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Hey guys me and a friend are starting untold 40k I'm taking eldar and he's being lame and going SM. anything in particular to take or look out for? I have no 40k experience nor does he but later on he plans to use some drop pods I believe. Any help at all would be great.

Thanks!
Stuntie

Space marines have gotten harder to win with in 6th, in my opinion.

Your best friend as Eldar are warwalkers with farseer support and the gruesome effectiveness of fire dragons in 6th. I wouldn't flinch at taking 20 fire dragons, perhaps even 30. Other Eldar elites just aren't as scary. But fire dragons absolutely frag drop pod armies as they play right into the scheme. If they drop too far away, its scatter laser time. Scatter lasers are crazy stupid good. A guided squad of warwalkers basically wipes out or cripples whatever meq squad you point it at.

The Eldar codex sucks in that they have many crap units and then a few really nice ones. Makes for a boring time, but they can be very good vs marines, if you have the right stuff.

Fire Dragons are awesome, but anything more than two squads is waaay cheesy.

Use the aforementioned WW's w/ scatter lasers.

Dire Avengers with Bladestorm/Defend are all around good guys. They can probably combat drop-pods well. Bladestorm half the squad away and then assault in. I've not done this, but the logic seems legit. Throw in some guide/doom/fortune and they become quite impressive.

Pathfinders to sit on home objectives, and snipe out the characters - special weapons guys, sergants, etc.

Warp Spiders to DS in and take out any predators/vindicators/tanks from behind.

There is no cheesy. There is effective and ineffective. IG player don't hesitate to bring Vendetta spam.

Martel732 wrote:
There is no cheesy. There is effective and ineffective. IG player don't hesitate to bring Vendetta spam.

Maybe in a competition environment. He's playing a friend. Not some random overly competitive neckbeard.

Don't be an donkey-cave to your friend.

This isn't advice, more like another question: Are wraithgaurd and Wraithlord spam still effective? They were downright terrifying at my FLGS in 5th ed...

 DemetriDominov wrote:
This isn't advice, more like another question: Are wraithgaurd and Wraithlord spam still effective? They were downright terrifying at my FLGS in 5th ed...

They really weren't that good in 5th, and I imagine they aren't any better in 6th.

 DemetriDominov wrote:
This isn't advice, more like another question: Are wraithgaurd and Wraithlord spam still effective? They were downright terrifying at my FLGS in 5th ed...

Kinda but with DE baron (see thread in tactics active right now)

Eldar cannot truely be cheesy on their own. they just do not have anything that can compare to the real cheese out there. Their cheesiest cheese is but mild as compared to nacho cheese on top of a cheese platter. See the Space Wolves-HQ and Troops sections, Gray Knights-Striker spam, IG-vendetta spam, and Necron french bakery. All of which are fine if the opponent is ready for it but will rock your world if you are expecting "casual" games.

The best the eldar can do can be taken down by spamming bolters. Yeah, real "cheesey". Awesome army though. Take war walkers, farseer, and fire dragons with waveserpent and you have what will be all the work horses of your army.

Eldar jetbikes are great late game objective takers.

Guardians are cheap back fielders (don't count on them actually doing anything)

Rangers are good in limited numbers to hold objectives.

Dire avengers used to be awesome but suffer due to transport rules (farseer cannot use his powers inside transport). They can be effective just don't count on them to be the end all troop choice they used to be.

If you like wraithstar then you can go eldrad, 10 wraithguard troop choice, 3 wraithlords list. With DE baron ally it is pretty great.

Wraithlords are often said to be great but really they are okay. They are bullet magnets with little offensive output, but they are one of my favorite units in the game so I love them. Just don't think they are going to win you the game they are really just anvils which need a good hammer to beat the enemy with.

Space marines btw are actually a pretty good codex with the new fliers they got and TFC. They just suffer in comparison to SW and DA when comparing troop choices (everybody suffers in comparison with SW troops). Hit them hard and hit them where their juicy support is their troops are tough and good scorers but have very subpar offensive output.

Thanks for the replies! I'll definetly look into acquiring some war walkers. How are dark reapers holding up in this Ed? Also I broke down and bought two hornets because they look amazing. My opponent doesn't mind forge world stuff. Are they effective an if so what gap do they best fill and what should I look to equip them with?

Stuntiepunter wrote:
Thanks for the replies! I'll definetly look into acquiring some war walkers. How are dark reapers holding up in this Ed?

I've not used them, but the consensus seems to be that they're a bit of a waste of a HS slot. You've got WW's, WL and other toys to fill that slot.

Reapers will likely get targetted down, and cost quite a bit. They murder TAC squads though.

STR 5 AP 3 lacks utility because of the low STR.

Ok cool. I also love the harlequin models I realize eldar aren't the best CC army but are they viable and if so any suggestions for uses?

I'm surprised no one mentioned a harlestar. Possibly the best deathstar in the Eldar book, if not one of the best overall. It's difficult to play it right, but 10 Harlequins w/ Shadowseer and 2 Farseers? Then the Baron or something for overkill? Just nasty. And it can* kill anything it hits. Glass cannon though.

*can, but not effectively. With the singing spears on the farseers, you can crack any armor, including AV14, and with prescience you even have a not bad shot at fliers (within 12"). Not the best way to go about it (nightwings are the AA and Anti-high AV).

Edit: Slightly ninja'd haha.

The harlequin build I run is this:

Farseer, Stones, Spear, Fortune, Doom, RoWit, RoWard
Farseer, Stones, Spear, Mind war, guide, doom, storm, RoWit (This farseer will roll on the Div table for Misfortune and Forwarning for the 4++. If doom fails/is DtW, then use misfortune. Otherwise, 4++ and prescience.)

10x Harlequins 9x Kisses
Shadowseer, Troupe Master w/ PS

Lelith Hesperax
(mandatory 5x wyches)

3x 3xGJB

2x Nightwing

And a sprinkling of hornets and other such stuff to make points.

Stuntiepunter wrote:
Ok cool. I also love the harlequin models I realize eldar aren't the best CC army but are they viable and if so any suggestions for uses?

See xlEternitylx; harliestar is probably the best deathstar in the game ATM. Really it is probably one of the top 5 best units in the game but it needs long range AT fire support. (aka 2 nightwings in that example list)

double pulse lasers all the way, it is something we eldar cannot bring to the table otherwise: 4 S8 AP2 shots a vehicle. Outflank and you will gut them when you come in (or stay on the board if they lack long range fire and gut them first turn). Just DO NOT let them fire at you. Even minimal fire will blow you away if you do not have your jink save. Some will say scatter lasers or shucannon but why did you bother getting hornet instead of wasp or warwalker if you are giving them such boring toys?

Actually xlEternitylx harliestar list is a very good list with perhaps a smattering of warwalkers and hornets. That is one of the three or so competitive lists the eldar have right now. The other two are the war walker spam with something annoying to kill off and wraithstar (which is only moderately effective)

Wraithguard and Wraithlords are still a viable play method but become a better choice when you add a Wraithseer.

My list I used tonight at 2.5k was

Farseer + Spirit Stones + RoWard + RoWit + Singing Spear + Fortune + Guide
Warlock Council x5 + Spears + Enhancee +Destructor x4

Wraithseer + D-Cannon

Wraithguard x5 + Warlock +Conceal
Wave Serpent + TL Starcannon + Shuriken Cannon

Wraithguard x5 + Warlock +Conceal
Wave Serpent + TL Starcannon + Shuriken Cannon

Jetbikes x6 + 2 Shuriken Cannons

Dire Avengers x10 + Exarch + DSC + Bladestorm
Wave Serpent + TL Starcannon + Shuriken Cannon

Hornet + 2 Pulse Lasers

Hornet + 2 Pulse Lasers

Nightwing

Wraithlord + Sword + Starcannon

Wraithlord + Sword + Starcannon

Warp Hunter + Shuriken Cannon

This list is designed so that no matter what scenario we are officially playing, it is initially treated as an annihilation mission and THEN worry about objectives. It doesn't look like much on the table but when your enemy sees what you have to work with, they will most likely focus down on one aspect of the front because it is durable enough to take a lot of punishment and still stalk forward menacingly. Dropping off a handful next to a Land Raider or Leman Russ will usually pop it and unlike fire dragons who are wiped out in the next turn, WG prove durable enough to board again and make it to another target or hoof it there if need be especially if the WL, WS, WH core are drawing enough fire away. I lost a total of 3 wraithguard and 2 Wave serpents meanwhile the IG player opposite me lost 2 Leman Ri, a Chimera, 3 Basilisks and 4 squads of troops by turn 3 at which point he conceded and my jetbikes were sad they never saw the table top.

Martel732 wrote:
STR 5 AP 3 lacks utility because of the low STR.

You are playing a very different game than I am if you are failing to find a "utility" for S5 AP3. A weapon with that profile would be the end of any MEQ unit.

Not all enemies are meqs. Meqs can also take cover like any other unit. It also doesn't do squat to teqs, or any AV one cares about. Then you look at the price of Dark Reapers. They are crappy, sorry.

Everyone has to remember that the Eldar codex is seriously outdated, BUT... They've already announced that the Eldar Codex is coming out soon. They will probably go to being one of the best (& cheesiest) armies in the game by mid or late fall!!! When the 4th edition Eldar book came out, they were awesome. over time, other armies have gotten better and cheaper and Eldar has slipped down to near bottom tier. That's not to say that they aren't a fun and fluffy army, but I wouldnt take my Eldar to any tournaments right now. My Space Wolves and Imperial Guard can be so much better, or at least easier to play, right now.

To be a top table Eldar player right now takes some serious skill and tactical genious. People do it, but you've got to fight the right fights, and avoid the wrong ones. You've gotta dominate the table using speed and precision and pray that the dice gods are on your side.

GOOD VS MARINES
-Fire Dragons (Fire Dragon Exarch manning a Quad-Gun is awesome anti-air btw)
-War Walkers (especialy with Farseers)
-Farseers
-Eldrad
-Dark Reapers
-Rangers (or Pathfinders)
-Guardian jetbikes (small packs for late game objective snagging / contesting
-Dark Reapers (great MEQ)
-Harlequins

PRETTY GOOD
-Striking Scorpions
-Wraithlords
-Wraithguard
-Swooping Hawks
-Warp Spiders
-Dire Avengers
-Fire Prisms

If you are gonna run a gun-line and let your opponent advance, I wouldn't take any transports right now. If youw ant to be more aggressive, I'd take some Wave Serpents for the Fire Dragons at the very least. Mayeb some more for a couple packs of Dire Avengers.

Wave Serpents used to be mandatoyr, but they die very easily (like everything else Eldar puts on the table) and they aren't cheap. If you are gonna use them, make sure they are worth-while. Fire Dragons are worth getting in range. They absolutely destroy anything tough. Tanks, Marines, Terminators? They all die quickly when Fire Dragons bring their guns to bear on them.

Thanks for all the help guys! I'm learning a bunch! While I know to really find out how to use something is to use it, but I was hoping for some insight on hornets vs marines? Everyone seems to think their good I think. My opponent doesn't mind forgeworld so I got two of them just for their look. Any advice on best way to use and kit them out?

Stuntiepunter wrote:
Thanks for all the help guys! I'm learning a bunch! While I know to really find out how to use something is to use it, but I was hoping for some insight on hornets vs marines? Everyone seems to think their good I think. My opponent doesn't mind forgeworld so I got two of them just for their look. Any advice on best way to use and kit them out?

Against MEQ U would suggest scatter lasers. Their high volume of shots will ultimately kill more marines than any of the other weapons. Adding two of them to each hornet means 8 shots per. If you've got two of them, that's 16 shots that will wound a MEQ on a roll of 2+. You'll be hard pressed to find a more mathematically effective setup.