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Listening to Life After the Cover Save and this came up...

Zooming StormRaven crashes with DCA inside, they assaulted a squad of Eldar after the Crash and Burn resolution. Can you do this? Assaulting out of crashed flyer that was zooming seems like it was still a zooming flyer, therefore not allowed.

Am I right or are the LATCS guys right on?

At the start of the turn, the vehicle was no longer zooming, but it was an assault vehicle. If the unit passed it's pinning test I'd assume they may assault.

Zooming has no bearing on it. The vehicle has the Assault Vehicle rule so yes, they can assault after crashing.

There was a FAQ about it.

"Q: If a unit disembarks from a destroyed vehicle during the enemy turn, can it Charge in the Assault phase of its own turn? (p80)
A: No, unless the vehicle in question was an Assault Vehicle."

40k-noob covered when it's destroyed during the enemy turn. However, the Assault Vehicle rule also covers if it happens in your own movement phase.

Per pg 33: for Assault Vehicle
"....even on a turn that the vehicle was destroyed."

Whenever the book references "turn" it means "player turn".

In this case if the storm raven came on and was hit during it's movement phase (via Interceptor) and crashed, then yes the DCA's would still be able to assault that same player turn.

clively wrote:
In this case if the storm raven came on and was hit during it's movement phase (via Interceptor) and crashed, then yes the DCA's would still be able to assault that same player turn.

Except that would mean they are assaulting on the turn they arrived from reserve

DCA are not disembarking though. That happens on a wrecked result, they are placed on an explodes result. It also says that units CANNOT disembark from a zooming flyer. I am at a loss for anything that says the DCA would have disembarked, both page 80 and page 81 make it clear that these models are placed, where as a wrecked result clearly says disembarked. Further more, page 33 makes is equally clear that the Assault Vehicle USR only applies to disembarking passengers (again these are not, they are placed and depending on the cause of the crash are either prohibited or twice prohibited from disembarking).

There are a couple of references to the unit counting as disembarking after an Explodes result.
P426 as an example, at the bottom.

I'm under the impression it is widely accepted that placing models as a result of a vehicle exploding is disembarking because the rules regarding assaulting models after shooting and destroying their transport refer to the "now disembarked models".

grendel083 wrote:There are a couple of references to the unit counting as disembarking after an Explodes result.
P426 as an example, at the bottom.

Even if that trumps the core rules (not saying it doesn't), this would not remove the restriction of being placed, not disembarked, from a zooming flyer

Drunkspleen wrote:I'm under the impression it is widely accepted that placing models as a result of a vehicle exploding is disembarking because the rules regarding assaulting models after shooting and destroying their transport refer to the "now disembarked models".

Yeah, not sure what their intent was there... but again, models in a zooming flyer simply cannot disembark: prerequisite for using "Assault vehicle USR"

Bugs_N_Orks wrote:

clively wrote:
In this case if the storm raven came on and was hit during it's movement phase (via Interceptor) and crashed, then yes the DCA's would still be able to assault that same player turn.

Except that would mean they are assaulting on the turn they arrived from reserve

The Assault Vehicle does not allow units that just came in from Reserve to make a charge that turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Lobukia wrote:

grendel083 wrote:There are a couple of references to the unit counting as disembarking after an Explodes result.
P426 as an example, at the bottom.

Even if that trumps the core rules (not saying it doesn't), this would not remove the restriction of being placed, not disembarked, from a zooming flyer

Drunkspleen wrote:I'm under the impression it is widely accepted that placing models as a result of a vehicle exploding is disembarking because the rules regarding assaulting models after shooting and destroying their transport refer to the "now disembarked models".

Yeah, not sure what their intent was there... but again, models in a zooming flyer simply cannot disembark: prerequisite for using "Assault vehicle USR"

So what is the problem here? If the DCA are not disembarking, so the Assault Vehicle USR is not in play. Then what could possibly hold the DCA from assaulting normally?
"Crash and Burn" doesn't restrict Assaults.
"Destroyed Vehicle" doesn't restrict Assaults.

40k-noob wrote:

"Destroyed Vehicle" doesn't restrict Assaults.

FAQ does

 Lobukia wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

"Destroyed Vehicle" doesn't restrict Assaults.

FAQ does

Which FAQ question?

40k-noob wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

"Destroyed Vehicle" doesn't restrict Assaults.

FAQ does

Which FAQ question?

FAQ for rulebook page 80

The FAQ clearly permits assaulting after disembarking from an assault vehicle that has been destroyed. This is explicitly supported.
If 'placement' isn't disembarking, then the restriction on assaulting due to disembarking doesn't apply, because the unit didn't disembark.

Regardless of which interpretation you support, assaulting from an Exploded vehicle is permitted.

Well it's a very good canundrum you have here.


If the storm raven had just come on the board and was shot doen from interceptor then I would say they could not have assaulted that turn because there is nothing to override the assaulting from reserve rule.

That being said, if it was on the table and then destroyed In a subsequent turn, then assaulting from a wrecked assault vehicle takes precedence. Remember no matter the wording getting out from a vehicle in any fashion other Than say skies of blood is disembarking.

Just my two pennies worth.

 Lobukia wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

"Destroyed Vehicle" doesn't restrict Assaults.

FAQ does

Which FAQ question?

FAQ for rulebook page 80

you mean the FAQ I quoted? This one:
"Q: If a unit disembarks from a destroyed vehicle during the enemy turn, can it Charge in the Assault phase of its own turn? (p80)
A: No, unless the vehicle in question was an Assault Vehicle."

The same FAQ that is referring to "Disembarking" models, which as you say, does not happen in a "Crash and Burn" nor in a "Explodes!"

So how again does this restrict Assaults by the DCA?

I'd say yes, they can. It's another poorly written small oversight lingering from the change from 5E to 6E.

I would say that they can as long as, as stated, the Flyer was not shot down via Interceptor on the turn it arrived from reserves.

And as long as the flyer has the Assault rule, which the Stormraven has.

 GreyHamster wrote:
The FAQ clearly permits assaulting after disembarking from an assault vehicle that has been destroyed. This is explicitly supported.
If 'placement' isn't disembarking, then the restriction on assaulting due to disembarking doesn't apply, because the unit didn't disembark.

Regardless of which interpretation you support, assaulting from an Exploded vehicle is permitted.

Yeah, noob kinda said the same thing. Even if I get the angle I'm shooting for, then they would just be on the board, and so can move and assault as normal.

I feel like this is a pretty RAW tight conclusion: assaulting from an exploded, zooming, assault vehicle flyer IS allowed. Sorry for running this one to the ground, but I serve as the TO for a 20ish member club and we have some pretty intense rule lawyers and a few WAAC guys. Just wanted to make sure that my instinct was right/wrong and have solid rules to back it up. This past month we added an Assault Ram, x2 StormRavens, and x2 StormEagles to various lists, so I needed to have this reasoned out somewhere neutral and objective instead of flipping through books while two players lobby for their PoV (and so people who don't realize that they can assault would know about it).

Thanks guys, good to know I was wrong and why. Seems really odd that jumping out of a parked Rhino means I cannot assault, but surviving a high-speed plane crash does... but oh well.