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i was wondering what you opinion is on this subject, would an annihilation barge or a night scythe be better at large unit and flyer swatting? in either case it would be 2 i am bringing. it more comes down to mobility and maneuverability is it better to have a slower but more easy to aim (barge) or a faster but harder to line up firing platform (scythe). i can see not being able to cross the board and get at the enemy troops being a problem if i fight another defense army but i can also see myself being unable to fire at units eventually with the scythe. so what is your opinion?


on a similar note does anyone know if the tesla destructor is turret mounted on the night scythe?

Well, the night scythe can gain skyfire, where as the annihilation barge cannot...

But twin linked solves that problem nicely.

So you have to look at the two of them.
The barge starts on the table, the scythe does not.
The barge has higher armor and pretty much always a cover save, the scythe does not.
The barge has two guns, the scythe has one.
The barge is cheaper, the scythe is more expensive (though, the scythe is STUPID cheap)
The barge is open topped, the flier isn't.
The barge doesn't fly, the scythe flies.
The barge can't carry models, the scythe can.

The gun on the night scythe is hull mounted, so 45 degree sight.

If between the two you just need killy, and don't need 2 heavy supports for other things, the barges will get you more bang for their buck. Lots of AA cover these days and aegis lines make the night scythe dead on arrival.

I'm in favor of taking 2 AB's and 1 Doomscythe.

Well, I use three barges and two night scythes and I haven't had a flyer last more than a turn once I decided to turn on the heat.

All those tesla shots are absolute murder on a lightly armored vehicle.

To directly answer your question: You can't go wrong by bringing both.

 juraigamer wrote:
If between the two you just need killy, and don't need 2 heavy supports for other things, the barges will get you more bang for their buck. Lots of AA cover these days and aegis lines make the night scythe dead on arrival.

I haven't had this experience. I find that smart use of Night Fighting, and Nemesor Zandrekh if you're feeling saucy, can mitigate the danger.

 juraigamer wrote:
Well, the night scythe can gain skyfire, where as the annihilation barge cannot..

Due to the Tesla rule, I'd actually prefer not having Skyfire for the A-Barge. Needing a 6 to hit with the Tesla Destructor is actually a good thing with Twin Linking as you get a second chance to roll those dice that miss and get those 6's, turning each hit into 3. In my experience with the A-Barge, it's a rare occurance when I don't roll at least one 6 when I fire it, either on the initial shot or the re-rolled misses.

I alway run 3 A-Barges when I can. They're great for anti-personnel, anti-light armor and anti-flier work. And the price, 90 points, is stupid good for what you get.

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:
I'm in favor of taking 2 AB's and 1 Doomscythe.

Ditto, I take the same in 1k points and above.

 Zathras wrote:

 juraigamer wrote:
Well, the night scythe can gain skyfire, where as the annihilation barge cannot..

Due to the Tesla rule, I'd actually prefer not having Skyfire for the A-Barge. Needing a 6 to hit with the Tesla Destructor is actually a good thing with Twin Linking as you get a second chance to roll those dice that miss and get those 6's, turning each hit into 3. In my experience with the A-Barge, it's a rare occurance when I don't roll at least one 6 when I fire it, either on the initial shot or the re-rolled misses.

I alway run 3 A-Barges when I can. They're great for anti-personnel, anti-light armor and anti-flier work. And the price, 90 points, is stupid good for what you get.

Actually, even with Tesla, not having Skyfire generates fewer hits on an annihilation barge against fliers. When looking solely at the 'to hit' rate, the Night Scythe, statistically speaking, generates 6 hits at S7 on average against an enemy flier, whereas the Annihilation Barge generates 3.667 hits at S7 and 1.833 hits at S6. The math used to generate these results is as follows

Total number of hits = Total Number of Shots * (chance to roll a non-telsa hit + chance to roll a non-tesla hit after a reroll + 3*(chance to roll a tesla hit + the chance to roll a tesla hit after the reroll).

For the Night Scythe, we get Total Hits = 4*( 3/6 + (2/6 * 3/6) + 3*(1/6 + (2/6 * 1/6)) = 6
For the Annihilation Barge, we get Total Hits at S7 = 4*(0 + 0 + 3*(1/6 + (5/6 * 1/6)) = 3.667
and Total Hits at S6 = 2*(0 + 0 + 3*(1/6 + (5/6 + 1/6)) = 1.833

So basically, even though you have a greater chance of rolling more 6's with the Annihilation Barge when shooting at fliers (although it isn't much more likely, the NS produces 1.11 6 per turn at S7, and the AB produces 1.22 at S7 and 0.61 at S6), on average the additional Tesla hits are outweighed by the additional non-tesla hits.

However, when analyzing the damage caused on the current existing flyer armor types, the Night Scythe strips 4 HP on average from an AV10 fliers (with 3 of those from penetrating hits), 3 HP from an AV11 flier (with 2 from penetrating hits) and 2 HP from an AV 12 flier (with 1 from penetrating hits). The AB however, strips 3.36 HP from AV 10 (with 2.44 penetrating hits), 2.44 HP from AV11 (with 1.53 penetrating hits) and 1.53 HP from AV12 (with 0.611 penetrating hits), all before any potential saves (jink or invulnerable). So both are good choices against DE, Ork, or codex fliers, the Night Scythe is a touch better against AV11 and AV12 (reliably junking AV11 in a single turns shooting and causing significant damage to AV12, whereas the Barge will require something else to finish off either flier).

So basically, while your statement about not having Skyfire is being a good thing is false, since the additional 6's do not make up for the lost regular hits, both models are decent as AA units, although the Night Scythe is more reliable. Basically, the preference between Night Scythes and Barges comes down to personal opinion. The barge is better against ground targets and is on the table from turn 1, and has AV13 until it gets penetrated, but a Night Scythe is harder to hit, is slightly better at Air Superiority, is faster, does not require an FOC, and can carry troops. Personally, I advocate taking Barges unless you were planning on running other fliers anyways, Necron fliers work the best when you bring at least 3 of them.