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p butcher 6wj ( reason for him is because of full throttle and because he can go toe to toe with almost anyone )

conquest 19 ( sheer brute force and for strat )

devastator 9 ( cannon ball~)

fenris 5 ( because he is awesome )

and 8 more points to play with, but i don't know what to add because i font have many models ( i have boom howler and co, man o war, man o war kovnik, man hunter, Juggernaut and destroyer, war dog, and vlad 3 ( who i can probably use as the uhla solo) )

what i plan to do is to start off with conquest shooting things down, so that they have a hard time getting to me, when they get say 11 inches or so away, conquest will throw the devastator 9 inches with a 2 handed throw and then devastator will charge, rain of death , est butcher will just do what he does, and fenris is to charge something i want double dead, problem is i don't know what else to add and i only have limited models if i had the choice it would be wintergard with ua but i don't have that


what i think i can add is

uhlan kovnik markov for mor fast field units for just field control to wipe up anything trying to run ( 4 )

man hunter, because i got the points he will be kinda useless though ( 2 )

and the war dog (1 )

but i'm leaving what i do to you

comments?

Take a manhunter and Iron fang pikemen, really unusual list, good luck with it. I would love to see and army pic when your done

 YELLOWBLADES wrote:
Take a manhunter and Iron fang pikemen, really unusual list, good luck with it. I would love to see and army pic when your done

well... small problem dont got pikemn $82 for 10 man squad, insane

I'd change out the devastator for a Jug, you already have a shooty jack you need something that can get ax to face.
for 8 points if your looking for unusual, you could through in Great Bears (amazing under pButchers feet if you can get them there) and eEyriss.

The biggest issue I think you are gonna face at 35 pts is that you will get infantry swarmed, the thresher attack on Conquest and his AOEs might help a bit with it. Fenris is a bad bad man but he cant take out a 10 man unit in one turn (unless for some reason they run)

Just remember when you throw a jack it will be knocked down that next turn.....

 darefsky wrote:
I'd change out the devastator for a Jug, you already have a shooty jack you need something that can get ax to face.
for 8 points if your looking for unusual, you could through in Great Bears (amazing under pButchers feet if you can get them there) and eEyriss.

The biggest issue I think you are gonna face at 35 pts is that you will get infantry swarmed, the thresher attack on Conquest and his AOEs might help a bit with it. Fenris is a bad bad man but he cant take out a 10 man unit in one turn (unless for some reason they run)

Just remember when you throw a jack it will be knocked down that next turn.....

ah gak but what if i gave it focus to stand up


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also cant seem to frind great bears any where, and i can under stand jug, but i chose devistator so that it can survive being thrown, and what i usualy fight agenst is a skarn army that has 4 super killy units and the rest is weak infantry that buffs his super war beasts to all hell so what i wanted to do scince he can just use his abilbitys to charge super long distances i wanted to throw a devistator at them and just have him get up with focus and nuke, and pucn them to death, they will never suspect it

ah gak but what if i gave it focus to stand up



You can give it a focus to stand up the next turn....So if you throw him close enough to charge them your giving them a free turn to charge you while knocked down.

edited for revised thought.

If you can manuver Fenris in to charge range of the caster, you could throw the Jack into him to knock him down, Than have Fenris charge and kill him.

hmm but what if i have it 1 focus for it to stand up insted of charge or somthing like that

or what if i got somthing that ignores being knock down

I don't have my rule book in front of me atm, but I am 99% sure you cant stand up in the same turn you were knocked down even with focus.

As to the something that ignores being knocked down, I believe they changed it in the errata that if it can't be knocked down, it forfeits its movement or action as if it had been. I'll see if I can find the errata online real quick.



Here ya go

files.privateerpress.com/op/errata/errata.pdf

A slam is more reliable for this scenario than a throw is if you are trying to knock down the enemy. No deviations or strength checks to fail.

12thRonin wrote:
A slam is more reliable for this scenario than a throw is if you are trying to knock down the enemy. No deviations or strength checks to fail.

no im trying to throw my own unit for the extra distence

The only reliable way to do what you are trying to do is a push (1" movement). Throwing for extra movement won't work ever (you likely will lose what you threw) unless you are playing Gators.

12thRonin wrote:
The only reliable way to do what you are trying to do is a push (1" movement). Throwing for extra movement won't work ever (you likely will lose what you threw) unless you are playing Gators.

how will i lose what i throw? if i use devistator it has arm 25

p. 63 Primal

A knocked down model can stand up at the start of its next activation unless it was knocked down during its controller's turn; in that case it cannot stand up until its controller's next turn even if it has not yet activated this turn.

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Also, giving it a focus point doesn't help because shake effects
happen during the control phase and not during a model's
activation.

ah, so unless i switch to a chaster that can ignore knock down for jacks my pan is usless

 jbsnv wrote:
ah, so unless i switch to a chaster that can ignore knock down for jacks my pan is usless

Yup.

They did it to prevent throwing/slamming shenanigans.

well... pooop... so how is the list without my random tactic i want to try

 jbsnv wrote:
ah, so unless i switch to a chaster that can ignore knock down for jacks my pan is usless

Even you have something that ignores knockdown this doesn't work.

This is really hard to explain but if you cannot be knocked down but would have been knocked down in your turn before you activate, then when you activate you must forfeit movement or action.

But then you might want to look at Irusk2 as his feat allows for knocked down models to immediately stand up if you want to have fun throwing stuff around.

Just don't try it with the jack that's bonded to him because the feat won't work on it.

12thRonin wrote:
Just don't try it with the jack that's bonded to him because the feat won't work on it.

but wont it just stand up any way?

No. His bond prevents the jack from being knocked down. Therefore it does not ever stand up which falls under the wording for the rules where if you're immune to knockdown, you have to sacrifice movement or action.

12thRonin wrote:
No. His bond prevents the jack from being knocked down. Therefore it does not ever stand up which falls under the wording for the rules where if you're immune to knockdown, you have to sacrifice movement or action.

thanks for letting me know this so my tactic is basicly usless unless i want to just throw my unit to be right in the face of the enamy

Your tactic is not useless, it just is not as amazing as you thought it was, which is generally how warmachine works, if it sounds too good to be true, then it is most likely too good to be true.

Throwing a heavy warjack at a high DEF warcaster for instance, is still a solid assassination move, although you are usually better off slamming since slamming does not deviate, although you get less distance. For instance, lets say you have Caine behind some sword knights. Caine is an extremely high def/low arm caster while the sword knights are medium DEF/decent ARM infantry swarms usually used to run interference for warcasters. If you slam that devestator through the sword knights and caine, you will not only deal a bit of damage (most likely killing the sword knights) but you also automatically knockdown Caine, which means his high DEF is worthless as it just became a 7, and his armor still sucks. Now your manhunter can charge him and win the day without the risk of missing.

I Agree, if you can do it, do it

15p Khador

Butcher -6
Conquest 19
Manhunter 2

He He. Just to clarify, i would never play this list in competitive (but maybe in a casual game) after seeing this thread i thought about what other crazy stuff i could do with a conquest...

 YELLOWBLADES wrote:
I Agree, if you can do it, do it

15p Khador

Butcher -6
Conquest 19
Manhunter 2

He He. Just to clarify, i would never play this list in competitive (but maybe in a casual game) after seeing this thread i thought about what other crazy stuff i could do with a conquest...

there is no jack to throw in this list..


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KingKodo wrote:
Your tactic is not useless, it just is not as amazing as you thought it was, which is generally how warmachine works, if it sounds too good to be true, then it is most likely too good to be true.

Throwing a heavy warjack at a high DEF warcaster for instance, is still a solid assassination move, although you are usually better off slamming since slamming does not deviate, although you get less distance. For instance, lets say you have Caine behind some sword knights. Caine is an extremely high def/low arm caster while the sword knights are medium DEF/decent ARM infantry swarms usually used to run interference for warcasters. If you slam that devestator through the sword knights and caine, you will not only deal a bit of damage (most likely killing the sword knights) but you also automatically knockdown Caine, which means his high DEF is worthless as it just became a 7, and his armor still sucks. Now your manhunter can charge him and win the day without the risk of missing.

thanks for your help, ill keep that in mind, im still iffy on the throw rules and stuff like that and things i can do with an open hand, so i could just throw a juggernought into his swarm of warbeasts or infantry they get nocked down and fenris charges and gets free hits on them if their not dead already from the hit

so for a 25 point list to start off as n idea p butcher, conquest, Juggernaut, fenris what should i add to make it 35

Ok, you are wasting alot of points on a gimmick that won't work. A Juggy is far better getting three or four attacks per turn with it's axe than being a bowling ball that's very inaccurate. It's only going to be knocked down if it hits something either directly or scatters onto them, so tossing into a pack of beasts isn't going to be mass devastation like you think, but possibly 1 and remotely 2 knockdowns as your best case scenario. Fenris is not going to solo any Legion heavy in one turn, knocked down or not. So at the end, you may knock one of them down and then you're going to lose 12 points in the exchange for nothing effectively.

At 35 points you want a good tarpit unit and a jammer at the minimum.

Personally, drop the conquest, and throw in 1 or 2 more 'jacks

 YELLOWBLADES wrote:
Personally, drop the conquest, and throw in 1 or 2 more 'jacks

conquest is the point filler, as stated before i dont have alot


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 darefsky wrote:
At 35 points you want a good tarpit unit and a jammer at the minimum.

well thats kinda what the conquest is for, because i dont have alot so the onlyh thing i could do isman o war and war dog to tie up tar pits


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12thRonin wrote:
Ok, you are wasting alot of points on a gimmick that won't work. A Juggy is far better getting three or four attacks per turn with it's axe than being a bowling ball that's very inaccurate. It's only going to be knocked down if it hits something either directly or scatters onto them, so tossing into a pack of beasts isn't going to be mass devastation like you think, but possibly 1 and remotely 2 knockdowns as your best case scenario. Fenris is not going to solo any Legion heavy in one turn, knocked down or not. So at the end, you may knock one of them down and then you're going to lose 12 points in the exchange for nothing effectively.

alright then, so until i get that epic character that makes people stand up, this is basically useless, also i am usually fighting: mercs, cygnar, skron, trolls, and recently another khador and crix have showed up with starter kits at the place i play at so the only person who really scares me is the skron player ( who also has trolls, but his skorn scares me more)

i don't know anything about his army but all i know is that he can pretty much run anything, his main thing is having 4 warbeast ( 3 heavy 1 flying) just rip appart everything and the rest buff his beasts beyond no tomarow

Depending on the caster the Skorne player is using, you will have a tough time in a stand up fight with him. I play Skorne, usually with Tyrant Xerxis (medium based caster with two huge clubs) and the first time I encountered Conquest, my Titan Bronzeback boxed it in 5 hits (from full health). My suggestion is to try a cheap tarpit unit (Boomhowler & Co, seeing as you have them), or have a couple inexpensive throwaway models to try and bait his warbeasts to charge, then send in a second wave of Conquest and a couple other heavy hitters. As another suggestion, a few AoEs can do wonders for killing off the Paingivers (infantry that buff the warbeats) and can make it a bit more difficult to use his warbeasts to their full potential.

Honestly, the best thing you can probably do is give the rulebook a really good read and read up on what his army can do: good intel can change the course of wars.

 Goremaul wrote:
Depending on the caster the Skorne player is using, you will have a tough time in a stand up fight with him. I play Skorne, usually with Tyrant Xerxis (medium based caster with two huge clubs) and the first time I encountered Conquest, my Titan Bronzeback boxed it in 5 hits (from full health). My suggestion is to try a cheap tarpit unit (Boomhowler & Co, seeing as you have them), or have a couple inexpensive throwaway models to try and bait his warbeasts to charge, then send in a second wave of Conquest and a couple other heavy hitters. As another suggestion, a few AoEs can do wonders for killing off the Paingivers (infantry that buff the warbeats) and can make it a bit more difficult to use his warbeasts to their full potential.

Honestly, the best thing you can probably do is give the rulebook a really good read and read up on what his army can do: good intel can change the course of wars.

i know, saddly im not rich like most people are, also he is useing fat basterd, and that little guy so his beasts never rage, and he keeps doing hit and runs, and he has 2 of those brone backs and 1 of thsoe scareyer bronse back looking things


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and a flying one, lots of those wiper guys, and 1 of that inanse light warbeasts charicters