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lately i was playing against a guy who play with ig, he use the same deployment, buy a aegis defence line with interceptor autocannon, a there in a corner dig his vet squads, around tree of them, all with autocannon, and, in the middle he put some heavy artillery, like griffons (i hate the accurete bombardment rule) or a manticora, and use a squadron of tree hydra tanks (wich one were illegals ´cause they only make snapshots aganist ground units, but i recently discover that ) and a punisher leman russ, and complete everything with a squadron of ratlings (always shoothing againts my characters) an a valkyrie, sometimes usa a officer of the fleet or astropath to delay my reserves (the guy really hate my space dogs
so my army list is:
HQ
-Rune priest - master of the runes, runic armor, biomancia (anything is good but my favority its endurance ) and the basic power of adivination 170pts
-rune priest - chooser of the slain, runic armor, living lighting and stormcaller 130pts
-wolf priest- runic armor, plasma pistol, melta bomb, saga of the hunter 150pts

Troops
-10 grey hunters - x2 plasma rifles, mark of the wulfen, naked rhino 225pts
-8 grey hunters- melta, mow, wolf standard, powerfist, naked drop pod 210pts

Elites
-9 wolfscouts - x2 plasma pistol, melta gun 175pts
-7 wolfguards - x5 t armours, cyclone missile, x6 combi plas, x2 wolf claw 291pts

Heavy support
-5 long fangs - x4 missile launchers, razorback twin lascannon 190pts

Total: 1541

The tactic is to sit the long fangs in a corner and the razorback in the other corner, snipe the tanks that are outside of the aegis line, mount the 10 strong grey hunters and make plasma shots
From the wolfgurad, 5 going in t.armour, the one with the cyclone join the long fangs, the four remainning act as decoy to adsorbs enemy fire, the other two wolfguard in power armour, one join the wolf scouts(with a pair of wolfclaws), the other (with combimelta) the 8 grey hunters.
The rune priest with biomancy and adivination, join the 8 grey hunters, alongside with the wolfguar, in the drop pod, the other rune priest joind the long fangs to keep the vehicle sniping, given cover when nescesary (5+ with storcaller), and finally, the wolf priest end up with the scouts in reserve (to preveal the saga of course) and make his oath of war against vehicles, so when they enter from reserves, and with they rule of the scoust (behind enemy lines) and the help of the acute senses they enter destroying any tank shothing in the rear armor with tree plaspistol and a melta.
the problem is, the punisher tank (20 shoots of str5 and 6 or nine shoots of heavy bolter) and the ton of shots of autocanon, and the guars behind the line survive the voyes of bolter and plasma, and when the valkirie enter, it shoot me with everything

so, any suggestion or change to my list (i already use lots of combination but this list is the close tha i have been to win)
thanks for reading and my pardon for the long reading
pd: pardon my bad english, hope it can be readible

How many points do you guys play? 1541 is a very strange amount. Make sure that you're both bringing similar armies - you'll be at a huge disadvantage if he's playing 1750 points, for example.

If you want to make your list more powerful, you'll want to spend less on upgrades and get more troops. It sounds like he's lacking a good way to kill marines - just massed firepower from autocannons, griffons, and leman russ punishers. If you put 40 grey hunters on the table, he should have trouble killing that many.

You could also try out a drop-pod heavy list. I don't think he would like 2 or 3 drop pods with melta or flamers landing on turn one.

sorry, don't know much about SW, but you have 3 HQs under 2k pts.
Could be a bit of a point sink

 anyeri wrote:

so my army list is:
HQ
-Rune priest - master of the runes, runic armor, biomancia (anything is good but my favority its endurance ) and the basic power of adivination 170pts
-rune priest - chooser of the slain, runic armor, living lighting and stormcaller 130pts
-wolf priest- runic armor, plasma pistol, melta bomb, saga of the hunter 150pts

There's a lot of points in your HQ units. Drop a rune priest. Runic armor isn't that good, terminator armor is better for a character that can't get an invulnerable otherwise. If you're going in a drop pod, you might consider JOTWW to snipe out sergeants or special weapons. It's a pretty reliable power against guard.

Troops
-10 grey hunters - x2 plasma rifles, mark of the wulfen, naked rhino 225pts
-8 grey hunters- melta, mow, wolf standard, powerfist, naked drop pod 210pts
Not enough troops for a 1500 point game. Go all drop pod, or all rhino, don't mix and match
The unit with Melta, MotW, WS, powerfist is over costed and over equipped for its job. You're going to drop in a shoot a tank right? So two meltas would be far better for the job. The other upgrades are pointless since your opponent will more than likely blow this unit away the next turn.

Elites
-9 wolfscouts - x2 plasma pistol, melta gun 175pts
-7 wolfguards - x5 t armours, cyclone missile, x6 combi plas, x2 wolf claw 291pts
Wolf scouts are pretty much garbage now. Losing their ability to assault with melta bombs makes them useless, this would be better spent on a GH unit with a drop pod and 2 melta guns.
The wolf guard seem weird, I don't understand their purpose in this list that couldn't be provided with more Grey Hunters. Wolf guard terminators with a SS are great sergeants since they can shurg off the AP3/2 aimed at the squad. 7 wolf guard in is 300 points. That's a huge point sink in a 1500 point game.

Heavy support
-5 long fangs - x4 missile launchers, razorback twin lascannon 190pts
MOAR LONG FANGS

Total: 1541

Your tactics involve a lot of "decoys" which in my experience only work against a newbie player. Instead of a decoy, make it an equivalent threat. This means your opponent will be forced to shoot at one, ignoring the other at his peril. Whereas if it's a decoy, any experienced player will ignore it and shoot the thing bowling at him in a transport.

If you want to close quicker, use drop pods. If your opponent is delaying reserves, don't use them. Try target saturation with multiple small units. Throw the grey hunters in 3 or 4 razor backs. Your opponent can't take them all out! Making everything you have of similar threat value is important. Your opponent will struggle with target priority.

Siphen wrote:
How many points do you guys play? 1541 is a very strange amount. Make sure that you're both bringing similar armies - you'll be at a huge disadvantage if he's playing 1750 points, for example.

If you want to make your list more powerful, you'll want to spend less on upgrades and get more troops. It sounds like he's lacking a good way to kill marines - just massed firepower from autocannons, griffons, and leman russ punishers. If you put 40 grey hunters on the table, he should have trouble killing that many.

You could also try out a drop-pod heavy list. I don't think he would like 2 or 3 drop pods with melta or flamers landing on turn one.

we play 1500 points, the problem is that sometimes he use a plasma leman russ, but i going to try to saturate with grey hunters, thanks for the advice


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Griddlelol wrote:

 anyeri wrote:

so my army list is:
HQ
-Rune priest - master of the runes, runic armor, biomancia (anything is good but my favority its endurance ) and the basic power of adivination 170pts
-rune priest - chooser of the slain, runic armor, living lighting and stormcaller 130pts
-wolf priest- runic armor, plasma pistol, melta bomb, saga of the hunter 150pts

There's a lot of points in your HQ units. Drop a rune priest. Runic armor isn't that good, terminator armor is better for a character that can't get an invulnerable otherwise. If you're going in a drop pod, you might consider JOTWW to snipe out sergeants or special weapons. It's a pretty reliable power against guard.

Troops
-10 grey hunters - x2 plasma rifles, mark of the wulfen, naked rhino 225pts
-8 grey hunters- melta, mow, wolf standard, powerfist, naked drop pod 210pts
Not enough troops for a 1500 point game. Go all drop pod, or all rhino, don't mix and match
The unit with Melta, MotW, WS, powerfist is over costed and over equipped for its job. You're going to drop in a shoot a tank right? So two meltas would be far better for the job. The other upgrades are pointless since your opponent will more than likely blow this unit away the next turn.

Elites
-9 wolfscouts - x2 plasma pistol, melta gun 175pts
-7 wolfguards - x5 t armours, cyclone missile, x6 combi plas, x2 wolf claw 291pts
Wolf scouts are pretty much garbage now. Losing their ability to assault with melta bombs makes them useless, this would be better spent on a GH unit with a drop pod and 2 melta guns.
The wolf guard seem weird, I don't understand their purpose in this list that couldn't be provided with more Grey Hunters. Wolf guard terminators with a SS are great sergeants since they can shurg off the AP3/2 aimed at the squad. 7 wolf guard in is 300 points. That's a huge point sink in a 1500 point game.

Heavy support
-5 long fangs - x4 missile launchers, razorback twin lascannon 190pts
MOAR LONG FANGS

Total: 1541

Your tactics involve a lot of "decoys" which in my experience only work against a newbie player. Instead of a decoy, make it an equivalent threat. This means your opponent will be forced to shoot at one, ignoring the other at his peril. Whereas if it's a decoy, any experienced player will ignore it and shoot the thing bowling at him in a transport.

If you want to close quicker, use drop pods. If your opponent is delaying reserves, don't use them. Try target saturation with multiple small units. Throw the grey hunters in 3 or 4 razor backs. Your opponent can't take them all out! Making everything you have of similar threat value is important. Your opponent will struggle with target priority.

taking youre advice, i goign to add more heavy support anda replace the wolf guard in t.armour, take a unit of five with porwer armour, just given one the t.armour and the cyclone and make it join the long fangs, the others joisn more grey hunters packs, using multi melta, i was thinking to use a aegis defence line with the comms relay for the reserves, maybe use arjack in one drop pod with a pack of grey hunters, i dont know, any suggestion for a character or hq?

 anyeri wrote:
we play 1500 points

So why do you have a 1541 point list?

I feel 1 long fang squad really isn't cutting it. Especially as an allcomers list.

 Peregrine wrote:

 anyeri wrote:
we play 1500 points

So why do you have a 1541 point list?

´cause we dont have problem if somebody exceed the points limit agree, well, at least if its less than 100 points

 anyeri wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

 anyeri wrote:
we play 1500 points

So why do you have a 1541 point list?

´cause we dont have problem if somebody exceed the points limit agree, well, at least if its less than 100 points

So than you're really playing 1600 pt games. as a 1500 pt game requires you to be @ or < 1500 pts

Regardless,

more long fangs

I'd stick with 2-3 Rune Priests but keep them cheap.
Than trade out Psy powers for Divin, take the twin linked primaris and have fun with twin-linked long fangs.

Kind of scratching my head as to how you're losing, as that's a horrible IG list. He's using roughly 30 guardsmen hiding behind an aegis line right? How are you losing objective games ever? He has literally no way of crossing the board whatsoever. Even if he killed 80% of your army, you could still kill those guardsmen easily. Are you guys playing objective games? Because 9 times out of 10 when I see a "I can't beat IG" thread, they're just playing killpoints nonstop and all the IG player has to do is turtle and he's won the game.

If that's not the case, here's some advice I'd give. Kill his troops. Forget all his shiney toys he's got. Unless he rolls big guns never tire, he's relying on 30 squishy guardsmen for objectives. Kill them, and he can't claim anything. Then all you have to do is hold one and you win. Other tips I'd give is that rhinos are a joke for IG to deal with. They're almost more detrimental to your marines than if you had just bought more and footslogged them from what I've seen, but I'd listen to a veteran SW player over an IG player in that respect. All I know is every time I've ever deemed a rhino a threat, it never survives the turn. Razorbacks especially will eat fire so fast it'll make your head spin, and honestly I wouldn't bother with them. Take more longfangs, or droppods, or something.

And if his reserve guys are screwing you, you realize that's a 6 man squad right? Just kill the officer of the fleet (that's the guy's name) and he can't do that anymore. Other things in his list, like the ratlings, are a joke. Focus on killing the actual heavy hitters (in this case his artillery) and you should be fine.

So yeah.

1. Kill his troops
2. Kill his artillery
3. Play the mission (don't try to wipe him, it'll end badly for you. IG players love to bait people with cheap units, don't fall for it.)
4.??????
5. Profit.

I think MrMoustaffa is on to something here

3 x Long Fangs
1 x Rune Priest for Diviniation
1 x Skyshield Landing Pad

Focus fire on Derpy guard not 25% obscured by the ADL with your better vantage point and revel in your 4+ invuln (stupid barrage... lulz). Or just get the "Perfect Timing" divination power and laugh at his Aegis even harder. Twin-Linked Frag Missiles x 5 is gross against most common infantry.

And shove Grey Hunters and Lone Wolves in his face.

Just my Wolf Style™, feel free to modify.

Also, Rhinos are still valuable. First turn 18" or 12" + Smoke (determining on Night fighting or not) is super great for Grey Hunters. Remember, we take an assault better than giving one (Rapid Fire for shooting + Overwatch + Counter Attack). Remember, Wolf Standard helps Overwatch. Yea, it's that broke. Bring it.

I'd Answer Him Like this:

HQ:

Rune Priest
JOWW, 2nd power, Chooser of the Slain, Melta Bomb, Rune Staff

Rune Priest
Divination, Chooser of the Slain, Rune Staff

Troops:

9 Man Grey Hunter Squad (for Rune Priest)
Wulfen, Banner, Melta, Power Maul, Drop Pod

(2x) 10 Man Grey Hunter Squads
Wulfen, Banner, 2xMelta, Power Maul, Drop Pods

Heavy:

6 Man Long Fangs Squad
5x Missile

(2x) 6 Man Long Fangs Squads
5x Missile, Drop Pod w/ Deathwind Launchers

Fortification:

Landing Pad

1500 pts on the nose (If I've done my Maths right that is ).

The idea here is to put the Long Faings on the Landing Pad with the Divination Rune Priest with them to make them Twin-LInked, plus use the choosers to increase their sight radius or keep infiltrators away.

Because you have 5 pods, all three grey hunter squads drop on round one with the first rune priest (with melta bombs). Drop them as close as possible and trust in the guidence system.

On round two, use the throw away pods from the Long Fang Squads to block line of sight, or to confuse you're enemy with target saturation. On turn three suprise him with the deathwind launchers (they work great on bubble wrap guard )

That should put all of your units on the table, where you need them, on round one. you've got 15x missiles to dole out the pain, or to eat up bubble wrap, and 30 power armored psychos in his face to unleash Hell. You could make the secondary power for your forward toops an invul save, use Jaws to try to take out a tank, or drop them for more Divination twin-linked death.

Hope this helps

thanks for all the information and options, i really apreciate, so, i´m working in a new list, so hope to post it soon so you can give me more opinions about it.

Kind of scratching my head as to how you're losing, as that's a horrible IG list. He's using roughly 30 guardsmen hiding behind an aegis line right? How are you losing objective games ever? He has literally no way of crossing the board whatsoever. Even if he killed 80% of your army, you could still kill those guardsmen easily. Are you guys playing objective games? Because 9 times out of 10 when I see a "I can't beat IG" thread, they're just playing killpoints nonstop and all the IG player has to do is turtle and he's won the game.

If that's not the case, here's some advice I'd give. Kill his troops. Forget all his shiney toys he's got. Unless he rolls big guns never tire, he's relying on 30 squishy guardsmen for objectives. Kill them, and he can't claim anything. Then all you have to do is hold one and you win. Other tips I'd give is that rhinos are a joke for IG to deal with. They're almost more detrimental to your marines than if you had just bought more and footslogged them from what I've seen, but I'd listen to a veteran SW player over an IG player in that respect. All I know is every time I've ever deemed a rhino a threat, it never survives the turn. Razorbacks especially will eat fire so fast it'll make your head spin, and honestly I wouldn't bother with them. Take more longfangs, or droppods, or something.

And if his reserve guys are screwing you, you realize that's a 6 man squad right? Just kill the officer of the fleet (that's the guy's name) and he can't do that anymore. Other things in his list, like the ratlings, are a joke. Focus on killing the actual heavy hitters (in this case his artillery) and you should be fine.

So yeah.

1. Kill his troops
2. Kill his artillery
3. Play the mission (don't try to wipe him, it'll end badly for you. IG players love to bait people with cheap units, don't fall for it.)
4.??????
5. Profit.

you´re right, we always plays to kill points, well kind of jeje (we really play to anihilated the other) wen we play to objectives, i always make vet butter with my grey hunters, blow tanks and sit calm drinking fenrisian ale in the objective objective; about their officer, keep it in a quimera, behin the aegis, so its so dam lucky with his 5+ cover save, other point is that i dont have to many long fangs (i only have 5, not squadrons, but only five long fangs jeje ), but i´m about to get more.

so thanks again for all the responces, i didn´t that my post gonna make some noise, but thaks, i aprecciate this community, so hope tomorrow post my new list