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So this is my 2k list, for which I've got all the models for. Other than this there's a few TAC squads, devastators, terminators, assault marines (yay... ) lying around. However I''m not opposed to getting other things if I can be convinced.

HQ
[1] Librarian : 100pts
null zone & vortex of doom

Elites
[5] Sternguard Veterans : 215pts
3 combi-meltas
TL-LC razorback
[1] Dreadnought : 125pts
2 TL autocannons
[1] Dreadnought : 125pts
2 TL autocannons

Troops
[10] Tactical Marines : 245pts
plasmagun, heavy bolter, plasma pistol, power sword
rhino
[10] Tactical Marines : 245pts
plasmagun, heavy bolter, plasma pistol, power sword
drop pod
[10] Scouts : 170pts
sniper rifles, camo cloaks

Fast Attack
[3] Landspeeder Squadron : 180pts
heavy bolters, tornado heavy bolters
[1] Attack Bike : 50pts
multi-melta
[1] Attack Bike : 50pts
multi-melta

Heavy Support
[1] Predator : 165pts
sponson lascannons
turret TL-LC
[1] Predator : 165pts
sponson lascannons
turret TL-LC
[1] Predator : 165pts
sponson lascannons
turret TL-LC

Total : 2000

So predictably the librarians with the sternguard and gave him vortex of doom seeing as I've found GOI a bit unreliable for me with it scattering all over the place (chance I know) and it seems like a nice pancake to have up my sleeve. Troops wise, scouts are for home and hopefully precision shots, the squad in the drop pod I've used more as a response to how things progress in the first turn and typically objectives, it's worked well so far. Fast attack looks quite self explanatory to me, just shoot infantry or tanks and hide. Heavy support; along with the TL LC on the razor, I expect to get a bit of flakk for these from looking at history. But I would still stand by the TL LC, I've always found it to be rather unexciting when it comes to shooting the autocannon when everything else is a lascannon. I haven't encountered many fliers, or at least flier spam lists so I expect that between the riflemen and lascannons they should be able to deal to them without needing to invest in something dedicated to it.
Any suggestions? The main points I'm unsure of are the sergeant loadouts (30pts is a bit, the PP has always been useful, the PW less so), the rifleman dreads and the drop podding TAC unit. I guess the TL LCs will pop up so might as well chuck that in to (but if you say to loose them, what would you get instead?).

it isn't a bad list but as a sw player I don't see something to scary in this list and I can't see how the stern guards will help

The list is lacking some AA, if you swapped your FA choices for 2 stormtalons, you will have a better time.

Also I would put your sternguard in the DP and Libby with 5 tacts in your RB. It means the sternguard are a sucide unit, but if they pop some thing big and get first blood, it'll be worth it.

It would be nice to see some AA. If you drop a rifleman you can get a ADL w/quad. Same firepower, plus cover

Not a big fan of vortex. It's heavy, so you can't shoot and move. I'd stick with smite/avenger if you want a shooty power.

I've not had the best luck with 5 man sternguard squads. You want to max out at 10 so you have the weight of fire with the bolters. If you just want fast melta delivery, there are better options the sterns in a razor. I'd switch to a rhino and use spare points to boost the squad. Or go with a drop pod.

Plasma pistols are overpriced IMHO. But then, I'm not a big fan of gear on sergeants. Running with a tac squad as your only drop troop is not something I've seen before. I would thing you'd want something that makes more of an impact when you place it. Might be worth finding the 10 points to get the scouts a heavy weapon. If you can get a few points more, 2x5 man scouts is almost always better then a 10 man unit.

I would run 2xTyphoon/HB speeders rather then 3x HB/HB. Less shots, more flexible firepower.

Melta bikes are good.

It's not the fact that the TLLC is a bad gun, it's the fact that they want us to pay 45 points for the thing. If you drop the preds down to auto/las you can bump your melta bike squads to 2x2 bikes each, with points left over.

I Can tell this is a list designed for "meta"-ish. It all seems very cookie cutter and in all honesty I think that assault squads are not all that bad. Also only three troops at 2000 could get ugly fast.

Good points on the sternguard, I've never really given them a huge amount of consideration as a 5man squad, but in hindsight, with so few shots their output is always low despite special ammunition. Also the landspeeders, I can see how the typhoons could work better. Against anything other than MEQs the HBs work well but as soon as 3+ becomes the norm the unit tends to flounder a bit as I figure out what to do with them. I believe there would be enough vehicles around so dropping 1 landspeeder wouldn't reduce their durability dramatically.
With the TAC squad I've never used it as a hard hitting 1st turn thing. I'd done suicide sterns before but am not a fan of the idea of including units I intend to die after their 1 hit wonder. The TAC squad was used more defensively and just gave me another option to how things roll out in the 1st turn. But I do see how the squad size of the sterns should be increased.
Change around:
Put TAC drop pod squad in a rhino (replacing the razor). Take 2 typhoons instead of the HB speeders. Loose sergeant upgrades on TAC squads. Gives me 100pts spare IIRC.
Up sternguard squad to 9 and put them in the drop pod with the librarian. Give the librarian force dome and null zone so if required, the unit could be protected somewhat if I chuck it in a hot space.

I would like to add combi weapons to the whole unit but points are tight. I could loose the camo cloaks on the scouts and with that 30pts either; get 6 more combi weapons for sternguard (probably 3 more melta and 3 flamer) or split the scouts into 2 and give each squad a missile launcher. I'm leaning more to the combi-weapons but will see.
Now I dont intend to run the sternguard specifically as a suicide unit, but I feel it opens up options a bit.

edit; I thought about assault squads, normally I only run them in casual games in units of 5 with a flamer, PW and meltabombs. Makes them pretty versatile and as long as I pick their fights well they normally achieve something. But with nothing else in the army dedicated to melee, I feel it would be unwise to run a sole unit of them. Any more would require a dramatic reshape of everything.

Your list in the OP looks alright. I would change a few things around though.

Use Vortex of Doom sparingly... 12" range makes it all to easy to scatter back - it happened to me once, not good

The Sargent's loadout would be alright without the Power Sword. It'll save you 30 points.

Why not put a Heavy Bolter in the scout squad? If you do a ML, thats 9 wasted sniper shots on a tank. Go for the Hellfire Heavy Bolter, it'll eat infantry along with the snipers.

The Sternguards in a DP are a nice idea. But dont put the libby with them. Suicide sternguard are good, but throwing your HQ into the fire too... that loses you VPs. If you are going to use them as suicide, 5 men with 3 combi meltas are all you need.

I echo the points above about land speeders. Typhoons are the way to go.

The TLLC on the preds seem a bit overkill, seeing as you have LC sponsons. auto/las or auto/Hbolter are usually the way to go. But in keeping your loadout, you can be fairly reliable against fliers. 3 TLLC from preds and 2 TLAC from dreads gives some anti-air without the need for an aegis line

Its become a bit difficult where to put the librarian. Cant put him in the rhino's as they're full and to drop a TAC squad down to 9 kinda munts it a bit with loosing the specials. I don't really intend to run them as a suicide unit, they'd probably work in a similar role to the original TAC drop pod squad detailed above, just better. As a result I had been tossing giving them combi-plasmas instead of meltas but it didn't quite appeal to me so much. Maybe I should take GOI so they can get out of there instead of force dome.
For the scouts I'm pretty mixed about the heavy weapon. Snipers have still got the rending so wont be totally useless against vehicles (it's not as though I'll be shooting at AV13 considering the other stuff I got). It would probably make more sense to get HB though, currently I feel there is adequate anti tank but against a pure horde I think this would get rolled over, such as my orks which just have 150odd guys walking up with a heap of klaws in the mix. Its not as though the 2 HBs alone will solve this but its something

I've found that with Sternguard you've really only got 3 main choices

1)Go Small: 1 Suicide Squad: 5 man in DP with combi-meltas for a quick big kill and First Blood

2)Go Big: Alpha strike, At least 2 10 man squads of Stern in DPs with full combi (5/5 meta/flamer) backed up with a DP ironclad or Contemptor dread (Lucius Pod if you can). Make sure that you have 5 pods in the army and these guys will destroy whatever flank you land them on. Artilery support in the form of Pedro's Obital barrage and a TFC or 2 will also keep them alive longer.

3)Hop and Pop: One 10 Man squad with a few combi-weps (melta/flamer) on foot with a Libby (with GOI) to port around the board trouble shooting problems and hopefully causing you're opponent to lose target priority

All three of them work fine, just pick one role for them and stick to it

 Instinctual wrote:
I've found that with Sternguard you've really only got 3 main choices

1)Go Small: 1 Suicide Squad: 5 man in DP with combi-meltas for a quick big kill and First Blood

2)Go Big: Alpha strike, At least 2 10 man squads of Stern in DPs with full combi (5/5 meta/flamer) backed up with a DP ironclad or Contemptor dread (Lucius Pod if you can). Make sure that you have 5 pods in the army and these guys will destroy whatever flank you land them on. Artilery support in the form of Pedro's Obital barrage and a TFC or 2 will also keep them alive longer.

3)Hop and Pop: One 10 Man squad with a few combi-weps (melta/flamer) on foot with a Libby (with GOI) to port around the board trouble shooting problems and hopefully causing you're opponent to lose target priority

All three of them work fine, just pick one role for them and stick to it

I'd like to add:

4) Faux-dev squad. 5 men, two heavy weapons. If you have a free elite slot they are a good way to get some extra firepower into your gun line. You get the heavies for a lot fewer points then a dev squad pays. Sure, you miss the BS5 from the signum, but the the ablative bolter boys have special ammo and the whole squad has a veteran stat line. And if you are running a Pedro list, they count as a scoring unit.
.

Next Tuesday I'll give you a chance to test it out against a 2000point version of my ultimate Ork Cheese list if your game.

We'll see whose cheese is the stinkiest.

I suggest that your anus be prepared in advance

Edit: Your list lacks the trademark spammage of a power list? I can't tell jack about SM, but if it lacks the same level of obnoxious powerbuilding as my list maybe I should field my 1650 list to help balance it out. Your call.

 Nevelon wrote:

 Instinctual wrote:
I've found that with Sternguard you've really only got 3 main choices

1)Go Small: 1 Suicide Squad: 5 man in DP with combi-meltas for a quick big kill and First Blood

2)Go Big: Alpha strike, At least 2 10 man squads of Stern in DPs with full combi (5/5 meta/flamer) backed up with a DP ironclad or Contemptor dread (Lucius Pod if you can). Make sure that you have 5 pods in the army and these guys will destroy whatever flank you land them on. Artilery support in the form of Pedro's Obital barrage and a TFC or 2 will also keep them alive longer.

3)Hop and Pop: One 10 Man squad with a few combi-weps (melta/flamer) on foot with a Libby (with GOI) to port around the board trouble shooting problems and hopefully causing you're opponent to lose target priority

All three of them work fine, just pick one role for them and stick to it

I'd like to add:

4) Faux-dev squad. 5 men, two heavy weapons. If you have a free elite slot they are a good way to get some extra firepower into your gun line. You get the heavies for a lot fewer points then a dev squad pays. Sure, you miss the BS5 from the signum, but the the ablative bolter boys have special ammo and the whole squad has a veteran stat line. And if you are running a Pedro list, they count as a scoring unit.
.

Excellent point Nevelon, I've used that one in the past on your advice and it worked well

 Dakkamite wrote:
Next Tuesday I'll give you a chance to test it out against a 2000point version of my ultimate Ork Cheese list if your game.

We'll see whose cheese is the stinkiest.

I suggest that your anus be prepared in advance

Edit: Your list lacks the trademark spammage of a power list? I can't tell jack about SM, but if it lacks the same level of obnoxious powerbuilding as my list maybe I should field my 1650 list to help balance it out. Your call.

Lol, that was something that actually was laugh out loud, not just one of the usual hmphs. I guess its as ready as it ever will be. As far as power building goes, I dont think this really follows that style. There's a few bits in there just cause I want them to be but overall, I still think it can be competitive. Is your 2k list horde or mech. I think against mech I stand a chance but I'm pretty sure a pure horde would roll over me any day. Just not enough lascannons to catch them all .

I do like the idea of the faux-dev squad. But then that leaves me with the issue of where to put the librarian. Would prefer to get him in an up close unit seeing as that's where he can do stuff, but if the sternguard sit back and shoot; there's no where for him to go with rhino's full. What about loosing the librarian entirely and getting a MOTF? I think he could bring more benefit in this setting with bolster defences for the scouts and repairs for all the vehicles I've got floating around.

So loose librarian and current sternguard in drop pod for 405ish points I think.

Then get 1 MOTF and 5 sternguard with 2 lascannons, and then another 5 sternguard with a plasma cannon = 405.


edit; shoot, looking back over it, adding 2 sternguard would give me 4 elites... breaking the single FOC. I guess I could combine them into one but as a heavy support squad it would render the extras redundant.
Well... suggestions of what I could do instead?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Looking back at it, thats a bit of a mess to read. So a redo of the list


With the 70 left over there are 2 main options I'm considering
1/ another MM attack bike and meltabombs on the sergeants
2/ bike and conversion beamer on MoTF and meltabombs on sergeants.

The intent with the MoTF is so he can stay in the backfield and fix up vehicles if able/needed. Following this I would want to give him a decent ranged attack hence the conversion beamer. The bikes' just for relentless, T5 and mobility. But in doing this he looses the +1 to repair rolls from the servo-harness. I feel option 2 is better but I've never run a MoTF before so just looking for advice.

Cheers

Definately go with a conversion beamer on the MotF.

I dont see the need for PW on sarges, tbh.

And your MM bikes should be split into two squads. That allows you to shoot two different targets, and, stops overkill

True about the attack bikes, they were meant to be singles but if I went with the 3rd one I'd have to run a duo and a solo so it was kind of in anticipation for that. I have liked the PW for challenges, but then some games they never even get close to that situation. Loosing them and the meltabombs, I could probably squeeze the other MM attack bike with the MOTF bike. Sounds a bit more reasonable to me.