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My boy's got a game coming up, and last time he got SHREDDED pretty bad by some Orks. The Orks ran a full infantry army that charged through his tanks and probably could have taken on a few more hundred points if he had 'em. So I'm trying to refine his list to be a bit more competitive against footslogging Orks. I think tanks are out, and I have no idea how to put his list together. I was considering a Belial assassination squad of 10 termies to take care of his HQ and the rest of the points to run away on motorcycles, but that ate a TON of points up for a 1k army (more than half of the points, as a matter of fact). Also, I want it to be fun for both of them so they keep playing.

So, here's what I was thinking to make things more fun:

HQ:
Librarian lvl 2 (100pt)

Troops:
2x 5 man Tactical squads w/plasma cannons (85 pts each, 170pt total)

Elites:
Venerable Dreadnough with Assault Cannon & heavy flamer (160pt)
Drop Pod with Deathwind Launcher (60pt)

Fast:
3x Ravenwing Bikers x3 w/Veteran Sgt & Plasma guns (105pts each, 315 total)
Land Speeder w/Multi Melta and Assault Cannon (90pt)

Heavy:
Predator w/Autocannon & Heavy Bolters additional Storm Bolter (100pt)

995, could add Melta Bombs to a bike squad, but doesn't seem that necessary. How does that look for a footslogging Ork army? It seems like a bunch spent on bikers, but the last time he got wrapped up in combat with 30 Orks and an HQ which marched through his whole army. MM will be good against the Dredd (or however it's spelled) and the Predator can chew through some of his other forces. I figure this way he can play around with the mobility of the bikers (which I believe can also grab objectives if need be, depending on the circumstance) while also distracting the Orks with his Tactical plates and Dreadnought popping in behind them.

Anyhow, does this seem fair? I want them both to learn the rules without overloading them. I'll be supervising, likely, as my Dark Eldar are taking FOREVER to put together, but I want to cut the kiddo loose on this one. As I said, last time he was running tanks and termies so he was getting VERY frustrated watching them all crumble since they were worth so many points. If I had any scouts, I would probably start piling them in.

Does anyone have any thoughts on an even game? Any input would be great.

From what I can remember, here's the other army:
HQ (Independent Character, worth 225pts)
30 Ork Boyz (two CC weapons, attached to HQ)
10 Nobz (I think, two wound Orks)
Dredd (4 arms?)
Whatever unit rolls a D3 to determine shots fired in the round.
I can't remember anything else, but that sounds like a list.

Maybe try and fit a Banner of Devastation in there??? Then I think against an ork army, you would have the complete upper hand. Just my thought though.

Hey man, I don't know Dark Angels (Space Marines with some OP hero, lots of bikes and termies yes?) but I do know Orks pretty damn well.

For starters, that hero was probably Ghazghull, one of the downright fightiest heroes in the game. It was a big, heavily armoured looking Ork yes? Probably with a goats skull thing on a pole sticking out of his back, if he was using the official model. Think of this guy as like, ten terminators stacked on top of each other, who can also make his 2+ save invulnerable for two turns whenever he likes, and also has the ability to give all his Orks a one off 6" fleet of foot in the shooting phase. This guy could quite literally take on your whole army, terminators, dreadnaughts, and so on including in hand to hand all at once and come out on top.

As for Nobs, its all about the gear they've got. You see that guy with the surgical mask? Kill him. That other guy with the huge banner? Nail that bastard. The ones with the huge, robotic claws? Blow them away (from a distance). This unit is very vulnerable if you are able to snipe out its key members. Its also scoring because of Ghaz.

Treat both Ghazzies boys blob and the Nobs the same as you would any other expensive, slow moving assault death star - stay out of fleet/charge range and either nuke it or ignore it.

The D3 shooting models are Lootas, frail and expensive but they can put the hurt on at range. Your best bet is to just kill a couple with Frag Missiles or something - once a couple drop, their awful leadership of 7 will see the rest run like flies, never to return. Alternatively, if you can put a couple of bikers or something into them in close combat, you'll tie them up and/or kill them. These are going to target your vehicles, because armour 10 or 12 is meat for them and MEQs are generally not a great target due to AP 4. Armour 14 on the other hand, they cannot even scratch.

The Dread is also pretty weak, don't worry about it. Its like a crappier version of the Nobs, one thats very vulnerable to a single, well placed Lascannon shot. Nail its puny 12 frontal armour with missiles and lascannons and such until it keels over and dies, which it will honestly do first time every time. Don't try to use melta bombs on it, because then your walking right into it's many, many buzzsaw tipped arms and getting minced. If he's given it that many extra arms, then its a huge points sink and a big fat target.

As for your list, the Pred is golden if you can neutralize those Lootas. The bikers are good too for stomping Loota face, maybe take more of them to ensure you kill them, and then harrass that other stuff once they're down. The Dread is going to die painfully, and the Land Speeder is going to disappear in one turn - I'd cut those for sure, because seeing them get wasted so easily is just going to put your son off of the game! I flicked through the Librarians powers, and honestly, that Leadership test power is exactly the sort of thing you need to kill Ghazzy. I'd double up on this guy and make that your assassin squad. Those Plasma Cannons are definitely a step in the right direction, but you need more of them. Use autocannons and such to thin the boys around Ghaz and then nuke him with those cannons. Or just straight up nuke the Nobs with them.

So rule of thumb - nuke it and nuke it hard, don't let anything get anywhere near you. Except the Lootas, which are the opposite.

Edit: With regards to making it a fair game, well, that went out the window with this Ghazzy build. I recommend you shred this Ork guy to even the score, then worry about keeping it fair. Even the stuff I've suggested above isn't going to make it a one sided stomp, so don't be afraid to go all out. If you do manage a stomp, next game go for that Belial Assassin Squad - they'll probably die like flies but at least it'll be one hell of a brawl! Try to keep them interested in having fun, not maxing the power of their lists, or your just unleashing a couple new powergamers on the world.

Thanks for the advice, Dakkamite. So essentially an army of bikes circling the Orks and taking shots into the throng would probably be workable for their game tomorrow is what I got from that.

Dread in the back, Land Speeder w/MM to fry their Dredd and then run rampant with the ass cannon, so on and so forth but stha?

I would like to know what that ork army was running as i seem to struggle with DA

From what I can remember, here's the other army:
HQ (Independent Character, worth 225pts) (Ghaz)
30 Ork Boyz (two CC weapons, attached to HQ)
10 Nobz (I think, two wound Orks)
Dredd (4 arms?)
Lootas
I can't remember anything else, but that sounds like a/his list.

It works great against a Tank/Termie heavy DA list at lower points because we couldn't get enough shots to even dent him. Tanks were torn up, troops were torn up, so on and so forth. I'll post the results of the Hell's Angels match coming up tomorrow.

I think you might just need a few more guys in there. The deep striking venerable dread I presume is for dealing to his lootas. Venerable is quite expensive for not too much gain. So I would probably put a minimal tac squad with a flamer in there and walk the dread with autocannons. Also a deathwind drop pod is 50pts.
Trying to keep it similar to models you've listed, what I'd take;
Librarian - 100pts
Bikers - 315pts
Predator - 100pts

Dreadnought - 120pts
2 TL autocannons
2x5man Tac squad - 180pts
lascannon
5man Tac squad - 125pts
drop pod, flamer, combi-flamer
Total: 940

The landspeeder would be lucky to survive to hit the deff dred due to the lootas so the lascannons should be more reliable. The drop podding flamer unit is a lot cheaper than the venerable dread and should have the same effect, and that leaves the dreadnought to tinker away at ork boys. With the 60pts left over, could just grab the landspeeder with dual heavy bolters. But what I'd be more inclined to go for is a whirlwind (even if proxy). Just hide it out of LOS, especially from the lootas, and it should remove swathes of orks every turn. As it costs 65pts, you might have to loose the combi-flamer however.