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Hi Dakka, I was refining a CSM list. In the long-term, I'm aiming for Chaoszilla at 2000 pts.

But 1st, I was setting a goal of 1000 pts, getting the Troops, the backbone in place:

HQ - 1 Chaos Lord, Power Weapon, Mark of Nurgle

Troops - 3 Squads of 5 Plague Marines with 2 Plasma Guns each

Heavy - 1 Squad of Havocs with 4 Autocannons

Fast - 2 Heldrakes

Are 2 Heldrakes excessive, just overkill? As in, inefficient or just plain cheesy?

My FLGS is roughly 50% Marines, 25% Grey Knights, 25% Other.

Thanks in advance.

Well, a single Helldrake would be sufficient at this point level. I'd take a Lord on a bike leading some Spawn.

Personally Id run 3 Drakes at this point level. But I think 2 is a good number. Surprised that you're not running a Prince if you're doing Chaoszilla. But the list looks solid. Better hope your opponent doesn't bring a Landraider or 2 or you auto lose....

I'm always partial to obliterators personally..... Always packs a punch for 225pts + gives you plenty of weapons versatility for pretty much anything the enemy can throw at you.

The only thing you're really missing is anti-tank. Some Melta guns on some of those Plague Marines would help. With the Meta ratio you posted, you really can't go wrong with a Helchicken or two...... or six in a double force org. Just be weary of Marine lists that concentrate heavily on Terminators(Grey Knights, Dark Angels). Your 'drakes will be laughed off for the most part.

2 drakes at 1000 would be awful to play against. I find when using 1 it goes down quickly as its the main target, with 2 you'll be laughing!

Hi guys, thanks for your insight. Yeah, I was worried about a lot of the things you mentioned.

wuestenfux wrote:Well, a single Helldrake would be sufficient at this point level. I'd take a Lord on a bike leading some Spawn.

FlingitNow wrote:Surprised that you're not running a Prince if you're doing Chaoszilla.

I hear you. My thought was, I'll add the real Chaoszilla things at the 2000 pt level.

Thanks to you, I'll re-evaluate this right now, and do a modified list below.

FlingitNow wrote:Better hope your opponent doesn't bring a Landraider or 2 or you auto lose....

SkinCarver wrote:The only thing you're really missing is anti-tank. Some Melta guns on some of those Plague Marines would help. With the Meta ratio you posted, you really can't go wrong with a Helchicken or two...... or six in a double force org. Just be weary of Marine lists that concentrate heavily on Terminators(Grey Knights, Dark Angels). Your 'drakes will be laughed off for the most part.

Mad Boss Morgrot wrote:I'm always partial to obliterators personally..... Always packs a punch for 225pts + gives you plenty of weapons versatility for pretty much anything the enemy can throw at you.

Listening to your feedback, here's The Gap with the above list:

- can't deal with Land Raiders
- can't deal with Terminators
- but if I took some Oblits, that versatility should take care of them

Let me pitch 2 alternatives to you (changes are marked in red):

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ALTERNATIVE 1 (more about meltaguns and Oblits)

HQ - 1 Chaos Lord, Power Weapon, Mark of Nurgle

Troops - 3 Squads of 5 Plague Marines with 2 Plasma Guns each
- 1 Squad of 5 Plague Marines with 2 Meltaguns

Heavy - 2 Obliterators with Marks of Nurgle

Fast - 1 Heldrake

I swapped a Heldrake + Autocannon Havocs for a Melta squad + 2 Oblits.

---

ALTERNATIVE 2 (more Chaoszilla)

HQ - 1 Chaos Lord, Mark of Nurgle, Bike, Lightning Claw, Power Fist

Troops - 3 Squads of 5 Plague Marines with 2 Plasma Guns each

Heavy - 1 Maulerfiend with Magma Cutters

Fast - 1 Heldrake, 3 Chaos Spawn with Marks of Nurgle

I swapped a Heldrake + Autocannon Havocs for a cavalry of Bike + Spawn + Maulerfiend.

---

Keeping in mind I'm facing mostly MEQs and GKs, which do you prefer?

Original "Double Dragon" - 2 Heldrakes

Alternative 1 "Anti-vehicle Weaponry" - Meltaguns & Oblits?

Alternative 2 "Chaoszilla Cavalry" - Bike + Spawn + Maulerfiend?

Or perhaps something else? Thanks again.