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FAQs have been updated.


Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and

Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles

in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space

Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e.

Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)

A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are

available in the army list section of your codex. The two

exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,

which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:

Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these

Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies

compendium.



So... Looks like Blood Angels and GK lost the Stormraven???

 NecronLord3 wrote:

So... Looks like Blood Angels and GK lost the Stormraven???

What? No. The Stormraven is in their codex, therefore they may use it. The landspeeder storm and storm talon is what they were referencing in that regards.

However, it does appear that Space Wolves are SOL for that stuff.

What? No. The Stormraven is in their codex, therefore they may use it. The landspeeder storm and storm talon is what they were referencing in that regards.

Yeah, this is what they meant, but in traditional GW FAQ writing style they've been a bit obtuse about it all.

Obviously the BA and GK can still take the stormraven. But i agree, RAW says they can't.

Awesome proof reading.

No it does not.

The BRB says only Black Templars and Space Marines can take Stormraven.

The Gray Knight and Blood Angel codex has the Stormraven listed as a takeable unit.

So we have a rulebook vs. codex conflict. Guess who wins.

*edit for spelling

HopinmyTub wrote:
No it does not.

The BRB says only Black Templars and Space Marines can take Stormraven.

The gray knight and Blood Angle codex has the Stormraven listed as a takeable unit.

So we have a rulebook vs. codex conflit. Guess who wins.

Codex.

HopinmyTub wrote:
No it does not.

The BRB says only Black Templars and Space Marines can take Stormraven.

The Gray Knight and Blood Angel codex has the Stormraven listed as a takeable unit.

So we have a rulebook vs. codex conflict. Guess who wins.

*edit for spelling

This is what they're referring to:

The two exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships, which are only available to armies chosen from Codex: Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars.

This is saying that the Stormraven Gunship is an exception to the rule that you can take whatever is in your codex. The only armies that can take that Stormraven are Space Marines and Black Templars.

Obviously an oversight, but more DA-codex style editing. RAW, only those two armies can take Stormravens.

They also updated the stormraven rules for the grey knights and blood angels respectively. Seems sort of pointless if they then decided that even though there is a stormraven in each codex, they can no longer field them no?

 puma713 wrote:

HopinmyTub wrote:
No it does not.

The BRB says only Black Templars and Space Marines can take Stormraven.

The Gray Knight and Blood Angel codex has the Stormraven listed as a takeable unit.

So we have a rulebook vs. codex conflict. Guess who wins.

*edit for spelling

This is what they're referring to:

The two exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships, which are only available to armies chosen from Codex: Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars.

This is saying that the Stormraven Gunship is an exception to the rule that you can take whatever is in your codex. The only armies that can take that Stormraven are Space Marines and Black Templars.

Obviously an oversight, but more DA-codex style editing. RAW, only those two armies can take Stormravens.

No. I am not arguing what it says. I agree the rulebook says none but the Codex: Space Marine and Codex: Black Templar can take the Stormraven and Stormtalon.

But, the BA and GK codex each have the Stormraven still listed. It has not been FAQ'ed out.

Do you not see a rulebook vs. codex conflict?

Well either the original post was misquoted, or (more likely) they updated the FAQ wording. It no longer says 'only' in the offending line, and so makes much more sense now.

We can all realize GW made a poor example of proofing their work. It's very common for them. GK and BA keep their Storm Ravens, SM and BT just gain them. GW does plenty to drum up bad publicity, but this is kind of just creating ripples inside of a tidal wave.

Unfortunately, these probably preclude them from making a more comprehensive update of the FAQ's for February, meaning I'm stuck with the dumbass Eldar psypower ruling for the BAO.

So the FAQ's are now use for plugging crappy books... wow just wow.

What the heck are you guys taling about. Here it is.

Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and
Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles
in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space
Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e .
Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)
A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are
available in the army list section of your codex. The two
exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,
which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:
Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these
Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies
compendium.
WARHAMMER

Lets break it down. pt 1. Are all vehicles listed in the reference section available to every space marine chapter? answer-NO, you only get whats in your codex.

pt2: the only exception to the "codex listing only" restriction are the stormtalon and storm raven gunships, and that exception only applies to the codex: space marines and Codex: Black Templars.

I know that i rephrased it. but that is exactly what it says.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Crablezworth wrote:
So the FAQ's are now use for plugging crappy books... wow just wow.

Yeah, since they no longer host tournaments, you can get away with fielding models made by other companies. You can't get away with using rules from other companies. I foresee rule books and suplements begin to take a larger roll as money maker over at GW.

RAW do not say gk and codexes with the unit in them cannot take it,

thats reading rules wrong (RRW)





Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and

Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles

in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space

Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e.

Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)

A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are

available in the army list section of your codex.The two
exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,
which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:
Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these
Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies
compendium.


so you can use whats in your codex, and codex space marines and BT get to use stormtalons+storm ravens

the last bit of the FAQ does not contradict that you can select vehicles from your codex, it just says that GK's ect dont have permission to use landspeeders/storm talons if they are not in the codex

 Idolator wrote:
What the heck are you guys taling about. Here it is.

Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and
Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles
in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space
Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e .
Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)
A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are
available in the army list section of your codex. The two
exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,
which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:
Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these
Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies
compendium.
WARHAMMER

Lets break it down. pt 1. Are all vehicles listed in the reference section available to every space marine chapter? answer-NO, you only get whats in your codex.

pt2: the only exception to the "codex listing only" restriction are the stormtalon and storm raven gunships, and that exception only applies to the codex: space marines and Codex: Black Templars.

I know that i rephrased it. but that is exactly what it says.

Look at your post. Now look at the original post. Compare the two. Note how the original post has the word "only" in it. Figure out that maybe - just maybe - GW changed the FAQ in the 7 hours between when the OP went up and your post.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

easysauce wrote:
RAW do not say gk and codexes with the unit in them cannot take it,

thats reading rules wrong

You too - seriously, GW updated the FAQ. When the OP posted, he was correct. They've fixed it now.

easysauce wrote:
RAW do not say gk and codexes with the unit in them cannot take it,

thats reading rules wrong (RRW)





Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and

Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles

in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space

Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e.

Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)

A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are

available in the army list section of your codex.The two
exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,
which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:
Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these
Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies
compendium.


so you can use whats in your codex, and codex space marines and BT get to use stormtalons+storm ravens

the last bit of the FAQ does not contradict that you can select vehicles from your codex, it just says that GK's ect dont have permission to use landspeeders/storm talons if they are not in the codex

That's what I just posted. You've got a good handle on it.

rigeld2 wrote:

 Idolator wrote:


Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and
Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles
in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space
Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e .
Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)
A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are
available in the army list section of your codex. The two
exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,
which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:
Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these
Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies
compendium.

Look at your post. Now look at the original post. Compare the two. Note how the original post has the word "only" in it. Figure out that maybe - just maybe - GW changed the FAQ in the 7 hours between when the OP went up and your post.

Rig, Idolators Q: A: is the exact same wording as in the OP. Not sure what you mean.

rigeld2 wrote:

 Idolator wrote:
What the heck are you guys taling about. Here it is.

Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and
Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles
in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space
Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e .
Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)
A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are
available in the army list section of your codex. The two
exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,
which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:
Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these
Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies
compendium.
WARHAMMER

Lets break it down. pt 1. Are all vehicles listed in the reference section available to every space marine chapter? answer-NO, you only get whats in your codex.

pt2: the only exception to the "codex listing only" restriction are the stormtalon and storm raven gunships, and that exception only applies to the codex: space marines and Codex: Black Templars.

I know that i rephrased it. but that is exactly what it says.

Look at your post. Now look at the original post. Compare the two. Note how the original post has the word "only" in it. Figure out that maybe - just maybe - GW changed the FAQ in the 7 hours between when the OP went up and your post.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

easysauce wrote:
RAW do not say gk and codexes with the unit in them cannot take it,

thats reading rules wrong

You too - seriously, GW updated the FAQ. When the OP posted, he was correct. They've fixed it now.

Huh? The OP hasn't edited his post at all. Here's what he posted. I just copied it and am now pasting it :

Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and

Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles

in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space

Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e.

Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)

A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are

available in the army list section of your codex. The two

exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,

which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:

Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these

Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies

compendium.

It's an exact match to what I posted. Now here is the exact FAQ coppied and pasted.

Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and
Stormtalon Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles
in the Reference section. Does this mean that every Space
Marine Chapter now has access to these vehicles as well (i.e .
Space Wolves, Blood Angels, Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)
A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are
available in the army list section of your codex. The two
exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,
which are only available to armies chosen from Codex:
Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for these
Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies
compendium.
WARHAMMER

Identical.

Sorry, I misread them.

Huh... well I just checked again. The same FAQ response appears in the SM FAQ as well as the BRB FAQ. The one in the SM FAQ omits the second 'only'. One of them is obviously a typo.

lledwey wrote:
Huh... well I just checked again. The same FAQ response appears in the SM FAQ as well as the BRB FAQ. The one in the SM FAQ omits the second 'only'. One of them is obviously a typo.

Both of the FAQ's mean the exact same thing regardless of whether the word "only" is present. I do see what you mean though. The writters at GW are quite good. The editors at GW are terrible.

How do they mean the same thing? One says that 'only SM and BT can take the stormraven/talon', and the other just says 'SM and BT can take the stormraven/talon.'

That isn't the same thing at all. The entire point of this thread was that saying 'only SM and BT' implied that BA and GK couldn't take them, wasn't it?

lledwey wrote:
How do they mean the same thing? One says that 'only SM and BT can take the stormraven/talon', and the other just says 'SM and BT can take the stormraven/talon.'

That isn't the same thing at all. The entire point of this thread was that saying 'only SM and BT' implied that BA and GK couldn't take them, wasn't it?

Please read my post, earlier in this forum. It's the 14th post in this forum.

The word "only" means that "only" C:SM and C:BT are allowed to field units that are not specificaly listed in their codex. There is nothing in the FAQ that prevents any army from fielding a unit listed in their codex.

Right, that's obvious, but what I'm pointing out is that if the only thing they printed was what is listed in the SM FAQ, this thread wouldn't even have existed. The wording in the BRB FAQ is confusing, maybe not to you, and I agree with your assessment ruleswise, but it is obviously confusing to some because there was reason to post about it.

The wording in the SM FAQ is not confusing at all and is how they should both read.

lledwey wrote:
Right, that's obvious, but what I'm pointing out is that if the only thing they printed was what is listed in the SM FAQ, this thread wouldn't even have existed. The wording in the BRB FAQ is confusing, maybe not to you, and I agree with your assessment ruleswise, but it is obviously confusing to some because there was reason to post about it.

The wording in the SM FAQ is not confusing at all and is how they should both read.

I agree with you as well. That there should have only been one version of the FAQ. I also agree that the C:SM is better. ( I didn't even know that it was there until you pointed it out)

About the confusing part?!? I don't know. There are more than a few people out in the world that will argue over what the deffinition of "is" is.

HopinmyTub wrote:

 puma713 wrote:

HopinmyTub wrote:
No it does not.

The BRB says only Black Templars and Space Marines can take Stormraven.

The Gray Knight and Blood Angel codex has the Stormraven listed as a takeable unit.

So we have a rulebook vs. codex conflict. Guess who wins.

*edit for spelling

This is what they're referring to:

The two exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships, which are only available to armies chosen from Codex: Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars.

This is saying that the Stormraven Gunship is an exception to the rule that you can take whatever is in your codex. The only armies that can take that Stormraven are Space Marines and Black Templars.

Obviously an oversight, but more DA-codex style editing. RAW, only those two armies can take Stormravens.

No. I am not arguing what it says. I agree the rulebook says none but the Codex: Space Marine and Codex: Black Templar can take the Stormraven and Stormtalon.

But, the BA and GK codex each have the Stormraven still listed. It has not been FAQ'ed out.

Do you not see a rulebook vs. codex conflict?

No, you're not paying attention to the first line of the FAQ answer. Let's break it down together:

A: No – you may only select units and vehicles that are available in the army list section of your codex.

The Stormraven is in the army list for GK and Blood Angels correct? Therefore, you may take them. Until. . .

The two exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships, which are only available to armies chosen from Codex: Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars.

The above line says that the exception to the rule that you may choose any unit in your army list are two units: Stormtalons and Stormravens. They are only available to Space Marines and Black Templars.

What is happening is the first line is giving you express permission to choose anything in your army list. Then the second line is removing permission for Stormtalons and Stormravens except to two armies.

Again, this is ridiculous, but that is RAW at the moment.

That is not the correct way to parse that Puma.

The correct way is:

"You may only select units and vehicles that are available in the army list section of your codex."

The Two exceptions to the above rule are...

This is what the exception is referring to. The Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships are not in Codex: Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars.

The New FAQ allows Codex: Space Marines and Codex: Black Templars to take Stormtalon or Stormraven Gunships even though they may not be in those codexes.

The problem, however is this:

SM FAQ wrote:Q: Land Speeder Storms, Stormraven Gunships and Stormtalon
Gunships are all listed as Space Marine vehicles in the Reference
section. Does this mean that every Space Marine Chapter now has
access to these vehicles as well (i.e . Space Wolves, Blood Angels,
Grey Knights etc.)? (p411)
A: No – you may usually only select units and vehicles that are
available in the army list section of your codex. The two
exceptions are the Stormtalon and Stormraven Gunships,
which are available to armies chosen from Codex: Space
Marines and Codex: Black Templars. The rules for using these
Flyers can be found in the Death From the Skies compendium.

That is not a problem at all.

It is still just saying that you can, in fact, take a Stormtalon or Stormraven Gunship even though those units may not be listed in Codex: Space Marines or Codex: Black Templars.