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My friend and i were having a discussion about the wh40k novels and an idea came up about a novel that features the exploits of tyranid characters like the deathleaper or old one eye. We were thinking if the novel like that would be an interesting change from the normal novels we have wherein the lead characters have a will of their own(considering even tyranid special characters have a hive mentality). Just wanted to get your opinions on the idea.
Considering the thoughts of tyranid would be vastly different than what himans would comprehend, it would be a bit difficult, if not a little boring. Kill eat kill eat is not compelling drama.
If it was done in the same style as a Horror film it could work.
I would gather that a tyranids thoughts are not much different from any random horror film villian.
"Did you notice a sign out in front of my chapel that said "Land Raider Storage"?" -High Chaplain Astorath the Grim Redeemer of the Lost.
I sold my soul to the devil and now the bastard is demanding a refund!
We do not have an attorney-client relationship. I am not your lawyer. The statements I make do not constitute legal advice. Any statements made by me are based upon the limited facts you have presented, and under the premise that you will consult with a local attorney. This is not an attempt to solicit business. This disclaimer is in addition to any disclaimers that this website has made.
But yeah, giving the Tyranids a "voice" is a worse idea than the clowns who came up with the Yaujta and started writing the back story for the Predators. Some things are just better left as mysterious and not understood.
Especially something like Tyranids which have a collective consciousness and very simplistic motivations.
By all means, good luck if you want to try to embark on such a thing, but that would take a genius of an author to pull off, and would probably be largely unreadable for most people anyway, haha. Tyranids just aren't good protagonists.
Marneus Calgar is referred to as "one of the Imperium's greatest tacticians" and he treats the Codex like it's the War Bible. If the Codex is garbage, then how bad is everyone else?
"Hhhhsssss"
"Krick-rwar!"
"Clack-click hiss rawr!"
Better love story than Twilight
I'm expecting an Imperial Knights supplement dedicated to GW's loyalist apologetics. Codex: White Knights "In the grim dark future, everything is fine."
"The argument is that we have to do this or we will, bit by bit,
lose everything that we hold dear, everything that keeps the business going. Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky."
-Tom Kirby
And most horror movie villains' internal monologues would be boring too. Michael Myers: must kill my sister. Jason Voorhees: must kill teenagers having sex. Freddy is one of the few who thinks enough to be devious and interesting.
Lately, the mood of horror and some sci-fi has been ruined by writers trying to have us sympathise withe the bad guy. I don't want to care about why he kills, I just want to see it. Who cares?
I believe the nids are too primal and don't really have any emotions and only a desire of nomz. If they did a Tryanid novel I think they would do first hand accounts of a nid invasion like if it was a guardsmen or marine testifying in a report. I just don't believe a Tryanid could be a main character in a novel.
Don't tell people how to do things, tell them what to do and let them surprise you with their results.
George S. Patton : The wode capn deaf klawz Freebooters Shas'O Storm knifes Shan'al
2012/11/17 18:53:02
Subject: Re:Novel with Tyranids as lead characters
"The hormagaunt brood, having sensed prey nearby, becomes more agitated. Their adrenal glands pump furiously causing toxin sacs to drip in anticipation of a fresh kill."
"The tervigon creates a nest out of the corpses of nearby cadians as she prepares to give birth."
"This program has been made possible by a grant from the Ordo Xenos. "
"And here we see a lone Hormagaunt that has strayed from the pack."
*Fifteen Gaunts pop up around the host*
"Clever gi-ARGH!"
*Static*
Shortest documentary ever.
I'm expecting an Imperial Knights supplement dedicated to GW's loyalist apologetics. Codex: White Knights "In the grim dark future, everything is fine."
"The argument is that we have to do this or we will, bit by bit,
lose everything that we hold dear, everything that keeps the business going. Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky."
-Tom Kirby
Maybe a Genestealer Cult book....that'd be interesting.
Six mistakes mankind keeps making century after century: Believing that personal gain is made by crushing others; Worrying about things that cannot be changed or corrected; Insisting that a thing is impossible because we cannot accomplish it; Refusing to set aside trivial preferences; Neglecting development and refinement of the mind; Attempting to compel others to believe and live as we do
Silent and for the most part opinionless characters are more background than anything else.
I could see a book where a space marine keeps running into a Carnifex that it manages to injure and keeps encountering at various points. You have the knowledge that it's the same monster with a signature wound (Like one-eye for example) that keeps showing up and surviving encounters, and this inspires the feeling that it's very resilient and dangerous.
Now imagine Gordon Freeman the book.
Picked up a crowbar. Killed that cop with a crowbar. Ran from other cops. I have nothing to say and no strong opinions on the matter.
I'm expecting an Imperial Knights supplement dedicated to GW's loyalist apologetics. Codex: White Knights "In the grim dark future, everything is fine."
"The argument is that we have to do this or we will, bit by bit,
lose everything that we hold dear, everything that keeps the business going. Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky."
-Tom Kirby
Semi on topic, which books actually have tyranids in them in a major role? Not protagonists obv., but like a book about a tyranid invasion. Is there any?
Mind slave or genestealer cult would be a way in if told in the first person.
Could have something like an imperial agent manipulating the behaviour of a tyranid force using pheremones and technology to defeat an enemy army. As they get further into the work, they speculate on the thoughts and purposes of the 'nids.
Mongooli wrote: Semi on topic, which books actually have tyranids in them in a major role? Not protagonists obv., but like a book about a tyranid invasion. Is there any?
Helion Rain is an audiobook about a Tyranid invasion on the planet Idos with Raven Guard coming to save the day. If you look on the gamesworkshop website under Tyranid there are more.
The stars themselves once lived and died at our command, yet you still dare to oppose our will. 3k Eldar project, slowly painting up a Biel-Tan army 1.5k Custom Tyranid Hive Fleet Myrmecoleon
"telling a segment of your target market to go feth themselves and the model trikes they rode in on is probably not a good idea" -Veteran Sergeant on squats and sisters
2012/11/17 23:07:30
Subject: Re:Novel with Tyranids as lead characters
Considering the thoughts of tyranid would be vastly different than what himans would comprehend, it would be a bit difficult, if not a little boring. Kill eat kill eat is not compelling drama.
Would agree for the most part but your quote is slightly disengenuous to the Nids - I would say the hard point is in expressing how the Nids "think", sure they "like food and grass and stuff" but one must remember, they operate on a Galactic scale intelectually, how can you convey their resolve/motivation/ideology/strenght/tactics to our - shall we say "Human" mind? They do "eat and kill" but imagine the nuances and thought processes that go into an Inter-Galactic invasion, which the Nids have executed successfully (albeit - on a smallscale! - what if they come full on?!)
The distance between the stars and my feedings seems greater with each journey. Is this because the stars themselves are further apart? Or is it my sense of the passing of time that is accelerating?
I consider this concept of subjective Time as I preen the convoluted surfaces of my brain colony with hooks and claws. It is still new.
It is something that I have learned from The Vechhio.
This is a sentient that I have not digested. I can only learn so much from digestion. The Vechhio is a Space Marine, but it is also a Human and something called a Blood Angel. I do not understand how The Vechhio can be all these different things. But from The Vechhio I have learned about this concept called subjective Time.
I have always been aware of the movement of objects towards a state of maximum entropy. This is an objective state of any thing. This is how I understand the abstract of Time. But The Vechhio tells me that the perception of the passing of this Time can be subjective. I have tested this with The Vechhio and it is true. First I flood The Vechhio with endorphin analogues, then I inject nerve toxins. I do these things for the same duration, and I repeat the cycle many times. It is an objective fact that the duration of stimulation and relaxation is identical, but The Vechhio perceives the stimulation as lasting far longer than the relaxation.
From this I deduce that certain stimulation sensations, which The Vechhio calls Pain, seems to last longer than the relaxation sensation, which is called Pleasure. Perhaps this is because my perception of this Pain is different? For me, this Pain is a simple stimulus/response that is associated with physical damage or need. For The Vechhio this is also true, but it has an added affect of inhibiting efficiency and changing subjective perceptions.
I am Charybdis.
I am hungry.
I have conversed long with The Vechhio. And I have learned much of this sensation called Pain. I have learned that there are many forms of this Pain that are not just physical. I deduce that Time appears to pass slower when any form of Pain is being experienced. My hunger is also a type of Pain, so the Time between feedings seems longer. Thus the journeys between stars seems longer.
I have also discovered that a lack of sensory input is something that I am becoming to view as Pain. I have questioned The Vechhio and learned that this is called Boredom.
I am Charybdis.
I am Hungry.
And I am Bored.
I will alleviate this Boredom by learning more about Pain. The Vechhio has said that if I want to learn about Pain, I should seek out a creature called The Dark Eldar. The Vechhio has even provided the location of a region where The Dark Eldar may be found. Passing this information to me seems to give The Vechhio much Pleasure. It is the first piece of information that The Vechhio has surrendered voluntarily.
I stretch out my senses. I look with a million eyes. I listen with a billion ears. And I find it. I find The Dark Eldar.
I am Charybdis.
I am Hungry.
I am Bored.
And I am Coming.
Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be
By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.
Agreed, but the premise is excellent, Im open to other novels/short stories that have tried this technique - i.e from a Xenos point of view and NO!, the path of the warrior books do not count - pure trash imho.
Also - the story progresses (for those that are interested - pages 1-4)
A full-length novel with occasional segways that go into detail on the day to day duties on-board a Tyranid bioships, or a Tyranid's perceptions in wartime or not, etc could work, but not with them as protagonists.
I could see a short story working reasonably well though.
I think a story about say a Deathwatch Kill team hunting for Deathleaper or one of those extra creepy 'Nids might be pretty cool but it would be way cooler if it was guardsmen, but then it would just be Aliens.
If not for the mediocre who would be great, and thank goodness for those who are just terrible they make even those who are mediocre look great
I don't think 400 pages of "Snarl, grunt, hiss" would be very compelling reading. A short story done as sort of a poetic stream of consciousness could work, but there's not much potential for a cohesive narrative with bugs.
Brother SRM wrote: I don't think 400 pages of "Snarl, grunt, hiss" would be very compelling reading. A short story done as sort of a poetic stream of consciousness could work, but there's not much potential for a cohesive narrative with bugs.
There can be, but it would take quite a bit of artistic licence to get it to work.
"Did you notice a sign out in front of my chapel that said "Land Raider Storage"?" -High Chaplain Astorath the Grim Redeemer of the Lost.
I sold my soul to the devil and now the bastard is demanding a refund!
We do not have an attorney-client relationship. I am not your lawyer. The statements I make do not constitute legal advice. Any statements made by me are based upon the limited facts you have presented, and under the premise that you will consult with a local attorney. This is not an attempt to solicit business. This disclaimer is in addition to any disclaimers that this website has made.
I think it would have to be written in a really left-of-center way for it to be interesting, and that would wear itself out after too long. As I said, a short story (or even a novella!) could work.
Check out my Youtube channel!
2012/11/18 19:16:53
Subject: Re:Novel with Tyranids as lead characters
Maybe if it were narrated like Gollum from the Hobbit.
Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
Mother earth is pregnant for the third time, for y'all have knocked her up. I have tasted the maggots in the mind of the universe, but I was not offended. For I knew I had to rise above it all, or drown in my own gak.
As a die-hard Tyranid fan for over a decade, the idea of a story from a Tyranid point of view makes me cringe. No. Just no.
Part of the allure of Tyranids is that they are utterly-alien and inhuman. In a galaxy of nothing but different colored humans fighting each other, Tyranids are the closest things to aliens 40k has. A novel from a Tyranid perspective, which is impossible, would severely degrade that.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/11/18 19:49:08
"To crush your opponents, see their figures removed from the table and to hear the lamentations of TFG." -Zathras
Your honor is your life, let non dispute it! 
The wode
capn deaf klawz Freebooters 
Shas'O Storm knifes Shan'al 
The stars themselves once lived and died at our command, yet you still dare to oppose our will. 
