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I've looked at the models long enough, and decided its finally time to start Battlefleet Gothic. I want an fleet to go along with one of my 40k armies, either Imperial Guard or Eldar. However, from what I have heard and read, Eldar are really broken in BFG. Is it in bad form to use them, especially for two or three people just starting out?

Also, any other suggestions regarding starting BFG, like basics of fleet composition, things to look out for, etc. are welcomed. Thanks in advance.

Imperial Navy for the win!

My tactic was essentially used for line breaking.
So I would...
Centre the fleet around my Retribution Battleship, using its batteries to hit hard left and right.
Then I would send Cruisers in arrowhead formation behind them, Im sorry I cant remember the Class names, but batteries on point and flanking the Battleship, lances and carrier bays in the centre, with Frigate and fighter/bomber support plugging gaps and being where they're needed.

P.S.
I've never rated the heavy Cruisers... A personnal preference only.

Also, when you move or fire a Battleship, dont forget to boom out the name whilst your doing it... Like a battlecry.

The Imperial Navy are one of the standard fleets in the game - they will do fine against any opponent, neither being too weak or too powerful. They're a good force to learn with - you can't rely on individual ships winning, instead it's your overall fleet with ships and squadrons supporting each other that will win a game for you.

Imperial fleets are a lot like Chaos fleets - your primary ships of the line will be cruisers, backed up by escorts/light cruisers and a battleship in larger games. Standard Imperial tactics are to engage the enemy head-on, using your armoured prows to prevent damage while nova cannon and torps hit them as you close. Once you get close enough, your shorter-range port and starboard weapons come into play, pounding the enemy at close range. Escorts and Dauntlesses, although fragile, have significant firepower and the mobility to make it count - threaten your enemy flanks with them. You can add a stand-off element to your force using the longer-range ships, but this will also reduce your line-breaking force. Imperials are not really a carrier-based force, but can put enough ordnance out to compete. If you get a battleship this will have a big effect on how you play - the Emperor is generally reckoned to be excellent for it's cost and abilities, but is also used in an entirely different way to most of the rest of your fleet. The Retribution is a less effective ship on it's own, but works extremely well with the rest of your fleet.


The Eldar are very different - they play BFG in a totally different way to other forces. They have exceptional mobility, and are almost immune to many standard types of attack (ordnance, lances), but are highly vulnerable to others (weapon batteries). They also tend to do very well against some enemy fleets (orks, Space Marines) and terribly against others (Necrons, some Chaos builds). Standard BFG tactics don't apply, but they do still require a lot of thought due to varying movement speeds depending on each ship's direction. The battlefield also has a massive effect - some features make you almost invincible (asteroid fields), other will effectively destroy you without enemy intervention (solar flares). With Eldar, you will tend to either win big or lose big...

Eldar fleet choices are a lot more flexible - your escorts aren't as vulnerable compared to cruisers as other races, so typically you see more of them in an Eldar force, and they engage in direct combat in a way that Imperial escorts don't tend to. Your carriers are more expensive, but also have better fighters and bombers, so that evens out. Unlike other races, you can get away without taking a minimum level of defensive ordnance, as your holo-fields will still protect you. The Void Stalker is a monster, but one unlucky hit can also hurt you very badly...

As said the Eldar are a interesting one.

Used well, they will trounce through any other fleet with compatitive ease, using their pulse lasers and holofields to make them nigh unbeatable.

Used poorly or a canny and clued up opponent, they will be nothing but broken up bits of hulk in record time.

You will get opponents that cry *Aw no! Eldar are bent! Cheese!*

Just nod your head with a sly smile and think to yourself, *Nope, your just not good/talented enough to adapt your fleet to a different way of playing*

Go Eldar.

 ghastli wrote:
I've looked at the models long enough, and decided its finally time to start Battlefleet Gothic. I want an fleet to go along with one of my 40k armies, either Imperial Guard or Eldar. However, from what I have heard and read, Eldar are really broken in BFG. Is it in bad form to use them, especially for two or three people just starting out?

Also, any other suggestions regarding starting BFG, like basics of fleet composition, things to look out for, etc. are welcomed. Thanks in advance.

You will lessen the calls of cheese with your Eldar if you take a very mixed bag of ships and avoid nightshade spamming. Take a range of ships including cruiser and battleship sized vessels, take suboptimal choices etc.

Also, if someone takes necrons, you won't be the one facing calls of broken!

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 ghastli wrote:
I've looked at the models long enough, and decided its finally time to start Battlefleet Gothic. I want an fleet to go along with one of my 40k armies, either Imperial Guard or Eldar. However, from what I have heard and read, Eldar are really broken in BFG. Is it in bad form to use them, especially for two or three people just starting out?

Also, any other suggestions regarding starting BFG, like basics of fleet composition, things to look out for, etc. are welcomed. Thanks in advance.

You will lessen the calls of cheese with your Eldar if you take a very mixed bag of ships and avoid nightshade spamming. Take a range of ships including cruiser and battleship sized vessels, take suboptimal choices etc.

Also, if someone takes necrons, you won't be the one facing calls of broken!

Yeah variety will be a priority in the fleet that I end up with. Since I'm new, I want to try out lots of different types of ships just to get a good feel for the game. What would you say is a suboptimal choice in Eldar, and why?

Also, I was reading about the 'crons in the BFG book, they seem a lot more terrifying than Eldar if you ask me.

I'm told the Solaris is considered below par, just due to better available selections. The Nightshade is considered the golden goose and spamlists of just this little ship aren't unheard of.

If you went extremely escort lite I'd say that would be considered a list that would sustain less criticism and win you more sportsmans kudos. If you do take escorts, no nightshades would again give yourself a handicap in the running.

(I'm assuming you're going corsair, not dark or craftworld?)

Shadow, Aurora, Solaris, and Hellebore all have their... issues. A handful of these should be in a fairly fluffy fleet.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I'm told the Solaris is considered below par, just due to better available selections. The Nightshade is considered the golden goose and spamlists of just this little ship aren't unheard of.

If you went extremely escort lite I'd say that would be considered a list that would sustain less criticism and win you more sportsmans kudos. If you do take escorts, no nightshades would again give yourself a handicap in the running.

(I'm assuming you're going corsair, not dark or craftworld?)

Where would you find craftworld Eldar? Is it the Iyanden fleet list with only four different ships?

I would highly consider using MMS Eldar if you are going with Eldar. It is a widely accepted modified rules document that fixed the Eldar fleets (Corsair and Craftworld). Also, if your game group is ok with you using MMS Eldar, you probably won't get the "cheese" comments thrown at you. I can tell you from experience of many Eldar games that MMS Eldar is so much better on all grounds. Better balanced, more fluffy, and much more fun.

P.S. [SHAMELESS PLUG] I have a tactica article written on both fleets if you want to check it out...

++Tactica: Imperial Navy++
++Tactica: Corsair Eldar++
[/SHAMELESS PLUG]

I've never heard of 'widely accepted' modification, and have no idea what MMS even stands for

Have you got a link?

Move, move, shoot as opposed to the MSM or move, shoot, move from the BBB.

Eldar MMS:
http://www.forum.specialist-arms.com/index.php?topic=208.195

and, yeah, over time it has become accepted.

To me the official rules of the Eldar are badly written and make for poor gameplay.
Alas, I wouid say start out with the official rules first, if you don't like them you know there is an alternative which is quite known.

And to your previous question, yes the Iyanden list (Doom of the Eldar + that other one with the Flame in it) is the CWE list.
Here is an updated version based upon official rules (MSM as we call it):
http://www.forum.specialist-arms.com/index.php?topic=3930.0
(link in it, google account needed).

Within MMS the Solaris, Hellebore flaws are fixed as well.

In the official rules (with FAQ2010) the Hellebore comes playable, without the FAQ it is crap de la creme.

Nightshade, Hemlock, Void Stalker are top of the bill.
Aconite, Aurora are really good.
Eclipse is taken when Void Stalker cannot be taken
Shadow, Solaris poor
Hellebore crap.

As for CWE: it is cruised based no much faults possible. Easy launch bay available compared to Corsair.