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Posted a list yesterday and made a number of revisions. Trying to build a list strong enough to hold my own in an upcoming tournament against some competitive lists.

List A)

Typhus - 230

8x Plague Marines/Champion, 2x Meltagun, Meltabombs - 217

8x Plague Marines/Champion, 2x Meltagun, Rhino - 247

8x Plague Marines/Champion, 2x Plasmagun, Rhino, HL - 269

8x Plague Marines/Champion, 2x Flamers, Rhino, HL - 249

Heldrake, Baleflamer - 170

Land raider- 230

3x Obliterators, MoN -210


List B)

Typhus - 230

8x Plague Marine/Champ, 2x Melta, Rhino

8x Plague Marine/Champ, 2x Plasma, Rhino

35x Plague Zombies - 150

30x Plague Zombies - 130

Heldrake, Baleflamer - 170

Havocs, 4x AC - 115

3x Obliterators, MoN - 228

3x Obliterators, MoN - 228

ADL, Quad gun - 100


List C)

Abaddon - 265

4x Chaos Terminators/Champion, 4 combi weapons, 1 PF, 1 Chainfist, Land raider - 405

10x CSM/Champ, 2x Meltagun, Rhino - 195

10x CSM/Champ, Plasmagun, Lascannon - 175

10x CSM/Champ, Plasmagun, Lascannon - 175

10x CSM/Champ, 2x Flamers - 150

Heldrake, Baleflamer - 170

Havocs, 4x AC - 115

3x Obliterators - 210

I'm thinking list A is probably the strongest of the three but I would like to play CSM without going Nurgle if I could.

I like them all. All lists are well balanced and I think they will all do fine. Only thing I would change is in list 2 drop adl and somthing else to pick up a heldrake.

I like the list and they all are very durable armies, I think list 3 will put out more damage. Although for tournament play objectives are the name of the game, so nurgle normally is the your best bet.

I think combing list 1 and 2 will be a strong tourament build with only 1 zombie unit and some plagues to replace the other zombie unit. I feel the more oblitz and havocs will do more damage than that raider. Also another helldrake replacing the adl would be nice.

launcher348 wrote:I like them all. All lists are well balanced and I think they will all do fine. Only thing I would change is in list 2 drop adl and somthing else to pick up a heldrake.

CannedKhorne wrote:I like the list and they all are very durable armies, I think list 3 will put out more damage. Although for tournament play objectives are the name of the game, so nurgle normally is the your best bet.

I think combing list 1 and 2 will be a strong tourament build with only 1 zombie unit and some plagues to replace the other zombie unit. I feel the more oblitz and havocs will do more damage than that raider. Also another helldrake replacing the adl would be nice.

I'll mess with my lists and try out the suggestions you guys gave. The only thing that is somewhat a problem is a second heldrake. I have nothing else to proxy in as a heldrake so I'd have to dump $60 which, unfortunately, I do not have :(

Drakes are only $60? I paid $76 for mine.

I would changeout 1-2 csm for chosen on list 3.

Turn the 10 man csm with plasmagun+lascannon to just 5 chosen with 2-3 flamers+lascannon and have them sit in the back.

 Turock wrote:
Posted a list yesterday and made a number of revisions. Trying to build a list strong enough to hold my own in an upcoming tournament against some competitive lists.

List A)

Typhus - 230

8x Plague Marines/Champion, 2x Meltagun, Meltabombs - 217

8x Plague Marines/Champion, 2x Meltagun, Rhino - 247

8x Plague Marines/Champion, 2x Plasmagun, Rhino, HL - 269

8x Plague Marines/Champion, 2x Flamers, Rhino, HL - 249

Heldrake, Baleflamer - 170

Land raider- 230

3x Obliterators, MoN -210


List B)

Typhus - 230

8x Plague Marine/Champ, 2x Melta, Rhino

8x Plague Marine/Champ, 2x Plasma, Rhino

35x Plague Zombies - 150

30x Plague Zombies - 130

Heldrake, Baleflamer - 170

Havocs, 4x AC - 115

3x Obliterators, MoN - 228

3x Obliterators, MoN - 228

ADL, Quad gun - 100

First, the fluffy question: Why 8 plague marines and not 7 (that's Nurgle's "sacred" number) -- if you think 8 vs. 7 gives you a notable advantage somewhere, go with 8, but if not, I'd go w/ 7 and use the extra points somewhere else (in list 2 maybe getting up to 35 (multiple of 7) zombies in the 2nd unit) ... and I'd give you some serious style points for that!

Other than that, I really can't advise as I don't have the CSM 'dex other than the idea that I like Abaddon + your load of termies in the 3rd list and maybe consider a MoK or MoS for your flamer CSM squad (as they seem to be the ones most likely to get into CC) (advice based on scanning through the 'dex + using army builder, so truck load of salt should be taken with it )

My thoughts if you want to make a competitive list are:

Stay away from the special characters, they are too expensive and eat into your points.

Stay away from anything that can easily give up first blood unless you plan to reserve them, yes, first blood is that important.

Stay away from multiple units of plague marines, they are too expensive for their potential output.

I'd stay away completely from Troops in the CSM dex, look to take a couple of small cultists squads just because you have to, reserve them and hide them on a backfield objective.
Look to either Orks or Daemons for decent options for troops (Shoota Boys, Plague Bearers).

More Helldrakes if possible, a DP with a blackmace is crazy good, mark of Zeentch helps with survival.

Nothing wrong with Oblits, but is the MoN really needed?
Considering there's not a great deal of Str8 out there at the moment. There's actually more Str 10 with Smash attacks in every army pretty much.

Also look at MoN Spawn with either a Telepathy Sorcerer, Lord with whatever weapon choices on bikes, or even both.

Fast attack is what the CSM dex is all about, use those slots.
Drake
Spawn
Bikes.
Maulerfiend

Elites:
Terminators if anything, full squads or suicide melta/plasma teams.

Heavy:
Oblits

HQ's
Sorcerers and Lords on Bikes or in TA. MoN is optional but T6 is pretty sweet.

Dear LordFiend,
I respectfully disagree regarding named characters. Whilst some do stand out as big drains on the available point there are a couple which stand head and shoulders above the others, namely Typhus for being a combat monster, plague marine troop enabler and zombie tarpit creator; and Huron for being awesome.

As soon as you take a few units of cultists to hide in the back ground you're going to start loosing as you have to table the opponent rather than playing to the mission. If you play to the mission a single point for first blood is not too important.

You're right about fast attack being where it is at.

Back to the lists:

A) I think needs to be shootier by swapping out a plague marine unit and getting an ADL and a decent shooty unit behind it.

B) Needs to be better in the assault. Switch in the Landraider and lose some obliterators.

Filch wrote:Drakes are only $60? I paid $76 for mine.

I would changeout 1-2 csm for chosen on list 3.

Turn the 10 man csm with plasmagun+lascannon to just 5 chosen with 2-3 flamers+lascannon and have them sit in the back.

I actually think this is a solid idea and I'm going to give it a go. I wish Chosenwing was a competitive list :(

L0rdF1end wrote:My thoughts if you want to make a competitive list are:

Stay away from the special characters, they are too expensive and eat into your points.

Stay away from anything that can easily give up first blood unless you plan to reserve them, yes, first blood is that important.

Stay away from multiple units of plague marines, they are too expensive for their potential output.

I'd stay away completely from Troops in the CSM dex, look to take a couple of small cultists squads just because you have to, reserve them and hide them on a backfield objective.
Look to either Orks or Daemons for decent options for troops (Shoota Boys, Plague Bearers).

More Helldrakes if possible, a DP with a blackmace is crazy good, mark of Zeentch helps with survival.

Nothing wrong with Oblits, but is the MoN really needed?
Considering there's not a great deal of Str8 out there at the moment. There's actually more Str 10 with Smash attacks in every army pretty much.

Also look at MoN Spawn with either a Telepathy Sorcerer, Lord with whatever weapon choices on bikes, or even both.

Fast attack is what the CSM dex is all about, use those slots.
Drake
Spawn
Bikes.
Maulerfiend

Elites:
Terminators if anything, full squads or suicide melta/plasma teams.

Heavy:
Oblits

HQ's
Sorcerers and Lords on Bikes or in TA. MoN is optional but T6 is pretty sweet.

Well your advice is helpful but most of the suggestions you brought up are not going to be possible (bikes/orks/daemons).

I agree with the maulerfiends, bikes and drakes, however spawn I have only run once and was not impressed.

I personal think we have a pretty decent selection of troops depending on the list you are running. Holding backfield with my cultists will not likely work in my meta (lots of pod spam, deepstrike, and some artillery), which is why I don't run them often.

The only time I have ever run a daemon prince he got murdered turn 1. Definitely left a bad taste in my mouth.

Jasper wrote:Dear LordFiend,
I respectfully disagree regarding named characters. Whilst some do stand out as big drains on the available point there are a couple which stand head and shoulders above the others, namely Typhus for being a combat monster, plague marine troop enabler and zombie tarpit creator; and Huron for being awesome.

As soon as you take a few units of cultists to hide in the back ground you're going to start loosing as you have to table the opponent rather than playing to the mission. If you play to the mission a single point for first blood is not too important.

You're right about fast attack being where it is at.

Back to the lists:

A) I think needs to be shootier by swapping out a plague marine unit and getting an ADL and a decent shooty unit behind it.

B) Needs to be better in the assault. Switch in the Landraider and lose some obliterators.

I redid list A with your advice. Swapped one Melta PM squad for Havocs + AC and an ADL Quad gun. I think this might be solid.

List B is almost identical to list A now with the changes. Only difference is one less PM squad and 60 zombies on the table. With Typhus riding in the LR is this a smart idea to have 2 30x Plague Zombie tarpits?