Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hello dakka community, Recently made an 1800 points ogres list which im not too sure about and would like some advice as to which bits i can ammend.
Old:


New:


Main things i think won't work well are:

only 3 leadbelchers, probably gonna get killed easily without doing much,
only 4 units with characters joining.

Thanks to any comments and replies, greatly appreciate the help

It's cool, I wouldn't worry about only having a few units, My beastmen usually only have 2-3 blocks of infantry, you can offset this problem with redirectors, I'd kill a bull unit add in 2 sabretusks at least, maybe some gnoblars for redirecting, then add to the Ironguts and belchers. I'd consider 2 magic weapons on characters for ethereal and a standard of disc. on the iron guts. Stonehorn will probably get shot but eh, it's fun and will take fire off your ogres and if it does get into combat will do decent.

Additional Hand Weapons on Bulls is just bad, seriously. Ironfists are vastly superior.

Don't worry about having few units, thats fairly common with ogres.

I have a 2500 point compatitive list that only has 3 units(not counting Ironblasters and Sabretusks)

 Grey Templar wrote:
Additional Hand Weapons on Bulls is just bad, seriously. Ironfists are vastly superior.

Don't worry about having few units, thats fairly common with ogres.

I have a 2500 point compatitive list that only has 3 units(not counting Ironblasters and Sabretusks)

Yes ironfists are better, but there wasnt any space for them, it was either one squad with them and one squad bare. or compromise. I can see no reason why giving bulls more attacks would be worse than nothing all together.

Sorry if thats the only point you can give, but i'd rather keep it to all having something.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hargus56 wrote:
It's cool, I wouldn't worry about only having a few units, My beastmen usually only have 2-3 blocks of infantry, you can offset this problem with redirectors, I'd kill a bull unit add in 2 sabretusks at least, maybe some gnoblars for redirecting, then add to the Ironguts and belchers. I'd consider 2 magic weapons on characters for ethereal and a standard of disc. on the iron guts. Stonehorn will probably get shot but eh, it's fun and will take fire off your ogres and if it does get into combat will do decent.

By 2 sabretusks, do you mean singly or in units because 1 ogre unit is 278 points? Perhaps 2 single sabretusks and then mournfang out of the spare to create a sort of ogre/animal roaming theme. I'll definitely try and get magic weapons, i cant think of why i overlooked them. Not too keen on standards, but ill have a look in the book.

You should never ever run bulls without Ironfists. I am at the where I don't consider them an upgrade, I treat them like standard.

The deal with XHWs is that you only get the benifit of the additional attack on the front rank. The bulls in the farther ranks recieve no benifit. Unlike the Ironfist which applies to everybody.


A unit of 9 bulls. XHWs cost 9 points. Ironfists cost 18.

With the XHW, you are paying 9 points to get 3 extra attacks.

With Ironfists, you are paying for each member of the unit to get +1 armor and a 6+ ward in melee.


If you pass just 1 parry save and a couple armor saves in the game, the Ironfists have paid for themselves in spades.


If you don't have space for IFs, you really REALLY shouldn't be playing Ogres.

 Grey Templar wrote:
You should never ever run bulls without Ironfists. I am at the where I don't consider them an upgrade, I treat them like standard.

The deal with XHWs is that you only get the benifit of the additional attack on the front rank. The bulls in the farther ranks recieve no benifit. Unlike the Ironfist which applies to everybody.


A unit of 9 bulls. XHWs cost 9 points. Ironfists cost 18.

With the XHW, you are paying 9 points to get 3 extra attacks.

With Ironfists, you are paying for each member of the unit to get +1 armor and a 6+ ward in melee.


If you pass just 1 parry save and a couple armor saves in the game, the Ironfists have paid for themselves in spades.


If you don't have space for IFs, you really REALLY shouldn't be playing Ogres.

To be honest, you can just stop posting now. i was being polite before but all you've said is "ironfists or gtfo" I know what iron fists do, i know what hand weps do. I posted to ask advice and how to improve and repetition doesnt get you anything. Like i said, sorry if thats the only advice you can give,too bad for you. regardless i will be looking to put them in with the spare points from taking out a squad and having 2 + animals.

2 units of 1 sabretusk yes. I don't recommend more then single units of the redirecting warbeasts because if 1 dies to shooting they will likely fail their LD test.

Having said that GT really knows his stuff and IFs are very important, if you don't want to run them fine. However please don't come to a message board designed for competitive players asking for help for what is competitive/works and what is/does not. If you don't want to maximize you list to play competitively play what you want and think is fun and don't post here.

If you don't like the advice you are given, don't post asking for advice. I was a little gruff prehaps, but not rude.

I can't make you do anything. feel free to run your XHW bulls. You asked the opinion of the community, and the community says they are a poor choice.

I'd hate for you to get discouraged with your army because you made a poor choice in how to set up your army.

 Grey Templar wrote:
If you don't like the advice you are given, don't post asking for advice. I was a little gruff prehaps, but not rude.

I can't make you do anything. feel free to run your XHW bulls. You asked the opinion of the community, and the community says they are a poor choice.

I'd hate for you to get discouraged with your army because you made a poor choice in how to set up your army.

I think both of your posts have been rather arrogant to be honest. i have said i'm finding points to put the in and remarked how you went about saying it. And i'd really appreciate you not saying "your army is bad because you dont follow everyone else" and it was the advice of one man not the whole community.

Hargus56 wrote:
2 units of 1 sabretusk yes. I don't recommend more then single units of the redirecting warbeasts because if 1 dies to shooting they will likely fail their LD test.

Having said that GT really knows his stuff and IFs are very important, if you don't want to run them fine. However please don't come to a message board designed for competitive players asking for help for what is competitive/works and what is/does not. If you don't want to maximize you list to play competitively play what you want and think is fun and don't post here.

I never mentioned my want to make the list competitive, just advice that was answered via your previous post and an external source. And i also have never seen that dakka dakka was inteded solely for competitve players only either, but regardless, i'll not post again so it's fine.

Ok dakkanaughts I know Yarrick personally and Il give the situation.

For fantasy we want casual games for it, because it seems with every other game our group always play competitive, so with fantasy we want casual games where epic things happen, and as we all know if you go competitive in 8th you can completely break the game.

I dont know much about Ogres (apart from getting my zombie hordes smashed in) but bulls that get extra attacks? As from a Vampire players point of view I know that Extra attacks are one of the best things available for you, and with the statline of an Ogre as it is like cream with cookies that I can only glance at though a window at with envious eyes...

Only the front rank benifits, so they really arn't amazing at all.

So in a unit of 9 ogres you are paying 9 points to get 3 attacks. At the opprotunity cost of not having 5+ armor and a 6+ parry. The 5+/6+ save will actually give much more combat res, by reducing the opponents combat res.

'Zombies being smashed in' dosent make you sound gay at all Happy

Im another player in this LGS, and Im a Dark Elves player. I can tell you that once Fantasy takes off properly, there will be:

Orges (Yarrick)
2x Vampires (Happy & another player who isnt on dakka AFAIK)
Empire (chap called RatWolf, who will probably join the thread before too long)
Dark Elves (myself)
Tomb Kings (dosent have a dakka account)
Warriors of Chaos (dosent have a dakka account, he also could be another Tomb Kings player, im not sure which one)
2x Orcs & Goblins (Hesh_Tank_On & his son)

 Grey Templar wrote:
Only the front rank benifits, so they really arn't amazing at all.

So in a unit of 9 ogres you are paying 9 points to get 3 attacks. At the opprotunity cost of not having 5+ armor and a 6+ parry. The 5+/6+ save will actually give much more combat res, by reducing the opponents combat res.

I can see what your saying because having armour is good, agreed (ive played zombie horde so yeah I know armours good) but with Ogres that have T4 AFAIK and 3 wounds a model (again AFAIK) I think the direction Ogres are intended to be played as are aggressive something of which an extra attack at Str 4 (AFAIK) is great for and at T4 3 wound models.. well do they really need armour? (apart from playing against warmachine's and High level death magic).

@ 'ihatenids'

'Zombies being smashed in' dosent make you sound gay at all Happy'

that is worth a lolz Josh

Phil is on Dakka?

oh no its josh's flyer, what am i going to do? goinhttp://tmanintown.deviantart.com/art/Asdf-Movie-Background-310994857


Automatically Appended Next Post:
keep calm and throw the cheese

 happygolucky wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Only the front rank benifits, so they really arn't amazing at all.

So in a unit of 9 ogres you are paying 9 points to get 3 attacks. At the opprotunity cost of not having 5+ armor and a 6+ parry. The 5+/6+ save will actually give much more combat res, by reducing the opponents combat res.

I can see what your saying because having armour is good, agreed (ive played zombie horde so yeah I know armours good) but with Ogres that have T4 AFAIK and 3 wounds a model (again AFAIK) I think the direction Ogres are intended to be played as are aggressive something of which an extra attack at Str 4 (AFAIK) is great for and at T4 3 wound models.. well do they really need armour? (apart from playing against warmachine's and High level death magic).

Yes, Ogres do need armour.

Str4 T4 is actually the baseline for Warhammer Fantesy stats, not Str3 T3.

We all knew this would end badly when Happy commented.

 IHateNids wrote:
'Zombies being smashed in' dosent make you sound gay at all Happy

Also

Yeah it actually doesn't. It in no way makes him sound gay.

 Grey Templar wrote:

 happygolucky wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
Only the front rank benifits, so they really arn't amazing at all.

So in a unit of 9 ogres you are paying 9 points to get 3 attacks. At the opprotunity cost of not having 5+ armor and a 6+ parry. The 5+/6+ save will actually give much more combat res, by reducing the opponents combat res.

I can see what your saying because having armour is good, agreed (ive played zombie horde so yeah I know armours good) but with Ogres that have T4 AFAIK and 3 wounds a model (again AFAIK) I think the direction Ogres are intended to be played as are aggressive something of which an extra attack at Str 4 (AFAIK) is great for and at T4 3 wound models.. well do they really need armour? (apart from playing against warmachine's and High level death magic).

Yes, Ogres do need armour.

Str4 T4 is actually the baseline for Warhammer Fantesy stats, not Str3 T3.

Personally I disagree, that is a statline for a SM, we are not playing a game of Space Marines we are playing WFB, this will only apply to really tough army's (such as WoC, OK, O&G, etc) most army's have a Str 3 T3...

For happy, 8/15 armies being str 3 toughness 3, 2/15 str 3 t4 and 5 being str 4 t4.
This is of course an estimate from GW site of core units

Thanks there is my Argument, Its not a game of Str 4 T 4 unless your in top-tier Meta in every game, us guys in our LGS are not, however (and that I welcome with open arms) and with a T 4 army with a 3 wound apiece model, I dont think hes going to lose too many casualty's before he gets stuck into combat...

Unless someone starts dropping Dragons or other beasties

 IHateNids wrote:
Unless someone starts dropping Dragons or other beasties

I think thats what every army is going to do though, after all, if someone catches sight of a dragon they are going to hammer it CC or by shooting/magic. Nobody's gonna Ignore a big beast such as a Dragon...

Unless you are referring to how quick the dragon is dropped?

no, I was reffering to beasts such as the DE Hydra, your Terrorgheist and the same equivalents from other armies

Well the same applies to them as well...

Im not saying it dosent, im just saying those beasts will make a mess

Aye any beast will make a mess

Thats my point