New Battletech Intro Box (better plastic figs) and "Alpha Strike" book (Fast-play,Tabletop rules)

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**Eilif**

I was pretty happy to read about this.
http://bg.battletech.com/?p=4970

Many of you have noticed that the Introductory Box Set is hard to find and that’s because it’s currently out of stock.

While the previous printing of the box set was almost univerally lauded as one of the best introductions yet to BattleTech, it did have its issues. The main one, of course, was the quality of the 24 miniatures.

Even though we knew it would be several months without the game on store shelves again, we felt we simply couldn’t release a reprint using the same miniatures. As such, we’ve moved the entire reprint to a completely new company and we’ve generated all new sculpts based on the great, original Iron Wind Metals’ metal miniatures.

Attached are two of the first photos of pre-final miniatures. There will be some shrinkage (simply the case of working with plastics) from this look, but for those that own the current miniatures, you should notice a drastic increase in quality. As more photos become available down the line, I’ll provide some updates…specifically of comparison shots between the previous printings’ miniatures and these new ones.

While we were at it, we decided to trade out the Thor and the Loki for a little more iconic ‘Mechs. Again, these are photos direct from the factory of pre-final miniatures; once we’ve more photos, happy to pass them along.

Finally, since it’s not really the “25th anniversary” any more (can you believe we’re almost at 30?!), not to mention we feel the increase in the quality of the miniaturs is significant enough to warrant a differentiation from the previous printing, we felt it appropriate to throw on a cover and stock number…couldn’t resist getting another cover from the fantastic Alex Iglesias.

Price isn’t changing, we’re just tweaking up the quality…it’ll be available in the fall.

Randall

Pics of two masters of the basic-style plastic figs

The two special multipart plastic figs that will be included

Looks like good news for Mech fans. The plastic figs of the last boxed set were cheap but a real weak spot. Better sculpts and better casting could make this box really irresistable.

Also really good news since "Alpha Strike" (the quickstrike fast-play, tabletop battles rules in a standalone book) is being released soon, new players will have an easy way to pack the table with mechs for a game that allows many more units per side and plays at a fraction of the time of CBT.
http://bg.battletech.com/?p=4890

When we published Strategic Operations several years ago, a lot of people instantly fell in love with what is really a pretty small part of the book…the Quick-Strike Rules. And we immediately began getting questions of “when will you release a stand-alone rulebook of that?”

For those wondering what Quick-Strike is, the easiest answer is that it is the truest form yet published for being able to play BattleTech in a true “tabletop miniatures” style and speed, while still feeling like your playing BattleTech.

At the start of the year I had been thinking heavily about this, especially after years, at this point, of seeing plenty of people playing BattleTech in this manner at conventions. I then pitched the concept to Herb of a complete, stand-alone rulebook that would be the “table-top miniatures game” play of BattleTech. As it happened, great minds think alike and Herb had already been working an an epub release. I felt we shouldn’t only go half way on that and instead should embrace a full print book, full-color, hardback…the works (I know…shocking I wanted the kitchen sink in there…).

With that we got to work. The original outline, unfortunately, even for us, was way, way too much data as we wanted to cover every Era and even provide samples armies for all such Eras…the book might have been one of the biggest we’ve ever published…not to mention being crazy intimidating for other tabletop miniatures players that might want to give this a try.

So we immediately started trimming back, while still ensuring the book will provide a complete, full BattleTech experience that would have players coming back for more. This also allows for the creation of a series of great epubs to build upon the solid framework of Alpha Strike.

But wait…if they were called Quick-Srike why are we calling this Alpha Strike?! Well, to be honest, in hindsight the former is just too close to “Quick-Start” and we’ve gotten a fair bit of confusion along the way…hence a more unique name this time around.

We’re currently on track to have this at Gen Con with the book available to the public in September…or at least that’s the current plans…will see if it survives drop insertion….

In the meantime, this is the first of several blogs where I’ll discuss this great project…the drive flare of an incoming DropShip, announcing its coming…we’ll start getting into the bowels of what the ship carries in the coming weeks and months.

See ya there…

Randall

I've got a fair number of mechs from the 90's and I bought the last starter box on a whim. I love the BT universe (have every printed novel and most sourcebooks), but can't handle CBT rules, so these two are must-buy on my list. The ability to play Battletech on tabletop terrain with a larger force and a faster game is really appealing to me.

**Eilif**

warboss wrote:
So is the intro box going to include the alpha strike rules?

Nope.
If it's like the last one (and it probably will be since it's a reprint) the intro box will contain:
-24 unpainted, ready-to-play plastic BattleMech minis
-2 unpainted, premium-quality plastic BattleMech minis
-One 12-page full-color quick-start (not the same thing as QuickStrike/AlphStrike) rulebook
-36-page book of pre-generated BattleMech Record Sheets
-One 80-page full-color rulebook
-Inner Sphere at a Glance, a 56-page full-color book of universe background and BattleMech technical data
-One 16-page full-color Painting and Tactics Guide
-Two heavy-duty cards of compiled tables
-Two 18″ x 24″ game-board quality maps

It's basically the game with complete rules for the Succession wars era (pre 3050).

Alpha strike will be a separate rulebook with rules for Tabletop terrain and hexed play. I don't know what stat cards it will come with, but construction rules should be included, and there are several sites online -both official and unofficial- that have large, legal, libraries of stat cards.

If anyone is curious about how Alpha Strike plays, check the "Battleforce" Quick start rules and some Quick-strike (the old name for Alpha Srike) unit cards here:
http://bg.battletech.com/?page_id=27
The core rules (and stats for units) are the same, except Battleforce uses a hex and treats each unit as a squad, whereas Alpha Strike is primarily designed for tabletop play and treats each unit as one mech/vehicle/infantry unit.

**Eilif**

warboss wrote:
Thanks for the link. The cards do look like they are simplified significantly and combat the relatively steep learning curve and imposing sheet new players find when trying the game. Does quick start + quick strike just not "feel" battletechy enough that they're not including it in an upcoming intro? It would seem to me that you'd want the intro box to ease players into the game and then have them graduate up (if they want) to the complexity of the full game and stats.

The game set comes with simplified version of the BT game designed to ease folks into the included ruleset which is itself a more streamlined version of the Main game that can be found in the "Total Warfare" book.

I think they do this to try and get folks to play CBT which has alot more potential for selling them books. Alpha strike doesn't require nearly as many books.

Manchu wrote:
judgedoug wrote:
Alternately we could also play sooner, since I own Strategic Operations.
Cheers. I believe I have it as well just never looked to deeply into it.

I bought the PDF of StratOps to do just this, but having to shuffle back and forth between BF and QS sections was too much hassle. Even as a much more streamlined rulset, there's no way I could sell that mess to my gaming club. On the other hand, I've mentioned the Alpha Strike bookto a few of them as a possible game to play with our rebased mechwarrior figures and even one of they guys who things the BT universe is silly is interested now!

**Eilif**

Lots of strong feelings here about BT and it's complexity. I'm in the camp of folks who just want fast-playing rules and not alot of record keeping, chart checking or tracking. However, I understand that many folks want a more simulation-ish ruleset and CBT is a great system for those who really want strong differentiation between units, customizability and choice.

Perhaps rather than denigrating someone elses choice of game, we can just be happy that there will now be two very different ways to play the game and both will be very accessible via published rulebooks.

CBT: Very detailed mech game, almost a simulation that allows players to dive into the depth of the Battletech universe.

Alpha Strike: A fast playing tactical game for those preferring larger engagements tabletop play and streamlined rulesets.

**Eilif**

Tamwulf wrote:

When Catalyst took over the reigns, I had high hopes. I even knew one of the play testers and got to play what I feel was the best set of mech rules ever. When the actual game came out, he was pissed that they basically stuck with the old rules, and bastardized the play test rules into the quick start stuff. I have no doubt that the new Alpha Strike rules are those play test rules from back in 2006. No hex maps. No bubble sheets. No 10,000 little rules to remember. It's a completely different game. Plays fast and smooth and still has the Battletech flavor.

I may just get back into the game using those Alpha Strike rules.

Can't argue about the complexity, but I do know that for many BT fans, the fact that the rules have changed little over the past 25 years is one of the things that they really appreciate about the system. It means that except for certain rulebooks, nearly every BT supplement, ever produced can still be used in the game. Your sourcebooks never get nerfed or made obsolete. In fact, the "Introductory Rules" (used to be called level 1) have changed so little that you can probably use the same box set rulebooks from the 90's with little/no change.

As for the Alpha Strike rules, I can't say for sure that none of those play test rules will be incorporated, but I wouldn't count on it. It's already been made fairly clear that Alpha Strike is just a new layout (much needed), standalone vehicle for the Quick-Strike rules (which are a mod of Battleforce), possibly with a few tweaks. If you want a feel for what the rules will be like, download the Battleforce intro rules and Quick-Strike sample cards here:
http://bg.battletech.com/?page_id=27

**Eilif**

Tamwulf wrote:

I also don't agree that the Alpha Strike rules will just be a blending of the traditional rules and Battleforce. I haven't seen where Catalyst has said Alpha Strike is just a new layout/clean up of the game sheet....

...IMHO, all Catalyst Games has done is pander to the old school fan boys of Battletech and done little/nothing to get new people into the game. If you only make 200 box sets and sell them all, does that make it "Wildly successful?"...

As for Alpha strike rules, I didn't say its a blending of the traditional rules. Rather, as the press release suggests, it's a stand-alone book version of "Quick Strike".
"Quick Strike" is "Battleforce" (not to be confused with "Battletech") taken to the tabletop and units represent units rather than squads (In battleforce each unit is a lance/platoon etc). The two games are so similar that they use the same stat cards and the designers have already stated that the cards will stay the same.

As for the boxed set and "wildly succesfull" I have no national numbers, but my FLGS (which normally doesn't stock more than a small battletech selection) had two very tall stacks of BT boxed sets and they all sold out. It surprised me as I didn't think there were that many BT fans around. I don't know (in fact I kind of doubt it) those buyers actually played BT much after getting the boxed set, but from all accounts, the last two versions of the BT boxed set were good sellers.

**Eilif**

GBL wrote:
Battletech doesn't need to be exactly the same as every other game, what it does need is a single entry book with all the rules for the most common units, rather than spreading that out over 4.

The rules in the starterbox don't cover everything you'll find in "tournament level" play, but to be fair the "Total Warfare" book does and even has the standard unit construction rules for mechs.

The Techmanual has advanced construction rules and rules for building anything else, but most folks probably won't need it.

As for a list of common units, that's another thing entirely. Except for the stats that come with the intro set, you do have to buy a TRO for whatever era you are fighting.

Still, a new player (or any player for that matter) can still have alot of fun running mech v mech actions in the pre-3050 universe using only what comes in the starter. It even has some rules for limited mech customization. There's even additonal starterbooks and TRO 3037 that you can use without buying the Total Warfare hardback rulebook.

Beyond that you have to get TW, but that's why they call it an "Introductory box".

**Eilif**

DarkTraveler777 wrote:
Ouze wrote:
Can someone briefly explain what the Alpha Strike rules are, as well as Quick Strike? I know there are here as a PDF, are they just essentially quick start rules vs advanced rules?

The Quick Strike rules are a paired down version of the basic rules set. They take away things like heat and abstract movement and damage resolution. It is literally a "quick" way to either introduce someone to the feel of Battletech or get a fast game in on a lunch break.

Alpha Strike will likely be similar.

Not quite. The problem is that many folks confuse "Quick Start" and "Quick Strike".

"Quick Start" is the pared down version of the basic ruleset. It is included in the introductory boxed set as a lead-in into the Battletech "Introductory" rules. However, "Quick Start" rules and record sheets are not compatible with "Battletech" Introductory rules or record sheets.

The Battletech "Introductory Rules" cover mech vs mech combat and technology in the pre 3050 era. They use the same record sheets and are compatible with the full Battletech Game as found in the main rulebook "Total Warfare".

"Quick Strike" (soon to be named "Alpha Strike") is something else entirely. It is a ruleset derived from the "Battleforce" game.
"Battleforce is a Tactical level ruleset played out on a hex map where each miniature or chit represents a formation (Lance, Platoon, etc). The mechanics are similar, but less complex than Battletech and it has it's own unique unit cards. It's made to have alot more units on the table than regular Battletech. Battleforce was formerly a stand-alone game, but now has been rolled into the "Strategic Operations" Book.

Quick Strike is a ruleset derrived from Battleforce. It uses most of the same rules, and the same unit cards. The main differences are:
-It's played on 3d terrain (though it can be played hexed)
-One miniature equals what it is, not a lance or platoon of them.

**Eilif**

IceRaptor wrote:
Unix wrote:
I'm in the HBMC/Death by Monkeys camp on this on but I don't see why both rule sets can't coexist peacefully. Few people play one game/rule system exclusively and so giving people options would open the game up to more people.

As a long-term fan of Heavy Gear, I would offer warning here - a system that tries to be three things to five people inevitably does all three things poorly. Design choices will be made over time to emphasize one aspect over another, and generally that's hard to reconcile in a way that makes everybody happy.

I'm not saying it can't be done... but it is a pretty hard challenge.

I disagree. I think that having distinct games under one theme is a fairly successful model. It's when you try to make one game to cover more than one scope of play that things get bogged down. It's why 40k Apocalypse games take all day, when games of that scope would better handled by a ruleset like Epic 40k.

BT does it right by offering a coherent universe, but separate games that -while having the ability to exist together in a wider campagin- each have their own rules.

In the Battletech Universe, you can already
-RPG with "A time of War"
-Lance V Lance with "Battletech"
-Platoon V Platoon with "Quick Strike", soon to be "Alpha Strike"
-Battallion v Battallion or larger with "Battleforce"
-Space Combat with "Aerotech"
-There's even overall rules for managing or running an interstellar campaign.

**Eilif**

IceRaptor wrote:

That was more the warning; each of those properties consumes some amount of developer time and energy. If your business can support all three - great! But it's hard to have the resources to do all three well, instead of simply jamming poorly implemented instances together and calling it done so you can sell 'a combined experience'.

It can - and has - been done. But it takes essentially 5 companies, not just one, IMO.

Seems to be working ok for Battletech. However, a big reason that the 5 systems work is that they've had almost 35 years to create them. Even though they have been repackaged in new books and tweaked here and there, all of those systems (except Quick/Alpha-Strike) are over 10 years old, and a couple are over 20. So you end up with continuity and systems that have had alot of playtesting and tweaking, but it also makes it hard to create "fresh" experiences, which is one of the biggest complaints that folks have about BT.

Unfortunately (or "fortunately" depending on your point of view) I'm not sure it is even possible to revamp BT games without upsetting that balance. Even AlphaStrike isn't really an exception as it's a game that already exists, just not one that is presently published in an easily accessible form.

**Eilif**

GBL wrote:

Well they say they are constantly underestimating demand for their product.

But this is also the company that used contractors wages to paint a house, and then had their accountant resign when they asked them to cover it up.

Evidence? Explanation?

**Eilif**

GBL wrote:
Eilif wrote:
GBL wrote:

Well they say they are constantly underestimating demand for their product.

But this is also the company that used contractors wages to paint a house, and then had their accountant resign when they asked them to cover it up.

Evidence? Explanation?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=catalyst+game+labs+embezzlement

Yeah, thanks for the google link.... real helpful...

If you're going go make overly-simplistic and potentially misleading blanket statements, the onus is on you to back them up. Not on us to go searching to see whether what you say is valid.

I recall something about Loren Coleman, and financial misdeeds from a few years back, but I don't think your single statement really explains the situation well.

**Eilif**

Thanks for that. I never did hear how things shook out post the discovery of Coleman's misdeeds, but it appears not much has been said since 2010. Was there ever any word as to if/whether the colemans were paying back the $ they stole?
Everything seems to have gone quiet since April 2010.

**Eilif**

judgedoug wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Example of unit card:

Thanks for posting that. I didn't realize it had gone up for pre-order. Those new stat cards are quite a visual upgrade (though functionally identical) to the old plain ones. Very Pretty!

The old ones (front and back shown here):

Not bad, but not as nice.

**Eilif**

Here's a very thorough review of Alpha Srike from the author of the Goalsystem (Supersystem, Chaos in Carpathia, Delves, etc...) series of games.
http://www.playunplugged.com/2013/07/review-battletech-alpha-strike-pdf-version/

**Eilif**

I don't know if it was mentioned earlier, but check here:
http://www.pryderockindustries.com/dl_game_aids.php#BFC
For alot of Alpha Strike cards in a format/size that matches playing cards with pictures.

**Eilif**

Manchu wrote:Does anyone know if the new Introductory Box Set will only have different miniatures or whether there will be any chance to the other components as well?

The only "New" mechs in the box set will be the two bonus mechs of Battlemaster and Mad Cat. The rest of the Mechs are the same models, based on the same sculpts except that they have reportedly made new masters and are using a new company.

GBL wrote:
Fallen668 wrote:
Now if they could just get away from Iron Wind Metals and get some better minis going at a more reasonable price.

You are in the same place I am here. You need to check out the N-Scale customs, that are becoming a a bit of a localized phenomenon in battletech.

http://www.lordsofthebattlefield.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=39193

These guys make better, higher quality mechs than IWM have ever seen.

The customs are cool, but to be fair, N scale Mechs are twice as big as IWM makes. At that scale it's much easier to add alot of detail. The real surprise is that they cost less than twice as much!

I note also that that maker is making Battletech scale mechs as well, at about Battletech prices and they are beautiful. IWM should consider buying his designs. Or shutting him down.

**Eilif**

Manchu wrote:
Yep, I got that. My question is more about the books, mats, etc.

I'm pretty sure that everything else is the same.

Ghaz wrote:
Eilif wrote:
I note also that that maker is making Battletech scale mechs as well, at about Battletech prices and they are beautiful. IWM should consider buying his designs.

You do realize that Iron Wind Metals does not design the 'mechs? They simply turn the artwork provided by Catalyst into three dimensional miniatures.

I realize this. I was referring to his particular 3d designs. As far as I can tell IWM and he both appear to be working from the same 2d design, yet his execution looks better to me. Even more remarkable since he probably just has the picture in the TRO and whatever he might be able to find in other sourcebooks, and IWM probably gets more detailed drawings from Catalyst.

**Eilif**

judgedoug wrote:
Eilif wrote:

Even more remarkable since he probably just has the picture in the TRO and whatever he might be able to find in other sourcebooks, and IWM probably gets more detailed drawings from Catalyst.

Not in the least bit. They're using the 3d mech files in Mechwarrior Online (and Mechwarrior 4 for the Fafnir, Vulture, etc).

Thanks for the explanation and setting me straight. That explains the differences in style! In that case I'm even more convinced that IWM should acquire some of those sculpts. As much as I love the classic designs (and I really do), the updated Mechwarrior online designs have a look that newer gamers would probably find more to their taste.

Of course an emphasis on the "Dark Age" designs would probably have roughly the same result as they also have an updated asthetic. I think IWM is slowly releasing more and more of the newer designs as they appear in TRO's.

**Eilif**

KaryudoDS wrote:
Hopefully someone posts their thoughts on Alpha Strike. I was excited about the idea of a Battletech that went faster. Though I was hoping it they would have went a bit closer to Warmachine. Seems like the perfect game for that.

If you'd like a set of rules for sci-fi that accommodates mechs well and is similar to warmachine, you should check out Gruntz
http://www.gruntz.biz/
According to one review "The mechanic is 2d6 based and works the same way as Warmachine, roll 2d6+your models stat and compare the result with the opposing defensive stat Equal or higher gets you the hit/does some damage." Technically aimed at 15mm, but could be adapted to other scales.
Interesting note about Grunt and BT from the Gruntz author here:
http://gruntz15.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=disc&action=display&thread=485

The review of AS I linked to before is pretty thorough, but I also would like to see more.
http://www.playunplugged.com/2013/07/review-battletech-alpha-strike-pdf-version/
I'm eager to see some pictorial AAR's!

**Eilif**

judgedoug wrote:

Spoiler:

Alpha Strike retains most of the flavor of the Classic Battletech rules that Mechwarrior Clix lost. For example, comparing Alpha Strike to Battletech:

Mechs still have armor and internal structure points, but it's only one set for each armor and structure. Once armor is breached, damage is done to the structure.

When the structure takes damage, you can roll for criticals on a chart (which involve engine damage, ammo explosion, etc)

Mechs have a damage value at S, M, and L range. If they hit (based on their one skill value, 2d6 versus a to-hit#), they cause the damage to their target. The to-hit number starts at their skill value, plus 2 for medium, plus 4 for long, plus this and that for moving, etc. So a long range shot from a moving target to a moving target with cover is nigh impossible, but two assault mechs blasting each other at short range barely moving will be smashing each other to bits.

Some mechs have an overheat value (of 1, 2, or 3); this allows them to overheat their mech and icnrease their damage output by their overheat value, but it makes their mech hot - you mark their heat value on their card, and next turn they have another modifier to hit based on their overheat value. They spend a turn not shooting to cool off. If heat goes to more than 3, mech shuts down for a turn.

Some mechs have special stats, such that they might haveLRM's, so a portion of their damage at range can be shot at an enemy that is in LOS to a friendly but not to them. Or Autocannons, so a portion of their damage can be special autocannon munitions, etc. Some have CASE so an ammo explosioin critical won't auto destroy the mech, and so on.

Movement is all in inches and facings are based off the hex sides on the 'mech; you get bonuses for shooting a mech in the back.

I've got all my clix reabsed to 45mm hexes, so this makes me very happy.

Thanks for those rules explainations. Very helpfull.

**Eilif**

Jbuckmaster wrote:
Here's my initial review of Alpha Strike. Think I need to play it again to be sure, but it felt kinda bland to me.

http://minimodelgeek.blogspot.ca/2013/08/battletech-alpha-strike-review.html

Great Review!
I hope I end up enjoying it more than you did, but it's great to see honest reviews from people with real experience with this genre of game.

**Eilif**

Judgedoug and Jbuckmaster. I was curious to know how much terrain you used in your battles.

Even with small scale battles (we play Mech Attack and Panzer8 sci-fi in 10mm) we use alot of terrain, to the point where sometimes our boards can be a bit crowded. I've found that it really benefits both games.

With Mech Attack, which is a mech game that has alot of BT like elements in a very streamlined package (Jbuckmaster you might like it) I find that it can help cut down on the spirograph effect. With Panzer 8 sci-fi, a super-simple beer and pretzels game of massed combat, it really makes maneuvering a prime focus of the game rather than just shooting away at your opponent.

**Eilif**

A campaign! I didn't even think about the fact that you could use some of the rules(not just the fluff) from CBT supplements for campaigning in Alpha Strike. What a great idea.

That's the kind of thing I'd love to get my group to do. I've got all the Mercenary handbooks and several dozen other sourcebooks so the material is there if I can wrangle up the interest.

**Eilif**

warboss wrote:
The book that changes the rules from CBT doesn't have the cards for the changed models? I understand there are some cludgey work arounds posted last page but this seems to be a big oversight.

Remember also that printable cards for most mechs are already free online in the Master Unit List.

**Eilif**

Just bought it. I was delaying the purchase to get the hardback, but a friend offered to print and bind it for me so I picked up the PDF.

Really looking forward to playing this with my club. We've got a bunch of rebased mechwarrior pieces that we use for 10mm gaming, so it should be a cinch to plug them into this ruleset. I'm sure they will also appreciate that most of their mechs and vehicles are already represented by BF cards!

**Eilif**

judgedoug wrote:
Eilif wrote:
Just bought it. I was delaying the purchase to get the hardback, but a friend offered to print and bind it for me so I picked up the PDF.

Really looking forward to playing this with my club. We've got a bunch of rebased mechwarrior pieces that we use for 10mm gaming, so it should be a cinch to plug them into this ruleset. I'm sure they will also appreciate that most of their mechs and vehicles are already represented by BF cards!

Take pics and post battle reports!

You can count on it.

Most every game we play goes up on our blog (link in my sig), even if it's just a couple pics and brief overview. I won't be playing for a month or so as we're still in the midst of our summer Song of Blades and Heroes campaign, but I do plan on at least one battle report. My friend will be bringing me the printup of the rules this week, so I hope to have a pre-play review of the rules up sooner than that.

**Eilif**

Thanks for that!
I've really been curious to hear from folks who have tried the game regarding complexity and playing time.

**Eilif**

frozenwastes wrote:
Let's be honest about the points system:

It's just the Battletech BV2.0 points system divided by 100 and rounded appropriately. So that means you have the stuff statted out for one game, but the points system is based on how it performs in another game.

It's probably thought of as a good guide that will work most of the time, but it's very, very breakable. Just like in classic Battletech, plus now you're using it for a different game.

I would not recommend a 40k or Warmachine/Hordes approach to force building for either Battletech or Alpha Strike. If people go into it with the idea of making a broken force, they'll probably succeed. You have 4500+ units to choose from, then narrow them down to your era/technology base and then hunt for optimized choices.

You can break it if you want, but if you use it as a general guide, it should work. I built two 50 point demo lances and have played both and won and lost with both yesterday night. I gave each one a light, 2 mediums and a heavy and put a veteran pilot in the heavy. The end result was a very even matchup.

Now imagine I took that same 50 points and bought 20 2 point vehicles with indirect fire and 10 1 point fast spotting vehicles.

Good points. Battletech has always been a system that is easy to break. It's a system that really needs scenarios to be engaging for the long haul.

Put simply, Battetech or Alpha Strike are not good systems for those who can't get out of the 40k/WM headspace of crafting an army soley based on the abilities of the units and their cost-effectiveness points-wise. You have to have the willingness to talk to your opponent, decide on a scenario, work together to figure out what kind of forces would logically exist in such a battle and then play it out. Forces are usually based on fluff and what a given faction would have access to. Luckily BT has an encyclopedic amount of fluff detailing what units had access to what kinds of hardware. There's also dozens of scenario books with scenarios detailing "historical" battles and the units that were involved.

Basically it's best to let the fluff and scenario determine the units and then rely on generalship (rather than list building) to win the day. It also helps if you're willing to fight battles that are imbalanced knowing that sometimes you will loose. There's alot of those kind of battles in BT history.

40k/WM competetive style players can still engage in deathmatch or arena style games with tricked out mechs, but that's not really the focus of BT and AS.

**Eilif**

frozenwastes wrote:I think the points system works fine if you stick to the small selection of mechs in the Alpha Strike books. And as they publish more era specific supplements, they too will probably have small selections that if you stick to, everything will be balanced.

The problem is that such an approach sucks if you want to field anything else or play in another era. And it's contradictory to their provision of 4500+ stat blocks for free on the Master Unit List.

There are already many sourcebooks detailing the units avaialble in other eras. TRO's, Scenario Packs, Sourcbooks, etc. They're not going to be perfect for Alpha Strike, but stick with the base versions of the mechs from the respective eras and you should be fine.

Ronin_eX wrote:Well, yeah, sticking to a given era probably works out pretty well no matter what. Maybe even using the Random Assignment Tables as a guide or "army list" of sorts.

But honestly, Battletech has always been more of a scenario-based game ala Rogue Trader and Stargrunt II to use another couple of 80's contemporaries. Point systems were seen as either optional or unneeded back then. And while BV was an improvement over tonnage and BV2 is an improvement of BV; you can still likely achieve the best balance by organizing a scenario based on historical TO&E's or by getting a GM/Ref to come up with something.

Agreed. It just takes a bit more of a collaborative mindset. Even if the force lists in BT scenarios or sourcebooks arent' perfect for AS, they at least provide a neutral third party reference for what to use.

I think it just requires getting out the "perfectly fair and balanced" mindset (something that doesn't really exist in 40k anyway) and accepting that war is unbalanced, certain scenarios are going to have a slant, and it's the job of the general to make the most out what they have in a given situation. Raids against a superior foe, fighting retreats, holdouts against all odd's, assaults on heavily defended positions, etc. These can be the stuff of really exciting and engaging games. Historical players already get this, and if more sci-fi players to too, then that can only be a good thing.