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Hi dakka,

Have noticed a few threads re: the deffrolla issue.
Is there any clear outline in 6th ed to how to deploy vehicles with decorative bits.
Does a bw with deffrolla still.need to be fully behind ure dz line. Or seeing as everythig is.measured from the hull, can it poke over?
Or do we lose a few inches of movement simpy for having a deffrolla?

Cheers

If you're ignoring the deffrolla for measurement to the vehicle, then you ignore it for all measurement purposes.

So yes, the rolla itself can stick out over the deployment line... but you have to then be consistent with it, and so the rolla would have no effect on enemy models until the vehicle's hull reaches them.

I know that you certainly cannot be fired at if only the deff rolla is visible, because weapons and such are not viable targets. Beyond that, no idea.

Sweet az. Cheers Mate,
So no tank shocking until the hull meets the enemy? So treating the deff rolla completely as a decorative piece.

Yes, of course.


Personally, I prefer to go the other way, and just count the front of the rolla as the front of the vehicle. It's easier, since the rolla is so bulky.

 Dakkamite wrote:
I know that you certainly cannot be fired at if only the deff rolla is visible, because weapons and such are not viable targets. Beyond that, no idea.

The deff rolla isn't a weapon though its a piece of gear like a dozer blade.

 insaniak wrote:
Yes, of course.


Personally, I prefer to go the other way, and just count the front of the rolla as the front of the vehicle. It's easier, since the rolla is so bulky.

This is how I've been playing it for years. I get no complaints, when people ask if they can charge it, shoot at it and I say yes, but I can also disembark from it they're fine with it.

Ugh the deff rolla, the one thing I hate playing with these is how it works for measuring. I used to run it like insaniak and it works fine until I go to measure my shooting all of a sudden the deathrolla isn't a part of the "hull".

I always ask my opponent how they want to play it and make sure they understand the implications of playing it whichever way, armour facings, shooting ranges, disembarking etc.

Personally I play it as purely decorative.
I've built the model so the Rolla will swing up out the way for measuring.

 Madcat87 wrote:
Ugh the deff rolla, the one thing I hate playing with these is how it works for measuring. I used to run it like insaniak and it works fine until I go to measure my shooting all of a sudden the deathrolla isn't a part of the "hull"..

Vehicles measure range from their weapons, not from the hull...

 insaniak wrote:

 Madcat87 wrote:
Ugh the deff rolla, the one thing I hate playing with these is how it works for measuring. I used to run it like insaniak and it works fine until I go to measure my shooting all of a sudden the deathrolla isn't a part of the "hull"..

Vehicles measure range from their weapons, not from the hull...

Unless he meant passenger shooting (open-topped).

 insaniak wrote:

 Madcat87 wrote:
Ugh the deff rolla, the one thing I hate playing with these is how it works for measuring. I used to run it like insaniak and it works fine until I go to measure my shooting all of a sudden the deathrolla isn't a part of the "hull"..

Vehicles measure range from their weapons, not from the hull...

I think he's talking about when shooting AT the battlewagon, like the deffrolla is just within 12" of the guy with the melta gun, but suddenly, no, it doesn't count.

I agree with most everyone here, if you don't count the def rolla for movement, you shouldn't be able to count it when it touches your opponent. I personally count it. Dakkamite is correct to say it can't be targeted.

As for losing the 2", you actually don't lose it, because you are still moving the 12". You just have to remember that the LOS is shifted. For attacking purposes, you want whatever that defrolla comes in contact with, the unit takes d6 str 10 attacks (in the movement phase), it's awesome when you can hit 6 or 7 units in one go. When they are rolling their save, just think to yourself "Instant Death don't fail me now.

If I'm shooting out of a Battlewagon with a def rolla, then I shouldn't have taken the def rolla - If theirs a Def Rolla on the front of my Battlewagon, I'm running it as fast and as far as I can, which means no shooting from it in the shooting phase. Because if I come in contact with a unit, they will take more damage from the def rolla than anything I can shoot out of it. Which is why I never take Big Shootas - they slow me down too much, would rather use the 5 points per elsewhere.

I find it much easier to just treat it as part of the hull. Of course, I also have a scratch-built Deffrolla that's a bit bigger than the official kit. I personally think treating it as part of the hull is a bit of a disadvantage (as it makes my AV14 arc even smaller).

 Sleg wrote:
Dakkamite is correct to say it can't be targeted.

Only if you are ignoring it for the purposes of disembarking and shooting.

If you are counting it for range from your passengers and deployment, then it can be targeted as it is not a purely decorative element of the vehicle like an antennae would be. (Only decorative elements are ignored and the defrolla is not a decoration).

 grendel083 wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

 Madcat87 wrote:
Ugh the deff rolla, the one thing I hate playing with these is how it works for measuring. I used to run it like insaniak and it works fine until I go to measure my shooting all of a sudden the deathrolla isn't a part of the "hull"..

Vehicles measure range from their weapons, not from the hull...

Unless he meant passenger shooting (open-topped).

Yes I meant passangers, watch the look on your opponents face when you try to shoot your burna boys out of a battlewagon by placing the template so it is touching the deffrolla but turn around and say they are with 6 inches of the deffrolla therefore melta range. Hence why I make sure my opponent knows the implications of the deffrolla being or not being a part of the hull.

Do people actually measure their shots or Disembark from the defrolla? Because then it would make your Battlewagon 2" longer and that's more difficult to hide.

I only use it for movement purposes and that's only because I do the what ever it touches is hit by it. For the most part you don't actually need the def rolla on your battlewagon - in my opinion it helps.

If you use it for move a t you should use it for shooting and disembark purposes as well.

An interesting effect of using the deffrolla as hull is that it increases the length of the battlewagon - thereby reducing the front arc of the AV14. This is an important detail because the AV14 front is an important part of its durability, and the vehicle's length already makes the front arc somewhat smaller than you might want even without the deffrolla.

I don't play orks, but a regular opponent of mine does. After discovering this fact (a long time ago) we decided to model the deffrolla in an upright position and count it as decorative.

I believe, You can always agree that it's only for movement range and attack. If they don't agree, then it would be just decoration - you would never want to take it as part of the hull.

 Sleg wrote:
I believe, You can always agree that it's only for movement range and attack. If they don't agree, then it would be just decoration - you would never want to take it as part of the hull.

If it's for movement range and attack, than it's part of the hull.

If it's decorative than wouldn't you just ignore it?

Exactly. It works fine as long as you're consistent. Either you treat it as hull for ALL purposes and measurements, or you ignore it for ALL purposes and measurements. As long as you're clear how it will work before the game begins, there are no issues.