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If a unit manning a quad-gun from an aegis defense line can't see/be seen from manning the quad-gun due to it's model being to small to draw LOS over the aegis(for example a scarab swarm) can they still fire the quad-gun at land based targets?

Basically I'm asking if the LOS is drawn from the quad-gun or from the model firing the quad-gun.

The LoS is drawn from the models eyes, exactly like every other non-vehicle model.

 DeathReaper wrote:
The LoS is drawn from the models eyes, exactly like every other non-vehicle model.

So then by that logic all weapons should have a minimum firing distance then?

 Rimmy wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
The LoS is drawn from the models eyes, exactly like every other non-vehicle model.

So then by that logic all weapons should have a minimum firing distance then?

What do you mean by that?

An example maybe?

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Rimmy wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
The LoS is drawn from the models eyes, exactly like every other non-vehicle model.

So then by that logic all weapons should have a minimum firing distance then?

What do you mean by that?

An example maybe?

lets use this thread as an example (and to make sure I am putting it right.

I've attached a pic of my thought based on the previous post regarding LOS determination being the model's eyes.

In this picture, we have 2 swarms of scarabs, and one quad gun encampent. The eyes of the gunner in the quad gun can seen LOS lines 1 and 2, however due to the guns size cannot see the scarabs at LOS 3. this would mean that the gun would have a minimum firing distance.

Yes. And?

 Rimmy wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Rimmy wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:
The LoS is drawn from the models eyes, exactly like every other non-vehicle model.

So then by that logic all weapons should have a minimum firing distance then?

What do you mean by that?

An example maybe?

lets use this thread as an example (and to make sure I am putting it right.

I've attached a pic of my thought based on the previous post regarding LOS determination being the model's eyes.

In this picture, we have 2 swarms of scarabs, and one quad gun encampent. The eyes of the gunner in the quad gun can seen LOS lines 1 and 2, however due to the guns size cannot see the scarabs at LOS 3. this would mean that the gun would have a minimum firing distance.

Now that's really interesting. Not exactly what I was asking but very interesting indeed that scarabs can then effectively "hide" next to an opponent aegis to avoid getting shot due to their height.

But what I was initially interested in knowing was if the scarab swarm(for example) could fire the quad-gun. They have a BS so they can technically fire it, but due to them being so low to the ground they can't see over the aegis themselves. So would this mean that they cannot shoot the gun at a land based target?

Punisher wrote:
So would this mean that they cannot shoot the gun at a land based target?

Yes - you draw LoS from a models eyes (or close approximation thereof). If you can't draw LoS because of a wall, you can't shoot.

The Quadgun is not what is actually shooting.

The model firing the Quadgun is what is shooting. So range and LoS are done from that model. If he can't see and doesn't have range then he cannot shoot.

From a rules perspective that is what is happening.

 Rimmy wrote:

lets use this thread as an example (and to make sure I am putting it right.

I've attached a pic of my thought based on the previous post regarding LOS determination being the model's eyes.

In this picture, we have 2 swarms of scarabs, and one quad gun encampent. The eyes of the gunner in the quad gun can seen LOS lines 1 and 2, however due to the guns size cannot see the scarabs at LOS 3. this would mean that the gun would have a minimum firing distance.

Your drawing suggests the gunner is somehow mounted in the Quad qun from the ADL, which of course, is not the case.

The guy firing the Quad gun is on his base, and he needs to be in base contact with the Quad gun to fire at anything.

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Rimmy wrote:

lets use this thread as an example (and to make sure I am putting it right.

I've attached a pic of my thought based on the previous post regarding LOS determination being the model's eyes.

In this picture, we have 2 swarms of scarabs, and one quad gun encampent. The eyes of the gunner in the quad gun can seen LOS lines 1 and 2, however due to the guns size cannot see the scarabs at LOS 3. this would mean that the gun would have a minimum firing distance.

Your drawing suggests the gunner is somehow mounted in the Quad qun from the ADL, which of course, is not the case.

The guy firing the Quad gun is on his base, and he needs to be in base contact with the Quad gun to fire at anything.

Aye, put him to the side of the gun and he can see just fine!

Or put a model on each side of it and have LoS to every direction.

I just assumed it used the rules for firing artillery(ie both the gun and the firer must be able to draw LOS).

No, as it isnt artillery.