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So I'm really new to Hordes, as in just traded my 40k army and ordered a few mini's new. This is what I was thinking of playing and just wanted some feedback on feasibility and / or changes you all might make. I have to admit that I didn't get too creative as this is basically a Lylyth tier build.. but I've never made a Hordes list before so just wanted to make sure I added things up right and get some feedback

1 x Lylyth, Herald of Everblight -6 (for the beast allowance)
2 x Raeks +8
2 x Five man archer units +10
1 x Ten man Raptor unit +10
1 x Annyssa +4
2 x Five man Incubi +10
-------------------------------------------------------
36 points

I also have some questions. 1. Am I figuring beast allowance properly? and 2. I wanted to take striders but if I did I wouldn't get Lylyth's Tier 2 ability? I guess I kinda view striders as upgraded archers, but I realize it's a different unit.
Anyway it's a pretty simple list, but just wanted feedback on if you all think it'll run ok or if it's just doomed. Either way I'm super psyched to be playing this game, it seems a lot more versatile compared to 40k.

You really need more beasts. As it is, when one beast goes down you are going to have to cut yourself for more fury. And Raek's aren't too hard to kill.

Also, you only get a 5 man unit of raptors, it costs 10

To get your Tier 3 bonus if you want it (and honestly, Tiers can be a bit restrictive when you are just starting off), you could go for

pLylyth
Shredder x 2
Carnivean
Annyssa
Strider Deathstalker
Min Blighted Nyss Archers w UA
Min Blighted Nyss Archers
Min Blighted Nyss Raptors

But you'll still struggle to deal with heavies.

 motyak wrote:
You really need more beasts. As it is, when one beast goes down you are going to have to cut yourself for more fury. And Raek's aren't too hard to kill.

Also, you only get a 5 man unit of raptors, it costs 10

To get your Tier 3 bonus if you want it (and honestly, Tiers can be a bit restrictive when you are just starting off), you could go for

pLylyth
Shredder x 2
Carnivean
Annyssa
Strider Deathstalker
Min Blighted Nyss Archers w UA
Min Blighted Nyss Archers
Min Blighted Nyss Raptors

But you'll still struggle to deal with heavies.

Thanks for the feedback! Yeah I can see how tiers can feel restrictive, I guess I just thought it was a good place to start. As for not having enough beasts, as I'm new, I haven't really figured out what a good ratio is. I *heard* Fury x 2, but your list is closer to Fury x 3... is that generally the safer bet? As for the other's I totally see why you would take them, other then the Deathstalker.. was there just 2 points left over? And final question. Do you think I'd be better off going with Epic Lylyth and some Striders? I have to admit I like the look and rules for Striders.

Well you are playing at 35 points with this list, at that level a Defender with epic Haley can put down a Raek a turn with average dice rolls. Then you have 0 fury generators. And that is only 9 points of jack and a caster. They are stealthed, so that could help, but every faction has things which help ignore stealth (B13/Triumph for cygnar, spriggan for Khador, things like that).

That is why I was recommending more beasts, or atleast a few heavy beasts, because then they can't be taken down that easily.

And to be honest, I don't have too much experience with legion, more with trolls, so I could be giving awful advice.

While I agree with motyak's assessment that your list has too few beasts, I will note that raeks have stealth so they aren't quite that easy to kill.

I just recently started legion myself in the past 6 months after playing warmachine since late mk1 so my input may not quite be expert, but my own experiences are fresh in my mind.

First of all, 35 point lists are good guidelines of what to buy first, but don't dive into 35 point games right away. play a few 15 and 25 point games to work your way up, learn the rules, get used to your own units.

I would say pLyl's theme force is a very specialized list not suitable for a new player to start with. It is highly restrictive and the bonuses are not substantial enough to overcome the learning curve.

What I would do for pLyl is build her a list with effective combined arms units, a big gun, and some fury management. This list utilizes some of the models from the two-player starter as a bonus.

Lylyth, Herald of Everblight (*6pts)
* Shredder (2pts)
* Shredder (2pts)
* Ravagore (10pts)
Blighted Nyss Raptors (Leader and 4 Grunts) (10pts)
Blighted Ogrun Warspears (Leader and 4 Grunts) (8pts)
*Warspear Warchief (2pts)
Annyssa Ryvaal, Talon of Everblight (4pts)
Blighted Nyss Shepherd (1pts)
Succubus (2pts)

To take on hard targets you'll want to parasite them and hit them with multiple attacks. Massed infantry may provide a more difficult challenge, but eruption of spines at 15" and a scather template at 14" help you get a head start.

 Dais wrote:
While I agree with motyak's assessment that your list has too few beasts, I will note that raeks have stealth so they aren't quite that easy to kill.

I just recently started legion myself in the past 6 months after playing warmachine since late mk1 so my input may not quite be expert, but my own experiences are fresh in my mind.

First of all, 35 point lists are good guidelines of what to buy first, but don't dive into 35 point games right away. play a few 15 and 25 point games to work your way up, learn the rules, get used to your own units.

I would say pLyl's theme force is a very specialized list not suitable for a new player to start with. It is highly restrictive and the bonuses are not substantial enough to overcome the learning curve.

What I would do for pLyl is build her a list with effective combined arms units, a big gun, and some fury management. This list utilizes some of the models from the two-player starter as a bonus.

Lylyth, Herald of Everblight (*6pts)
* Shredder (2pts)
* Shredder (2pts)
* Ravagore (10pts)
Blighted Nyss Raptors (Leader and 4 Grunts) (10pts)
Blighted Ogrun Warspears (Leader and 4 Grunts) (8pts)
*Warspear Warchief (2pts)
Annyssa Ryvaal, Talon of Everblight (4pts)
Blighted Nyss Shepherd (1pts)
Succubus (2pts)

To take on hard targets you'll want to parasite them and hit them with multiple attacks. Massed infantry may provide a more difficult challenge, but eruption of spines at 15" and a scather template at 14" help you get a head start.

Thank you! I actually love this list as I love the little shredder models and I think the Warspears are awesome models as well. This would be a force I'd love to play, and love to paint! Now I have quite a bit of cash (as much as I hate 40k, they resell pretty good) so what kinda units or beasts do you think are must haves in everblight.. like something versatile that is just great to have around.

Okay, so there are no must-have beasts in the faction aside from maybe a shredder, but there are a few that you'll get a whole lot of mileage out of: Ravagore, Scythean, and Angelius.
These are not by any means the only good beasts, but they are the staple heavies you'll come back to again and again. Legion is a faction that is rather beast-centric so there are quite a few very good warbests you could pick up as well: Typhon, seraph, raek, nephilim bolt thrower, etc.

You will probably want at least one shepherd and forsaken since they are your fury management solos. If you double-up on anything, make the shepherd the first.
When it comes to the other solos and units they tend to be far more based on your caster and build. The general consensus is that the best units and solos are: Raptors, hex hunters, striders, warspears, legionaries, spawning vessel, strider deerstalkers, spell martyrs, and Annyssa Ryvaal. That doesn't mean anything else is bad, just that they aren't found to be successful by as wide of an audience. The same goes for beasts that weren't listed above.

You need to understand that list building is much MUCH more free-form than 40k/fantasy and that even bad models have their niches.

 Dais wrote:
Okay, so there are no must-have beasts in the faction aside from maybe a shredder, but there are a few that you'll get a whole lot of mileage out of: Ravagore, Scythean, and Angelius.
These are not by any means the only good beasts, but they are the staple heavies you'll come back to again and again. Legion is a faction that is rather beast-centric so there are quite a few very good warbests you could pick up as well: Typhon, seraph, raek, nephilim bolt thrower, etc.

You will probably want at least one shepherd and forsaken since they are your fury management solos. If you double-up on anything, make the shepherd the first.
When it comes to the other solos and units they tend to be far more based on your caster and build. The general consensus is that the best units and solos are: Raptors, hex hunters, striders, warspears, legionaries, spawning vessel, strider deerstalkers, spell martyrs, and Annyssa Ryvaal. That doesn't mean anything else is bad, just that they aren't found to be successful by as wide of an audience. The same goes for beasts that weren't listed above.

You need to understand that list building is much MUCH more free-form than 40k/fantasy and that even bad models have their niches.

Yeah I'm slowly seeing that in this game. It seems to be less about the models in and of themselves and more about how the models play off each other and your caster. I can see how just about any model, with the right caster and other models could be very playable.

cretinator wrote:

Yeah I'm slowly seeing that in this game. It seems to be less about the models in and of themselves and more about how the models play off each other and your caster. I can see how just about any model, with the right caster and other models could be very playable.

yep you pretty much got it!

-shredders are nasty, not just for the chomping, but their animus is great too, don't be afraid of sending them off like missles outside your control area, they may frenzy, so be it
-a ravagore is a pretty standard ranged heavy, it can still get the job done on mellee and brings a good gun to the table for units like stealthers that your direct attacks fail against

+1 to Ravagores, they changed how our faction engages the enemy.

Scytheans are our go to beater.

Get both and fury management (Shepherds & Forsaken)