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I posted this list a few weeks ago with no comments or critiques. Reposting for feedback requests.

A little background: I have 4000-5000 points of painted orks. My lists are completely unimaginative net-listed vanilla blah... Kan Wall, Green Tide, Mechanized, yawn! I've been getting my butt kicked. So I'm going to play this list next or someting similar. Instead of LOTS OF BOYZ I'm going with LOTS OF TOYZ. Don't get me wrong, I love lootas. I'm just gonna have a "trial separation."

Comments welcome. The footy boyz are for camping deployment/backfield objectives. Shootas over sluggas because they will GET ASSAULTED rather than BE ASSAULTING. The other units should be obvious:

Mob 1:_____________________124
- Shootas x13
- Nob w/PK (No Boss pole)

Mob 2:_____________________124
- Shootas x13
- Nob w/PK (No Boss pole)

Big Bad Burna Wagon:________570
-Wagon w/Rolla & BSx2
-Ghazghul Thrakka
-Burnas x12
-Meks w/BS x3

Mega Wagon:_______________570
-Wagon w/Rolla & BSx2
-Mega Nobs w/Skorcha Kombi x10

Nob Wagon:________________615
-Wagon w/Rolla & BSx2
-Big Mek w/KFF
-Cybork Nobs x10
-- PK x3
-- Skorcha Kombi x7
-- Waagh Banner
-- BP
-- Pain Boy

Total:_____________________2003

There will be some minor changes and some proxies until I get some MegaNobs built. I have plenty of nobs but not 7x Kombi skorchas.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Subquestion:
Should the Mega Nobz or normal Nobz be taken as the extra troop choice?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I guess it's just so good that no one can say anything bad. Awesome. I'm going to nationals!

I can not help but think you have gone a little too elite with this one. The onous on the battle wagons means some of them will get across the board. However any balance opponent would opt to sit back and shoot or go after the wagons leaving 10% of your points out of range and the first few turns of the game and you don't have the flexibility to sit back with the wagons and play that sort of game.

Undoubtably one or two of the battle wagons will be popped and leave the contents footslogging and a couple of decent barrage weapons could quickly put pay to the troops.

If only one gets to strike home, the contents will quickly become subject to sacrificial units being thrown at them to block them whilst any small arms / melta / plasmas are fired into them.

I think you need more speed to get some units across the board. Chuck the nobz in a trukk; 24" vs 18 if you get the first turn - will also get opponent to target the softer truk(s) and take a little heat of the remaining 2 wagons. Split the mega-nobz down and put some in a truck. Max out on 20 boys in a battle waggon and get something speedy in there to wade in a take out any sacrificial units or just to swing a combat a bit quicker (koptas with a buzzsaw sort of thing).

Better late than never.

Well the best way to make those wagons survive is to box them togethor, so the KFF is literally touching all three. Since each wagon is holding an equally killy things Ghaz will probably the first target. Now consider this, what does Ghaz bring that a cheaper boss can't bring? I feel that using trukks for the boyz will give you cheap shields.

You gain a lot by dropping Ghaz, just by loosing him you can have this.

HQ:
MegaBoss - TL shoota, attack squig, PK
BigMek - KFF, Burna, 'eavy armor

Elite:
14 Burnas - 1 Mek, Big Shoota
Battlewagon - Deffrolla, 4 rokkits, RPJ

6 Nobs - 6 PK, 6 Skorchas, Cybork, 'eavy armor
1 Doc - Grot orderly, Cybork
Battlewagon - Deffrolla, 4 rokkits, RPJ

Troops:
9 Meganobz - 9 Skorcha, 9 PK (Da Boss rides here)
Battlewagon - Deffrolla, 4 rokkits, RPJ

10 Ork Boyz - 1 Big Shoota
Trukk

10 Ork Boyz - 1 Big Shoota
Trukk

12 Gretchin
Home point baby sitter.


You lack AA but by the time it arrives you will be across the board already givin' everythang a good thump.

Bunker, I am considering dropping Ghazzy on your advice. I think that many Rokits are a point sink and certainly RPJ is. Not sure, but if I replace the RPJ and 12 rokits with 2 big shootas and a quad gun with and aegis for the gobos in the backfield.

Jasper, it is a pity, but definitely true that 2 (maybe all 3) wagons wont make it. Last 3xBW list only one got through but was able to take down a monolith but died in the process. The main reason for the uber-elite is once the BW pop, the boys just didn't hit hard enough when they goy mowed down by warrior over watch. This list is a reaction to that game.

Thanks both for your advice. Gotta get some meganobs and Gretchen.

Battle wagons with shoota boyz have given me fits in the past. Don't know if there's a way to work that in or not.

I created this list just basing it on what you are looking at but sadly I feel lootaz are basically manditory currently due to sheer volume of fire.

The biggest problem with Orks is they are in deep need of antitank and that is what the rokkits are for. Sure the klaws can do quiet a bit but sheer volume of fire for S8 is needed. Short of big gunz or allies those power klaws will probably get whiped out fast.

Definitely too many points in elites. In a wagon list, the good point about nobz is it can be troop choice and it can get a free battlewagon.

I think you need lootas or dakka jets just for the volume of fire. Lootas are immobile but stronger firepower so it is a matter of choice.

Burna boyz or nobz is the choice. Go ahead and have one nob unit but then decide if you want the unit of burna boyz or a 2nd nob unit. The other thing is don't max out your nobz... they are good but paying 20 to 50 points for a single nob versus a boyz unit, is not a good payoff.

A KFF Mek and 2 or 3 trukks is not a bad option. Trukks going along with the wagons can be enough to overwhelm an opponent.

I would start with this as a core and go from there to fill it out.

KFF Big Mek
3 x Battlewagons w Kannon and Deffrolla.
3 x 20 shoota boyz with Nob w PK and Bisspole.

Now if you want nobz, plan on
Warboss
1 x Battlewagon w Kannon and Deffrolla
about 300 points worth of nobz or meganobz.

Finally you need some dakka so
2 x dakkajets
OR
15 x lootas (I think this is worse because you also lose one battlewagon)

That should provide you with a solid core and then use any spare points to provide your unique flavor of orkiness.

@Bunker: There are 14 PKs in the wagons plus 2 in the backfield. It's been my experience that a rokits equipped wagon doesn't make up the points. 6 rokits would only avg one hit per turn. And even then I'd need a 4 or more to glance most armor. So that's 1 glance or pen every other turn. There's at least one klaw per wagon. That's why I omitted my normally prevalent rokits. I love me some Lootas, I'm just trying to see what kind of punch I can pack if I leave them at home for a change.

@DAadict: That IS how I started. I need tougher units to walk/run once a wagon gets popped. With 3 high threat Av14 wagons the priority of targets gets MUCH harder, especially if it is long-table edge deployment. If one of three has nobz and the others contain boyz, which would you shoot at? Finally, kannons suffer the same drawback as rokits - noted above.

And yes. The wagons generally make a KFF sandwich.

Not to be rude but if your making a 2000k list with fast moving big hitting meganobs and flamers all over the place, you are doing it wrong. Its 2k so you are open to double force org, and orks love double force org. Take three warbosses and three meganob scoring units, he is what I would do if I had all the models:

MegaWarboss,bp, cybork-115
MegaWarboss,bp, cybork-115
MegaWarboss,bp, cybork-115
BigMekkKFF, burna-100

Troops:
4x Mega Nobz, kombi scorcha- 180
BW, BS-95
4x Mega Nobz, kombi scorcha- 180
BW, BS-95
4x Mega Nobz, kombi scorcha- 180
BW, BS-95
12sluggaboyz, 1 nob pk, bp, trukk, -147
12sluggaboyz, 1 nob pk, bp, trukk, -147
Elite:
14 burnas- 210
BW, BS-95

Put the KFF with the burnas and line up all your vehicles, run across the board and go krumping. You could cut the burnas for another more meganobz with kombi-flamers, you could also cut on of the trukk boys to putt 5 mega nobz in the three wagons to beef up the units, but four meganobs and a boss all with skorcas should be enough to kill whatever they hit.

 doktor_g wrote:
@Bunker: There are 14 PKs in the wagons plus 2 in the backfield. It's been my experience that a rokits equipped wagon doesn't make up the points. 6 rokits would only avg one hit per turn. And even then I'd need a 4 or more to glance most armor. So that's 1 glance or pen every other turn. There's at least one klaw per wagon. That's why I omitted my normally prevalent rokits. I love me some Lootas, I'm just trying to see what kind of punch I can pack if I leave them at home for a change.

@DAadict: That IS how I started. I need tougher units to walk/run once a wagon gets popped. With 3 high threat Av14 wagons the priority of targets gets MUCH harder, especially if it is long-table edge deployment. If one of three has nobz and the others contain boyz, which would you shoot at? Finally, kannons suffer the same drawback as rokits - noted above.

And yes. The wagons generally make a KFF sandwich.

I run 3 BW and 3 trukks with some harassing deffkoptas... Trukks are surprisingly resilient when huddled around battlewagons with a KFF Big Mek... I don't do nobz but the same principle applies with you having the ability to run not 3 but 4 BW.

Also I assume you are playing a 1999 +1 list not 2000 as double force org can end up with screwy lists... ( 8 BW + 2 warboss + 2 KFF meks) Nobz have the heavy hitting ability but lack the numbers.... The reason for the kannon on the BW is more to prevent immobilization throuqh weapon destroyed result. I agree the shooting is ineffective but you want something to prevent immobilization.

12 man trukk boy squads lack any staying power whereas 20-man mobz tend to be danger threats... If you are not going to play lootas, I like me some dakka jets... 9 fairly accurate S6 shots and 18 on a Waagh turn provides critical firepower.

If your going to run an aegis line with the big skyfire cannon instead of the quad gun ..then by all means take a few kannons and some extra grotz to man the big skyfire kannon ..toss a runtherd in with them ..

60 points for 3 kannon, 15 points for 5 extra grotz, 15 points for a runtherd with a grot prod to keep them in line (90 points)


cheaper than a group of lootas and more flexable

 doktor_g wrote:
I posted this list a few weeks ago with no comments or critiques. Reposting for feedback requests.

A little background: I have 4000-5000 points of painted orks. My lists are completely unimaginative net-listed vanilla blah... Kan Wall, Green Tide, Mechanized, yawn! I've been getting my butt kicked. So I'm going to play this list next or someting similar. Instead of LOTS OF BOYZ I'm going with LOTS OF TOYZ. Don't get me wrong, I love lootas. I'm just gonna have a "trial separation."

Comments welcome. The footy boyz are for camping deployment/backfield objectives. Shootas over sluggas because they will GET ASSAULTED rather than BE ASSAULTING. The other units should be obvious:

Mob 1:_____________________124
- Shootas x13
- Nob w/PK (No Boss pole)

Mob 2:_____________________124
- Shootas x13
- Nob w/PK (No Boss pole)

Boys are arguably one of the greatest strengths of the Ork Codex, and you're neglecting them here a lot. Always take a bosspole, use Grotz for cheap troops/objective holders. Or use them as Trukk Boys. Never footslog less than 20 boys.

Big Bad Burna Wagon:________570
-Wagon w/Rolla & BSx2
-Ghazghul Thrakka
-Burnas x12
-Meks w/BS x3

[b]Ghazghkull Thraka is a complete and total waste, as are the Big Shoota Meks. You need to maximise your burna damage and reduce the effect of casualties suffered, and you shouldn't even be firing the Big Shoota's inside on the first/second turn, you should be flatting out as far forward as possible so in the next turn you've within range of its target.

Mega Wagon:_______________570
-Wagon w/Rolla & BSx2
-Mega Nobs w/Skorcha Kombi x10

You're better off with 3-5 Kombi Skorcha's at most. You can't overwatch and at the best of times you'll have space to fire 3 Skorcha's at a squad.

Nob Wagon:________________615
-Wagon w/Rolla & BSx2
-Big Mek w/KFF
-Cybork Nobs x10
-- PK x3
-- Skorcha Kombi x7
-- Waagh Banner
-- BP
-- Pain Boy

Standard Nobz are absolutely terrible, a single Nob with Powerklaw and Cybork body costs 10 points more than a Mega Nob, despite the fact a Mega Nob is better in just about every way combat wise.


Total:_____________________2003

There will be some minor changes and some proxies until I get some MegaNobs built. I have plenty of nobs but not 7x Kombi skorchas.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Subquestion:
Should the Mega Nobz or normal Nobz be taken as the extra troop choice?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I guess it's just so good that no one can say anything bad. Awesome. I'm going to nationals!

@DAaddict:
- - RE Kannon: That's why I put 2x Big Shootason all the wagons. More shots and 5pts less. Admittedly ineffective though vs armor but nice vs infantry. I have one more trukk to build until I can do the 3BWs and 3 Trukks.

@TTJosh:
- - RE Your list. That looks awesome. I only have one footy Warboss and Ghazzy and 3 wagons. Meganobz are proxied until we get a new codex. I don't want to spend time modeling them just to have them nerfed. Nevertheless. Yikes!

@Mr Omega:
- - RE Bosspoles: I respectfully disagree regarding Bosspoles. I rarely have found the BP is effective. I just run away with one less boy when he fails his armor save. When I run my 180 boy Green Tide list I use them out of habit though.
- - RE Meks: The meks are to keep the battle wagon together (ie repairing lost hull points). I despise the KMB for it's nearly equal likelihood of killing the mek. The 3 are an experiment. And placing a single flame template from the open topped wagon and multiplying the hits by 12 seems sufficient.
- - RE Nobz: I hadn't thought about that. The nobz are included because I have the models. I don't think a MANz unit can take a painboy either?


Thanks everyone, I think my list is getting better with y'alls advice!




Automatically Appended Next Post:
@Mr. Omega:
- - I maybe wrong about the Boss Poles. I just did the math. The likelihood that a group of boyz will make their unmodified leadership (Ld=7) is 21/36. So I guess I will (should) continue to include them. My mistake.

DrG