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So when targetting or drawing line of sight to a vehicle,
Only the main hull is counted as the vehicle correct?
So such as guns don't count, then what about the crew?

And which part is really considered the hull and which part is considered aesthetics?

For example the Khorne Skull Cannon, the Chariot version and Skull Version have the crew at 2 different places so the thing that they are standing on is kinda large and could matter when drawing LoS.

I didn't really see anything in the BRB that covers this or maybe I just missed it or something so if anyone could guide me that would be nice.
Thanks

I'd assume any exposed crewmembers were decorations in the case of vehicles. They're certainly not hull or weapons (except maybe on some particular Chaos vehicles).

The only things which are exempted are gun BARRELS (the rest of the gun is a legimate target) and purely decorative elements, like banners and antennae.

not true though, for example the shock prow's aren't targettable as far as I've been told.
Same goes for the DeffRolla and such and such.

So that platform thing is kinda of ambigous.

 Makutsu wrote:
not true though, for example the shock prow's aren't targettable as far as I've been told.
Same goes for the DeffRolla and such and such.

So that platform thing is kinda of ambigous.

There is no rules basis for that, per se.

The rules simply say:

"When a unit fires at a vehicle, it must be able to see its hull or turret (ignoring the vehicle's gun barrels, antennas, decorative banner poles, etc.)"

Now what that 'etc' encompasses is a big mystery. GW had previously ruled in some of their FAQs that a flyers wings counted as part of its hull (not sure if that's still in any of the current FAQs, though), but it really is something that isn't clear. Besides gun barrels, antennas and decorative banner poles, we really just don't know what is considered part of a vehicle's hull or not.

So then there is no definite ans for this then?
Guess we've been playing house rules all along.

I just wanted to know so that I can decide if I want to model the Khorne Chariot without the guys in front so I can easily switch between the Cannon and Chariot.

Anyway, thanks all

 yakface wrote:
Now what that 'etc' encompasses is a big mystery. GW had previously ruled in some of their FAQs that a flyers wings counted as part of its hull (not sure if that's still in any of the current FAQs, though), but it really is something that isn't clear. Besides gun barrels, antennas and decorative banner poles, we really just don't know what is considered part of a vehicle's hull or not.

Wings are explicitly stated as being part of the hull in the 6th ed rules.

 Mannahnin wrote:

Wings are explicitly stated as being part of the hull in the 6th ed rules.

So they are...I thought so, but couldn't find it scouring the flyers section only now to finally find it in the very next sentence after the one I quoted!

So yeah anyway...we have a list of 3 thins we know for sure are not the hull and we have one thing we know is part of the hull (wings), but everything else is a question mark left up to the (not so) 'common sense' of players.


My personal take on it these days is this:

I tend to think (besides gun barrels, antennas and banner poles) anything non-decorative on the vehicle is considered part of the hull. So what constitutes 'decorative' to me? basically something that could be added or taken off the vehicle that would not affect its performance in anyway.

That means (to me) that things like sails on a Dark Eldar vehicle (integral to its operation), a Deff-Rolla on a Battlewagon (affects how the vehicle performs), etc, are ALL hull because they impact how the vehicle theoretically performs in the fluff.

Agreed. Although I may agree with an opponent ahead of time that a given piece does NOT count as hull for our mutual convenience. For example, most Ork players I know who run Battlewagons prefer to ignore the Rolla, so we can just swing it up out of the way or remove it if/when it gets in the way. This follows many years of practice in which we ignored Dozer Blades, for similar reasons.

So, if we don't know what constitutes the hull, does that mean we can not shoot at vehicles that do not have wings or turrets?

I'll also go out on a limb and suggest that I've never seen any vehicle with an attached device to it that has that device as part of it's hull. While the sail of a frigate were very much a desirable part to shoot at it was not part of the hull, the same can be said about the crane on a more modern tow boat.

The rules clearly invokes common sense, even though in this case it does so on a more technical level. The deff rolla is clearly not part of the hull while the sails on a Raider can be discussed. The rules are incomplete.