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OK here's the newest edit of the list.

1850pts

Lord - PF, LC, MON, SOC, Bike, Blight Grenades

Lord - Burning brand, PF, MON, SOC, Bike, Blight Grenades

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x PG, Champ /w Melta Bombs

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x PG, Champ /w Melta Bombs

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x melta, Champ /w Melta Bombs

10 X Chaos Cultist

Heldrake, Baleflamer

Chaos Spawn x5, MON

Chaos Spawn x5, MON

Obliterator x2, MON, Vets

Obliterator x2, MON, Vets

(original list from this post)

This is what I have found seems to work so far

1850pts

Lord - Black mace, MON, SOC, GOM, Blight Grenades

Lord - Burning brand, MON, SOC, GOM, Blight Grenades

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x melta, Champ /w PF, GOM, Icon of Despair

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x melta, Champ /w PF, GOM, Icon of Despair

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x melta, Champ /w PF, Icon of Despair

Heldrake

Chaos Spawn x5, MON

Chaos Spawn x5, MON

Obliterator x2, MON, Vets

Obliterator x2, MON, Vets

any suggestions?

Ive tested similar lists.

These are my suggestions based on my experience and play testing.

Drop the Black Mace. It's not as affective against certian challenge sitautions or certain units you will find yourself in combat with. It works great on a DP but I wouldnt take one of those either.
In my experience a better setup is 1 lightning claw and 1 power fist. Your lord is now kitted out to deal with any threat and he can still swing and cause wounds with his lightning claw to reduce damage output on the spawn before they get to swing.
This weapon combo also grants you an extra attack because they are both special weapons.

I'd also drop all of the Icons of Despair, they are not useful in most situations.

Plagueknifes are also powerful enough for against most things ending up in combat with your plague marines, you could drop the PF's in these units also and see little disadvantage. Dropping the gifts also would be advised, they are hard enough already without the upgrades.
Id also drop the gifts on your lords.

With all of those points saved, the one thing you could do with is another troop choice, 3 troop choices at 1850 is alittle thin on the ground.

Perhaps look at a cultist squad to sit in reserve and capture a home objective. That will allow your plague marines to concentrate on moving forward and taking midtable where they are most effective.

Id also look to upgrade the meltas to plasma to beef up your damage output. If you have points left a worthy upgrade would be melta bombs on the champs if you get yourself into a problem combat where you cant get through high AV.

Thanks for the very constructive advice. I will try and fenangle enough points to include a squad of cultists for sure.
The only thing I'm a little hesitant about is removing the PF's but you make a good point with having the plague knives.
Revisions to follow when I get home from work tonight.

Any more comments?

looks solid, but i'm no pro.

I personally like some fists. They help vs MEQ as your striking last in challenges anyways.

But I can see advantages to both ideas. I agree with most of what the above says.

As a longtime Death Guard player, I can tell you that the advice given by L0rdF1end is very solid.

The only things I might add are:

1) Consider giving the lord with burning brand a bike and stick him in a squad of spawn. The added mobility makes the brand much more effective and the spawn/ bike lord combo gives you many tactical options.

2) As you have three squads of PMs, why not try a unit of flamers, a unit of plasma, and a unit of melta. The flamers may not seem practical for foot sloggers, but you will find that as the armies close together, you will get to use them. They are especially fun if you get charged.

3) Regarding gifts of mutation, I never buy these. If my characters want Papa Nurgle's attention, they are going to have to earn it.

Hope this helps.

 Chaos Legionnaire wrote:
As a longtime Death Guard player, I can tell you that the advice given by L0rdF1end is very solid.

The only things I might add are:

1) Consider giving the lord with burning brand a bike and stick him in a squad of spawn. The added mobility makes the brand much more effective and the spawn/ bike lord combo gives you many tactical options.

2) As you have three squads of PMs, why not try a unit of flamers, a unit of plasma, and a unit of melta. The flamers may not seem practical for foot sloggers, but you will find that as the armies close together, you will get to use them. They are especially fun if you get charged.

3) Regarding gifts of mutation, I never buy these. If my characters want Papa Nurgle's attention, they are going to have to earn it.

Hope this helps.

In agreemnt also, especially this part "If my characters want Papa Nurgle's attention, they are going to have to earn it".

I actually thoguht your HQ's were riding with the Spawn already, if not, they should be!

They very much are riding with the spawn so to speak.

I'm not sure if I have the points to add a bike to this army without sacraficing the potential for having a small squad of cultists.

Some mixed wargear may def be in order as well but I'm def liking the extra range on a plasma gun while foot slogging.

Thanks for all the great input guys keep it coming

Well, dropping all 3 PF's gives you 75 points.

Dropping the icons gives you 30 and dropping the gifts gives you 40.

So 145 ponts. minus 50 for cultists, minus 30 to upgrade to plasma., minus 40 to give each lord a bike = 120.

25 points left over to do what you wish with. You really want those lords steaming in with the Spawn, that is a definite.

Oh and a lightning claw and a powerfist is 5 points cheaper than the mace so you have 30 points, id minus 15 from that for melta bombs on the PM's and probably throw the remaining 15 points into the cultists, either add more bodies or give them autoguns, probably more bodies.

Or maybe a melee weapon of some kind for the lord with the brand.

Hrmm I can;t wait to hack this list apart later!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Thanks L0rdF1end You've been extremely helpful!

You could yeah, he already has a power weapon but you could give him a lightning claw for those left over 15 points and have him concentrate on MEQ with his burning brand and claw accompanied by the spawn where your other lord could go for less softer targets.

"Thanks L0rdF1end You've been extremely helpful! "

My pleasure, list building is fun and beats the mundaneness of work anyday.

OK here's the newest edit of the list.

Lord - PF, LC, MON, SOC, Bike, Blight Grenades

Lord - Burning brand, PF, MON, SOC, Bike, Blight Grenades

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x PG, Champ /w Melta Bombs

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x PG, Champ /w Melta Bombs

Plague Marines x6(7) 2x melta, Champ /w Melta Bombs

10 X Chaos Cultist

Heldrake, Baleflamer

Chaos Spawn x5, MON

Chaos Spawn x5, MON

Obliterator x2, MON, Vets

Obliterator x2, MON, Vets

Anyone have any comments?

Looks really solid to me gj

Hopefully It's as solid as it looks! I'll be play testing it this week sometime

This only problem I foresee is objectives. Especially a squad of 10 cultists to capture an objective at home while the rest of your army will most likely be pressing out.

IIRC, Cultists have a 7 LD. :( ... 10 of them won't last a turn against something deepstriking/boosting/etc. in to make a late game push at your objective.

And that's the benefit to Zombies :-D

the cultists are really just there as an extra troops choice.

I expect the PM's to hold the hard ground in the mid field

Zombies are great but Typhus is expensive


Automatically Appended Next Post:
If i am putting the pressure on properly my opponent wont want to deep strike at them and if they do they are more than likely using a 230pt+ squad to take out 50pts of cultists!

The list looks strong. You have some good distraction units in your fast slots and your plagues holding midtable will be hard to shift. Last thing on their mind will be 10 cultists sitting in terrain that can go to ground.

I like the list, let us know how your games go.

looks pretty solid, the one thing I might suggest is that you are a bit weak on firepower. The dual lords w/spawn will put a lot of pressure on the ground, so you might not need so many plague marines... and might be able to cut back on them a bit to afford two more oblits (two squads of three) that can walk up and support the marines.

You'd be suprised at how much fire power is actually there.

The one thing that still scares me is a Necron Air Spam list. I have no Idea what to even do about that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
There's part of me that wants to replace the oblits with havocs but I don;t think thye are as threatening

 logg_frogg wrote:
You'd be suprised at how much fire power is actually there.

The one thing that still scares me is a Necron Air Spam list. I have no Idea what to even do about that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
There's part of me that wants to replace the oblits with havocs but I don;t think thye are as threatening

Obliterators, lords, and plague marines may be more survivable, but all pump out less shots for their cost than their competitors. Really the oblits are your only high strength or ability to shoot a tank (without trying to charge) and they can only do that once every two turns, and even then they will miss. I'm guessing your taking the flamer on the helldrake.

Since your list is an assaulty walk up the board list, you're better off without havocs probably but let me tell you, as I've run similar lists, the oblits will be targeted and a squad of three has a lot more chance of doing something and having a heavy punch to it, or distributing the wounds around.

Yes,

but at 75 pts each plus the cost of MON and vets where would you suggest I find the points?

And yes Baleflamer on the Heldrake


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, the plasma guns at medium range and str 7 will take out almost anything AV11/12 easily on HP's

You cut the pf from the plague champs, i like the power axe on plagues if you have the points to spare, but prolly running them without and slightly cheaper is better. Still, worth considering.

The way I am looking at the PC's is that their plague Knives will would anything with a toughness on a 4+ and if they are t4 or smaller I get a re-roll to wound.
All in all pretty good. I do loose the AP2 without an axe or a PF but going at regular initiative and re-rolling wounds make up for it in my mind.
The Melta bombs are there to deal with armor if I run into it.

The only thing I have no idea how to deal with is flyers. But that seems to be a common theme. Hopefully GW releases some anti aircraft turrets that are worthwhile soon. Either that or I will have to start running necron allies

For Chaos, to deal with flyers we have a few options.

Depends on your meta and if its flyer heavy you'll need to make some adjustements to your list.

What works for me are:

Spammed autocannon Havocs.

Aegis with Quad or Icarus Las. (not eough on its own).

IG allies taking a squad of 2 Dettas, (1 isn't enough).

Crazy amount of bodies, so spammed cultists/zombies.
(Your body count is so high that a few flyers don't bother you).

With your list though you should not be concerned with a Storm Raven or a couple of Dettas. A few helldrakes could cause some problems.

I wouldn't be worried about multiple heldrakes. I know how much of a points sink they are and how vulnerable they leave you to getting tabled. FNP also helps in this regard. on the other hand if I saw 3 on T2 I'd be done.

A single Storm Raven simply doesn;t put out enough firepower to really scare me either.

I much more scared of a 5 scythe list.

I will def look at the points cost adjustment to span autocannons. I know that strategy worked well for me in the past. Looks like math-hammer time!

Obliterators don't need VotLW because they should never be in close combat anyway. Cultists should get MoN just to help their survivability (every little bit counts with them). If you can, give one of the cultists a flamer. If they get charged, you'll want that D3 autohits.
Also, if you change your list again, consider Rhinos. They help a LOT, especially since they'll save your important troops from most small arms fire.

VOTLW on Obliterators is mainly for the leadership + you don't want to see them run so i would always take VOTLW on them.

 xSPYXEx wrote:
Obliterators don't need VotLW because they should never be in close combat anyway. Cultists should get MoN just to help their survivability (every little bit counts with them). If you can, give one of the cultists a flamer. If they get charged, you'll want that D3 autohits.
Also, if you change your list again, consider Rhinos. They help a LOT, especially since they'll save your important troops from most small arms fire.

I'm sry but I am going to have to have to disagree with all of this except the flamer on the cultists.

1. Obliterators need VOTLW so that they don't run from getting shot at. They are nopt fearless and are only leadership 8. All they need to do is take a single wound from shooting (in a squad of 2) and they are forced to take a morale check. I will happily spend the tiny amount of points to protect my big guns.

2. Giving the cultists MON is a complete waste of points. It only brings them up to t4, far from survivable. They are a low cost toss in unit for two reasons, to provide a distraction and to be a 4th scoring unit. if I had points to spend on them I would just increase the number of bodies in the squad. The flamer would be a good call if I had nowhere else to put the points but in this case I would have to remove melta bombs from my champs which are far more important.

3. Rhino's are absolute junk in 6th in the competetive scene. I have played several games where I have lost 3-4 rhino's in the first turn before I even got to move them. Why they are junk is two fold. 1 - thye are only AV11, chich means that anything with str5 or better has the ability to glance them. AV10 on the back which means bolters and the such can also glance them in the right orientation. They only have 3hp's which means they go down really fast to glances from str 5/6/7 weapons. 2 - that being said a 3+ save with a t5 and fnp has a much better chance of shrugging off the same volley without a scratch. I can buy 1-2 Plague marines for the same points as a rhino depending on how it's equipped.

The spawn/lords cover the front, PM's cover the middle and the Oblits/cultists cover the rest with fire support form the Heldrake.
I'm not saying it's a perfect list but it's survivability has proven itself a few times for me even with less refinement.

I feild typhus with terminators and it dose very well taking out squads of space marines before they go down, so i recomend typhus and he makes cultists zombies, i know they werent in your list but it could come in handy if you get them. I think you should drop the spawn ive never seen them do much so i think they are a waste of points.