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Im sorry guys my roomates are mad at be that they where combining space wolves and necrons and where about to be tabled on turn 3 lol.
My question is if rivers are atleast diffcult terraing then where in the codex does that link rivers to being atleast a 5+ cover save?

Imo i swore all difficult terrain is atleast a 5+ but i could be making a massive mistake that i would love to know now

All AREA terrain is a 5+ cover.

Difficult terrain just requires you to roll 2D6 and pick the highest for your movement.

If it isnt just the table in question (meaning there is an obvious boundary that something is different about this ground) it counts as Area Terrain which is a 5+. Woods are only a seperate indication of cover because some things (Kroot for one) have special rules for Woods but not other Area Terrain.

A rule of thumb, even if its just a flat plastic piece on the ground, its area terrain and its a 5+ unless you specify its just decorations on the ground like a road or something. This is important because it also means whether or not any tests are done, not just cover saves.

Where could i show my rather upset roomates because they where bitching a storm about the area terrain not being rivers that it is indeed? Im sorry i just hate people who want to be uopset because their being skunk whining about nothing and im not sure where off the top of my head that is?

BRB under Area Terrain. Yes it doesnt directly say River but it doesnt directly say Wheat Fields either and those exist as well in some boards and still grant a 5+.

The only thing that causes Difficult/Dangerous Terrain tests are (oddly enough) terrain. Thus if its causing this test, its terrain of some sort therefore grants a save. If its clearly not ruins, its Area Terrain and grants a 5+ (As stated before, Woods are only seperate because of some units having special rules in Woods)

Cant believe theyre arguing that much over a 5+ (3+ going to ground) cover save from a river. Its a river...even IRL the river provides some help because (and theres a Mythbuster episode proving this) bullets do not like water and therefore reduce the size of the target youre shooting at. That'd be my excuse for the 5+ save...your bulelt hit the water and just disintigrated.

I mean i get the logic that you would not understand but my roomates are real douchebages when it comes to me especially when it comes to me tabilign them in 3 turns without them even using SW and Necrons as Desperate allies lol. My responses when they gave up saying they won was bad lists bad players enjoy playing in tourneys. They just love doing everything they can to win vs me because they know i like following rules and whenevr i get one of their rules wrong they just harp on it w/e thank you for the info!

TFG's, thats all they are. Those are the people that make you wish you never picked up this hobby.

Even being roommates i wouldnt play against them. Im a redhead, thus have a short fuse, even against civilized people i have to pause now and then to simmer down. Those guys would make me pop in a heartbeat, so i wouldnt ever play them and i suggest you dont either.

Also suggest getting new roommates lol.

Vineheart01 wrote:If it isnt just the table in question (meaning there is an obvious boundary that something is different about this ground) it counts as Area Terrain which is a 5+. Woods are only a seperate indication of cover because some things (Kroot for one) have special rules for Woods but not other Area Terrain.

A rule of thumb, even if its just a flat plastic piece on the ground, its area terrain and its a 5+ unless you specify its just decorations on the ground like a road or something. This is important because it also means whether or not any tests are done, not just cover saves.

Not true at all. There is nothing to say that anything that isn't open terrain is area terrain, which is what you're claiming.

All area terrain is difficult; that does not mean that all difficult terrain is area.

Rivers are very clearly defined as difficult terrain, with absolutely no mention of being area terrain at all. You cannot possibly assert that it must be area terrain just because it is not open terrain. This is further backed up by the rules for forests, which are difficult terrain that is "usually also area terrain" (RB p102), which proves my point.

Vineheart01 wrote:BRB under Area Terrain. Yes it doesnt directly say River but it doesnt directly say Wheat Fields either and those exist as well in some boards and still grant a 5+.

Wheat fields are not explicitly covered by the rules, so you and your opponent would have to classify it one way or another before the game.

Rivers, on the other hand, have explicit rules to say that they are merely difficult terrain. Of course, you and your opponent could always agree otherwise, but that is not what we are talking about.

The only thing that causes Difficult/Dangerous Terrain tests are (oddly enough) terrain. Thus if its causing this test, its terrain of some sort therefore grants a save. If its clearly not ruins, its Area Terrain and grants a 5+ (As stated before, Woods are only seperate because of some units having special rules in Woods)

Not true at all. Everything on the board, even open ground, is a type of terrain (RB p90). Not all terrain grants a cover save; only terrain that physically blocks line of sight gives a cover save (RB p18), or terrain that otherwise has specific rules to grant cover saves (RB p91, 'Area Terrain'). Just because it's neither open ground nor a ruin does not automatically make it area terrain.

A river would need to block line of sight in order to give a cover save, as it is not given a terrain classification that would automatically grant a cover save.

Cant believe theyre arguing that much over a 5+ (3+ going to ground) cover save from a river. Its a river...even IRL the river provides some help because (and theres a Mythbuster episode proving this) bullets do not like water and therefore reduce the size of the target youre shooting at. That'd be my excuse for the 5+ save...your bulelt hit the water and just disintigrated.

A 5+ save where you would not normally get a save increases your survivability by a third. As a Daemon player, I can tell you that a 5+ save is not a small bonus. You can't rely on it to save you, but it's nice to have.

Reality has absolutely no bearing here. The rules are clear: rivers are not area terrain.

All oranges are fruit, not all fruit is an orange.

You need to define pre game what terrrain is.
Terrain can be difficult with out giving cover,

Well thank you for that calrification and i guess ill have to be more strict but like someone else said before im done playing my rooamtes and their terrabad lists. All they want to do is rag, for instance not taking dangerous terrain tests even though they declared a charge and failed it, however attempted to move! some people make me rethink all my time spent painting lol

Bloodynecronight wrote:
for instance not taking dangerous terrain tests even though they declared a charge and failed it, however attempted to move!

Um. If they don't move, they don't take dangerous terrain tests.
Page 22 - you take them while charging. Failing the charge means you're not charging...