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Hi,

I have a query regarding wound allocation, specifically of that which is mentioned on page 4 in the 1.4 update of the 40k rule book: "Q: When making a shooting attack against a unit, can wounds from the wound pool be allocated to models that were not within range of any of the shooting models when to hit rolls were made? A: No".

Would this mean that, for example, a space marine tactical squad would be able to wound every single model in a target unit, even if some enemy models were out of range of the bolters, if the marine unit included say a lascannon that was in range of all of the models in the target unit?

And what about rapid firing bolters (or "Rapis Fire" as it is misprinted on page 56, Boltgun) would their maximum range be 12" or 24" for the purpose of working out if models are out of range for wound allocation?

A boltgun is 24" range. It merely has permission to fire twice at 12" range (more specifically, it has permission to fire twice at half its maximum range), but that does not change it's range. People seem to be confused on this because of how rapid fire worked in previous editions.

The FAQ you pointed is stating that you can't allocate wounds to models that were farther back than 24" if your range on all shooting is 24".

The FAQ you pointed is stating that you can't allocate wounds to models that were farther back than 24" if your range on all shooting is 24".

Yes, but if said unit included one lascannon would the bolters then magically be able to wound models beyond 24"?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Anyone?

 Spehs Mehreens wrote:

The FAQ you pointed is stating that you can't allocate wounds to models that were farther back than 24" if your range on all shooting is 24".

Yes, but if said unit included one lascannon would the bolters then magically be able to wound models beyond 24"?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Anyone?

So long as the bolters were within 24" to begin with.

But no, one lascannon does not extend the max range of a boltgun.

 Kevin949 wrote:

 Spehs Mehreens wrote:

The FAQ you pointed is stating that you can't allocate wounds to models that were farther back than 24" if your range on all shooting is 24".

Yes, but if said unit included one lascannon would the bolters then magically be able to wound models beyond 24"?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Anyone?

So long as the bolters were within 24" to begin with.

But no, one lascannon does not extend the max range of a boltgun.

I meant that if a unit armed with boltguns and one lascannon shot at a unit consisting of say 10 models. Lets say 5 of these models were in range of the 24" range bolters but the rest were not. Now, would the inclusion of a lascannon mean that the other 5 models could also be wounded by the boltguns because they would no longer be out of range of "any of the shooting models when to hit rolls were made"?

 Spehs Mehreens wrote:
I meant that if a unit armed with boltguns and one lascannon shot at a unit consisting of say 10 models. Lets say 5 of these models were in range of the 24" range bolters but the rest were not. Now, would the inclusion of a lascannon mean that the other 5 models could also be wounded by the boltguns because they would no longer be out of range of "any of the shooting models when to hit rolls were made"?

Yes.

See guys, wasn't that hard to answer his question

Q: When making a shooting attack against a unit, can wounds from the wound pool be allocated to models that were not within range of any of the shooting models when to hit rolls were made? A: No

I underlined the important part.
See how they say "any"? That implies that they can wound a model outside of 24" if the squad has a missile launcher or lascannon.

That's how a ml or lascannon magically extends the range of ordinary bolters.

 Spehs Mehreens wrote:
That's how a ml or lascannon magically extends the range of ordinary bolters.

No, it is how the presence of a ML or Lascannon magically extends the range from which models can be removed. There is quite a bit of difference in consequences when you compare these two sentences.


...

It does not do that though, it only extends the range of allowable wound allocation, which is not actually extending the range since when determining a target in the shooting sequence, you target a UNIT not a MODEL (even if that unit is only one model, you are still targeting a UNIT).

I get where you're coming from but too many people equate allocating wounds with "range of weapons".

No, it is how the presence of a ML or Lascannon magically extends the range from which models can be removed. There is quite a bit of difference in consequences when you compare these two sentences.

It does not do that though, it only extends the range of allowable wound allocation, which is not actually extending the range since when determining a target in the shooting sequence, you target a UNIT not a MODEL (seriously you think I'm dumb don't you?) (even if that unit is only one model, you are still targeting a UNIT).

Of course I know that a ml or lascannon doesn't increase the actual range of boltguns, God damn nit-picking...

You might get it, but apparently you missed AAAAALLLL the people that made that very mistake right after the FAQ came out.

 Spehs Mehreens wrote:
God damn nit-picking...

It's not nit-picking in a RAW discussion--it's precision.
Also, your avatar picture is of a mentally-challenged "Spehs Mehreen." You present yourself as someone who has trouble understanding things--is it surprising that people believe your depiction and try to take extra care explaining things to you?

Unlike you I'm not going to degrade myself by resorting to personal attacks. The avatar picture is from a 'Dawn of war' parody and is meant to be funny.

Also if the two previous posters had read the following post by me they might have known that I understand wound allocation and that a longer ranged weapon does not increase the range of other weapons (what a preposterous assumption):

I meant that if a unit armed with boltguns and one lascannon shot at a unit consisting of 10 models. Lets say 5 of these models were in range of the 24" range bolters but the rest were not. Now, would the inclusion of a lascannon mean that the other 5 models could also be wounded by the boltguns because they would no longer be out of range of "any of the shooting models when to hit rolls were made"?

 Spehs Mehreens wrote:
I meant that if a unit armed with boltguns and one lascannon shot at a unit consisting of 10 models. Lets say 5 of these models were in range of the 24" range bolters but the rest were not. Now, would the inclusion of a lascannon mean that the other 5 models could also be wounded by the boltguns because they would no longer be out of range of "any of the shooting models when to hit rolls were made"?

That is how it works.

Pre FaQ you did not even need the Lascannon there to kill all 10 enemy models, even though half of them were out of range of the bolters.

 Spehs Mehreens wrote:

No, it is how the presence of a ML or Lascannon magically extends the range from which models can be removed. There is quite a bit of difference in consequences when you compare these two sentences.

It does not do that though, it only extends the range of allowable wound allocation, which is not actually extending the range since when determining a target in the shooting sequence, you target a UNIT not a MODEL (seriously you think I'm dumb don't you?) (even if that unit is only one model, you are still targeting a UNIT).

Of course I know that a ml or lascannon doesn't increase the actual range of boltguns, God damn nit-picking...

It's painfully obvious that not everyone does know that, so ya I'm nitpicking.

When you say "X magically increases the range of Y" what do you think someone who is already confused on the subject is going to think?

To answer your question, yes I do. But everyone on the internet is dumb (including me). It's how the internet works. No matter how smart you may be, things have to be very plainly spelled out for other people that may happen across this.