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Noble (BSB)/ Great weapon, AOC – 143
Mage (WL 2)/shadow, Silver wand, Dispel scroll – 165
24 Lothern sea guard/ shields, full CMD – 337
10 Sword masters of Hoeth/ full CMD –175
10 sword masters of Hoeth/ full CMD, banner of sorcery – 225
Bolt thrower – 100
Great eagle - 50
Great eagle - 50

My plan is to run both the characters in the LSG with the 2 sword master squads avoiding shooting and getting into combat early and the two eagles helping with combat res and also warmachine hunting.
The bolt thrower is there to help shoot at monsters/chariots. I also have 5 points left over with nothing to spend it on.
CC please and help needed.

I like it, its small and compact however a small number of niggles.

Banner of Sorcery - for this small scale army and low levels of magic users and levels I think that it is perhaps not required, you're likely to only get off 1-2 spells a turn and with only the one mage the points are probably better spent elsewhere

IF you really want to keep it in the list I would invest in Phoenix Guard as the 'natural' ward save that the unit has would be a better choice.

The Swordmasters without magic banner, I would drop the Standard Bearer and look at investing in the Amulet of Light for the unit champion to give one of the units magical attacks for those nasty ethereal units

I think the eagles won't really help in the CR Department.
Their use is much more specific, e.g - mage/warmachine hunting or diverting charges, stuff like that . I think you'd be better off with a chariot or so.

Like Carpe said, Banner of Sorcery is a bit expensive for a game this size.

Also, be warned that Swordmasters are very, very frail, even in melee. They are the best example of a glass cannon.

I would advise trying out the different special infantry units and seeing which fits you better, and play combos with them (i find a sizeable PG anvil with a flanking force of Swordmasters does wonders, for example)

Ok thanks for the replies.
So I was thinking maybe drop the banner of sorcery and one sea guard to boost one of the sword masters squad to 14 (2 ranks of 7 to get those corner hits) then drop the other sword master squad for a unit of 10 phoenix guard. Or do you think that white lions will be better in these points games?

Your mage cannot have both a silver wand and a dispel scroll; both are arcane items, of which you are allowed a max of one (like all magic item types).

In 8th edition big units are what win the games sadly. If you really want sword masters go for atleast 25 but keep in mind the swordmasters will not be able to avoid shooting in an army this small. Again like everyone else drop the banner of sorcery. I would say 20 Pheonix Guard will serve you best. And the bolt thrower at this point range, won't be too effective since its main strength is hitting toughness 5-6 guys for multiple wounds. I'd take 100 points worth of archer's to optimize the selection. The eagles are hit and miss but if you face someone with a sorcerer or something else scary out by its lonesome, they will eat it up, or maybe you can get lucky enough to get in the rear of something.

Yeah i play tested the bolt thrower and it didn't seem to do very good.
So if i drop that and the dispell scroll I might be able to get a big phoenix guard unit if i drop one squad of sword masters aswell.
Would a ward save on my mage be helpful as well?

Honestly with a wizard a ward save is never a bad idea, even if he's in a unit he can still fail a look out sir and get shot in the face, and ya the bad thing about bolt throwers is they are only useful against big monsters t5+ or basic troops that are T4. Other wise you will get a lot more bang for your buck from an equal amount of archers. I generally only use them vs brets to impale or volley cav (s6 prenetrating multiple wounds or x6 s4 ap is pretty sweet), beastmen or ogres.

Ok heres another list thanks for the replies.
Noble (BSB)/ Great weapon, AOC – 143
Mage (WL 2)/ Silver wand – 145
23 Lothern sea guard/ shields, full CMD – 324
20 phoenix guard/ full CMD –325
12 sword masters of Hoeth/ full CMD – 205
Great eagle - 50
Great eagle - 50

The list isn't bad at all, but you do seem to have two bunkers for your mage, the sea guard and the phoenix guard. Phoenix guards do an immensely fantastic job at tarpiting; a unit wide 4+ ward save, causing fear, and a natural leadership of 9 all help you stay in battle for a good long while. However, assuming a standard 5x4 formation, 11 str 4 sttacks (even with high ws and rerolls) isn't going to kill a ton in return. Make sure you have the sword masters and eagles ready for flank and\or rear charges.

Are you still taking shadow on your mage? You have an option open to you at this points level that you haven't explored yet, and that's the archmage instead of the mage.

I've got your list coming in at 1242 total. If you use the phoenix as a bunker, and don't want to lose ranged attacks, try archers. For points sake, take 24 archers with light armor, a banner, and a musician, along with banner of eternal flame. Preference can vary, but I'd run them 7x3 or 2x12 to maximize the shots you get, just remember to reform for max ranks if they're going to be charged. Longer range than seaguard, and flaming arrows sure do help get rid of regen saves (and if you wither your target, even better).

That should get your core to 313, only .5 over your min required. For the rest, I'd drop one eagle, 2 sword masters, and 2 phoenix guard (along with the mage), pick up an archmage, give him the seerstaff of saphery, take the lore of life, cherry pick regrowth, vines, and your choice of others.

That gives you a bunker for the bsb and archmage in the 18 phoenix guard, 10 swordmasters to flank and counter charge with, a bunch of archers to clear chaff and help with weaker targets, an eagle to redirect, a a lvl 3 mage that (when done properly) can ignore all miscast on a 2+, can bring back between 2 and 7 models every magic phase, and has the option of being a true nightmare with either picking dwellers or opting to make one of your units have seriously increased toughness. Trust me, mindrazor and wither are to be feared by most, but NO ONE want's to face T7 high elves in combat. I mean think about it, most great weapon character would need 5's or 6's to cause a wound, and that's assuming they're alive and hit you!

Food for thought.

For a simplified listing of the above:
Noble (BSB)/Great weapon, AoC - 143
Archmage (WL 3)/Seerstaff of Saphery - 255
Archers x 24/Light Armour/Musician/Banner/Banner of Eternal Flame - 313
Phoenix Guard x 18/Full CMD - 300
Sword Masters x 10/Full CMD - 180
Great Eagle - 50

Total - 1241, 9 points for something isn't much. I'd vote for the Ironcurse Icon, and give it to your Sword Masters leader. a 6+ ward save doesn't seem like much, but if you use it and save even one Sword Master from death, it just paid for itself twice over.

Aipoch is spot on, due to the cost of highelves you are going to need regrowth, and dwellers below is going to be great. You want to ressurect as much as possible if you use swordmasters since they tend to die if they are even looked at.

(edit) Though dwellers is fairly useless in 1250, food for thought in higher point games.

Thanks Aipoch thats a really nice list ill get to play test the list over the weekend with both lists. I like your idea on the archmage being able to dominate at this points level, not sure on the lore since i took out the banner of sorcery shadow seems a little too costly if I get low dice. I was mainly thinking Life, fire or light. Would the Seerstaff be really necessary or will the silver wand and a ward save be better?

@Aipoch, why Light armour on the archers? I ask this out of cheer curiosity, as it's always seemed like a waste of points to me - I wanna know other player's reasons for it

Apart from that (and if you liberate the points of the light armour) why not talisman of loec on the SM champ? It's worked very well a good number of timesf or me.

The LA on archers isnt really needed since in a lower point game you won't find many fast troops trying to barrel down on your archers. The extra points saved can give you something else like a minor magical item or another special unit in a regiment. Overall just weight your options, if you have nothing that you can say ooo that's a good use of points for, then give them the armour, otherwise go with a different option. they arent going to survive melee combat if it comes down to it anyways.

Tookyflakes wrote:
The LA on archers isnt really needed since in a lower point game you won't find many fast troops trying to barrel down on your archers. The extra points saved can give you something else like a minor magical item or another special unit in a regiment. Overall just weight your options, if you have nothing that you can say ooo that's a good use of points for, then give them the armour, otherwise go with a different option. they arent going to survive melee combat if it comes down to it anyways.

If you take the LA away you get more than enough points for say, a War banner, or something alike. I just don't think it's really worth it. The numbers alone should provide a deterrent for any fast unit (reform into a "proper" ranked unit and that's +2 CR right there)

@ Yojiro definately what I was getting at. Too many better things in a small point game to use the points on. Though a war banner and proper ranks alone will definately be pretty nasty for the first round, they won't run atleast till 2nd or 3rd CC phase, and you may be able to slow down what ever enough to save them, or maybe even kill something.

A 1250 game requires, by virtue of the rules, 25% minimum core. High Elf core choices, by and large, are a hinderance. The OP seemed to have a desire to have some shooting, and I've always found a little shooting to be useful as well, if nothing else than to get rid of chaff. He needs 312.5 points worth of core. Giving the archers LA puts him at 313, which leaves as many points as possible for his other units; an ideal situation in my book.

Granted, he does have some wiggle room, so if he wanted he could have a couple extra archers instead. Either way, the answer remains. LA on the archers so they are the absolute minimum required points.

Aipoch wrote:
A 1250 game requires, by virtue of the rules, 25% minimum core. High Elf core choices, by and large, are a hinderance. The OP seemed to have a desire to have some shooting, and I've always found a little shooting to be useful as well, if nothing else than to get rid of chaff. He needs 312.5 points worth of core. Giving the archers LA puts him at 313, which leaves as many points as possible for his other units; an ideal situation in my book.

Granted, he does have some wiggle room, so if he wanted he could have a couple extra archers instead. Either way, the answer remains. LA on the archers so they are the absolute minimum required points.

Thank you for the explanation!