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So im goign to be playing a doubles game against necron and IG, My partner will be a Tau list. Right now he is looking at running a farsight bomb along with some AA units. I know the necron and IG guy will have a handful of tanks and only a couple fliers. While the Tau guy is off killing that stuff ill be bringing this list to deal with the masses of guys. Looking for thoughts on anything to change make better or anything of the sort.


* Farseer (120pts)
Singing spear
* Eldar Jetbike


* Spiritseer (70pts)

* Dire Avengers (265pts)
10x Dire Avenger
* Wave Serpent
Holo-fields, Serpent Field, Twin-linked scatter lasers, Twin-linked shuriken catapults


* Guardian Defenders (110pts)
10x Guardian- Starcannon


* Windrider Jetbike Squadron (122pts)
6x Guardian Jetbike, 2x Shuriken Cannons, Twin-Linked Shuriken Catapult

* Wave Serpent (135pts)
Holo-fields, Serpent Field, Twin-linked scatter lasers, Twin-linked shuriken catapults
* 5x Wraithguard (210pts) 5x D-scythe

* Warp Spiders (205pts)
10x Warp Spider, Exarch- Twin-Linked Death Spinner

2x Nightspinner (130pts)
Doomweaver, Holo-fields (15pts) (*), Twin-linked shuriken catapults

I would recommend taking out the spirit seer, being troop really doesnt matter to much, the wraith guard arnt going to be sitting on an objective with d scythes, and if they are your wasting them. Then with the extra points, take a warlock with the gaurdians, and shuikrn cannons on your wave serpents.

I think putting a third of your points into two models at these points is too much as well.

Maybe drop one wraithknight for 3 war walkers, each with 2 bright lances?

 rohansoldier wrote:
I think putting a third of your points into two models at these points is too much as well.

Maybe drop one wraithknight for 3 war walkers, each with 2 bright lances?

Wrong list pall. He's not taking any wraithknights.

ninjafiredragon wrote:
I would recommend taking out the spirit seer, being troop really doesnt matter to much, the wraith guard arnt going to be sitting on an objective with d scythes, and if they are your wasting them. Then with the extra points, take a warlock with the gaurdians, and shuikrn cannons on your wave serpents.

I disagree. The Spiritseer allows you to place Runes of Battle where it is needed most over a Warlock. A Warlock is really only an option now if placed in a squad where you want the Primaris, because the rest are too situational. Taking a Spiritseer to place into one of three units (DAs, Guardians or WGuard) based on his rolls in Runes of Battle...I do often and find it to be a good 'wild card' item that the enemy can't plan for.

I don't see so many dire avengers as being needed, I know you want to kill infantry and all but they're are more effective ways to do it then putting a fragile scoring choice in the firing line. So I would try the time tested 5 in a WS, or 7/8 for the choice to torrent small units. WS exarch should probably have spinneret rifle for AP 1 on demand as twin linking really isn't doing many favours where 3 ap 1 strength 6/7 shots will grant a lot of choice of which things you can hurt ( A lot! AP 1 really hurts vehicles).

Finding points for a Conceal Jetlock to run with jetbikes would be very worthwhile, as necrons and IG lack ways to strip cover save mortars no ne takes but im not sure where you could shave the 50pts.

so if i bring the DA down to 5 guys, give the Spider Exarch a Spinneret Rifle and then get in a Warlock with jetbike and Spear. Giving the jetbikes some extra firepower and some more spells. Seems like a decent list then to me. Still getting used to everytihng. Never used spiders before but have seen them hit or miss when it comes to being useful.

Why DAs in a Serpent and guardians on foot?!?!?!?!??! Why?

Spiders are looking better and better in the new codex, being now super, SUPER mobile. 6'' move followed by 2d6 move followed by re-rollable d6 move, shoot, then a further 2d6 movement. That's a lot of movement! Just don't deep strike them, as they are a lot of points that you want on the field, and be sure to fortune/guide them if possible if you think they will be shot over much. Don't let the 3+ save fool you, they are still fragile. Be sure to use battle focus and assault 2d6 movement to bring you out of line of sight if at all possible. You may even want to drop to 7/8 if you need the points. Put they force saves like there is no tomorrow and are a terror for low side/rear AV vehicles because they can easily get to there weak spots. Over all with hawks, spears and vypers better then ever warp spiders still hold there spot as very mobile high strength fire power, but taking them over the other fast attack is largely preference.

@ FlingitNow, I guess because they will be taking home objective hopefully in area terrain, meaning they have no need for a serpent. Anyway, guardians make terrible aggressive objective holders, but I guess that's they only time they will get to use those pea shooter guns

I guess because they will be taking home objective hopefully in area terrain, meaning they have no need for a serpent. Anyway, guardians make terrible aggressive objective holders, but I guess that's they only time they will get to use those pea shooter guns

So the Old I don't want them to do a job they are good at I'd rather them do a job they suck at whilst an inferior unit does their job. Great idea. Let's put the guys with a 4+ save and the range to be in range turn 1 into a transport where you get almost none of the benefits you are paying through the nose for, whilst the guys with a 12" range and a 5+ save can sit back never shooting and dying really easily. Great idea.

Dire avengers, when bought in units of 5, aren't really bought as a unit. They are bought as a kind of 'Scoring' upgrade for the wave serpent because they should really never be outside the serpent unless they are scoring an objective, preferably somewhere they can go to ground.

While the guardians, when in area terrain, have a nice 4+ cover save and they can also go to ground for a 2+ (Is it still a 2+ when going to ground in area terrain?). With ten bodies, I find that really quite survivable and a good home turf objective. . If he is feeling they are his lose cannon, he could always find a way to put a conceal lock in there, but I don't find that necessary with 10 bodies that can go to ground.

Also its a good thing if they never have to fire, it means that the rest of your army is doing its job of keeping the enemy on the run. The fact they actually have those pea shooters of a gun it to be melee deterrents, which I find them to be remarkably good at for there price. 18 pseudo rending shots plus starcannon, then add overwatch makes for a very reduced melee squad.

Yes you'd be right if he bought 5 DAs not the 10 in his list. For me as you have to get out to score now you're always better off with guardians, but 5 man DAs in a Serpent do make some sense. 10 man is just silly.

Area terrain is 5+ cover. So he can gtg for a 3+ if he has suitable area terrain in his deployment zone. Which you can guarantee and even then you have 90 points doing literally nothing and an anchor your opponent can aim at. 60 point rangers would get 2+ cover and have weapons that can contribute from backfield. Not that they are a good option.

You keep calling the gun a pea shooter it is one of the best side arms in the game. S4 AP5 matches a boltgun and rending means it'll do more damage to MEQ than a Pulserifle. Its weakness is range, chuck a Starcannon on the squad jump out a Wave Serpent and obliterate something.

So goign with the same thing as befor but now the 5man DA squad making more sense in the WS but knowing how these 2 guys play. with sitting their gun lines behind ADL i wont want to toss to much behind them as they will just focus fire them down while getting pelted from boths so a small DA squad i think would be a nice distraction for these 2. the warlock obvious trade off there. and the spinnert rifle is self explanitory.

* Farseer (120pts)
Singing spear
* Eldar Jetbike


* Spiritseer (70pts)

* Warlock-jetbike, spear 55pts

* Dire Avengers (200pts)
5x Dire Avenger
* Wave Serpent
Holo-fields, Serpent Field, Twin-linked scatter lasers, Twin-linked shuriken catapults


* Guardian Defenders (110pts)
10x Guardian- Starcannon


* Windrider Jetbike Squadron (122pts)
6x Guardian Jetbike, 2x Shuriken Cannons, Twin-Linked Shuriken Catapult

* Wave Serpent (135pts)
Holo-fields, Serpent Field, Twin-linked scatter lasers, Twin-linked shuriken catapults
* 5x Wraithguard (210pts) 5x D-scythe

* Warp Spiders (215pts)
10x Warp Spider, Exarch- spinnert rifle

2x Nightspinner (130pts)
Doomweaver, Holo-fields (15pts) (*), Twin-linked shuriken catapults

You need more Wave Serpents. 2 isn't enough you need 3 minimum. Get one for the Guardians. Particularly if your opponents like shutting behind ADLs as your shield ignores cover! Plays that guardian squad can put out serious hurt at short range, get them behind that ADL and watch s marine squad disappear.

where would you suggest cutting the points?

The Warlock and Jetbikes would be my choice. A night spinner is another. Also at the moment you have zero ability to deal with AV14.

Im thinking about just taking out 1 night spinner as then a WS with holofield and scatter laser will go in its place with the guardians. As for the AV 14 shouldn't be an issue as my partner has enough melta and what not with his list to take care of it. Ive got the Anti infantry for the most part and he has tank/flier duty.