevent *THAT* person from every trying this act again is to imprison them for the remainder of their life, and even then you have prison shankings so even that may not work. At least you'll prevent another honor killing going this route.
2012/10/04 03:13:06
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
Since Canada does not have capital punishment, the only way to prevent *THAT* person from every trying this act again is to imprison them for the remainder of their life, and even then you have prison shankings so even that may not work. At least you'll prevent another honor killing going this route.
Horrible misunderstanding of what an honor killing is.
Life does not cease to be funny when people die any more than it ceases to be serious when people laugh.
2012/10/04 03:51:50
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
Talizvar wrote: I think as a society we should at least figure out how a person is made to think like this and prevent it from happening ever again.
You're kidding, right? I think we all know how this person was made to think like this, and exactly what they thought they were doing.
Since Canada does not have capital punishment, the only way to prevent *THAT* person from every trying this act again is to imprison them for the remainder of their life, and even then you have prison shankings so even that may not work. At least you'll prevent another honor killing going this route.
By the description given, it really is not looking like some "cultural" or extremist issue.
Let me speak plainly for you: this person was off their nut... erhm... off their "meds".
Pretty clear when the dad is trying to stop things.
Think if everyone figured the only cure for rabies was a bullet.
No-one would have looked any farther for inoculation, a way to prevent it.
People go crazy all the time and many are curable/mitigated (bi-polar, schizophrenia) .
There are many that are not curable (narcissists) which may fall under your methods.
Thing is, when someone gets off their butt and does something drastic there is always a good reason not matter how off-kilter the perspective.
It is worth some time to find out what it was.
Seems a little odd that the person would choose a blunt knife if they were of "sound mind" bent on an honor killing: I am sure something bigger and sharper was available.
I find when people are "sure" about a circumstance, they do not have all the facts and take some comfort in their ignorance.
Better to label someone as a monster than them being a person just like you or me that has been pushed over the edge.
A revolution is an idea which has found its bayonets.
Napoleon Bonaparte
2012/10/04 05:08:11
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
This is a bunch of nonsense. When you are part of a religion or group and the beliefs of that organization make you think that you should stab your child to death, you should rethink your life choices, not just go to town.
Crazy bird deserves a right good kicking to the the skull. As does any other crazy fether who does this who hasn't inadvertently fathered the antichrist.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/04 05:09:15
2012/10/04 05:15:21
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
Bromsy wrote: This is a bunch of nonsense. When you are part of a religion or group and the beliefs of that organization make you think that you should stab your child to death, you should rethink your life choices, not just go to town.
You do know that people of other faiths, and even atheists, have killed or attempted to kill their offspring before right? It isn't as if no one else has ever done it except for Muslims. Honor Killings are more regionally cultural then anything specific to Islam, as well. At best, that came with them from Afghanistan, not the Koran.
Amidst the mists and coldest frosts he thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts.
2012/10/04 05:18:38
Subject: Parenting means stabbing your daughter repeatedly:
Did I say muslims? Cause I was specifically pretty broad on my post. I did that on purpose.
- you can't stop individual crazy folks. You can definitely stop people who ascribe to a certain creed or ethos who wouldn't try to murder their children if their creed or ethos didn't justify murdering their children.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/10/04 05:20:25
