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Hey guys, so I've decided to go against being creative but I've got an issue that I'd like help solving; so here's my list:

HQ
Flyrant++++285 pts
-Hive commander, Dual BL-devs, Biomancy
Flyrant++++260 pts
-Dual BL-devs, Biomancy
-Warlord
Elite
Doom of Malan'Tai++++130 pts
-Spod
2 Zoanthrope++++160 pts
-Spod
2 Zoanthrope++++160 pts
-Spod
Troops
10 Termagants++++50 pts
10 Termagants++++50 pts
Tervigon++++210 pts
-3 psychic powers, AG + TS, Cluster spines
Tervigon++++210 pts
-3 psychic powers, AG + TS, Cluster spines
Fast attack
10 Gargoyles++++60 pts
Heavy support
2 Biovores++++90 pts
2 Biovores++++90 pts
2 Biovores++++90 pts

Total: 1845

Here's the problem: The gargoyle unit is too small for my liking. The only spots that I'd like to shave from are either a Biovore unit or remove a Spod from a Zoanthrope unit. I would rather not do either of these because my list has it's advantages:


Although it's disadvantages:


Now, in the past I've used 2 units of 14 Devilgants in Spods and they worked great and essentially I'm replacing them with Biovores + another unit of Zoanthropes. Does anyone have suggestions on how I could improve the list? How can I combat the rise of the Eldar (which I am sure to face in a tournament)? I know 6 biovores may be overkill, but I'm also expecting lots of ADL so I want to negate it as much as possible.

I'm always open to suggestions.

Dump two biovores for more gargoyles. 4 should be enough against the vast majority of armies. And you can hide them if necessary. Make sure you give the gargs Ag and TS as well. It is cheap and actually makes them able to kill stuff in combat.

I personally would consider just running catalyst on the tervgions (so not getting onslaught), and not swapping out to rulebook powers, as for me I prefer having the guaranteed FNP, rather than possibly getting 1 okay, and a couple of rubbish powers. (oh and it saves some points too)

Other than that seems fairly solid.

I think if you have the points take ALL 3 powers for Tervigons and trade them in for biomancy - three rolls gives you a good chance to get something really good for them which is too important to pass up - Iron Arm - gives Eternal Warrior, Endurance - FNP and it will not die, Warp Speed - to help those slow ass Tervigons, enfeeble - pure awesome sauce- bring a wraithknight down to T 6 with 2 of these and shoot the crap out of it. Wraith stuff would not scare me with nids as they have so much poison that they don't care about facing monstrous creatures. The only thing sucky is when facing a wraithknight with Double D's. I have not been on the receiving end of that, however I have instant killed 2 tervigons this way myself and a wraithknight with full wounds.. It is brutal.... I am not a huge biovore fan myself, but I agree that 4 should do you. I personally like hive guard for ignoring cover and jink things - this wrecks skimmers and nob bikers! Yeah the zoanthropes look nice on paper and I always keep their old powers, but now you have to pass a psychic test with no save if you peril and they can deny the witch on you too, giving the other player a better buff. The S10 lance is awesome, but honestly they have not performed well for me in 6th edition. It is satisfying to kill a soulgrinder or landraider with them though...

Dropping one unit of biovores nets me either 25 naked gargoyles or 19 buffed up ones.

So go with 19? In the past, in competitive games, they've done absolutely nothing for me, a that's why in hesitant On Including them...

In regards to the psychic powers, 3 powers is a must for at least 1 Tervigon. I could probably get away with dropping 1 Tervigon down to just Catalyst and possibly remove AG + TS to save points. Then, however, I'm forced to play one aggressively and one defensively based just on their powers rather than rolling....by giving both 3 powers I have versatility on my aide and can play them both as needed rather than predetermining a roll for them.

Wait so Wraithknights can instant death stuff? Lame-o.

The dual spod zoans are also for versatility. Most people assume that prodded Zoans are suicide units, when in fact they can be used wherever I wan, for buffing, for shrieking, and for AV 14 sniping.

Any other thoughts?

IMO id drop a biovore unit and the gargoyles for a unit of 3 Carnifex

I would drop the zoanthropes and biovores. Tyranids cannot outshoot other armies so dont try it! Eldar (or a combination with eldar) are your biggest problem because the fast, got cheap rending shooting and wave serpents that "ignore" penetrating hits. Take my list for example:

HQ
Flyrant++++285 pts
-Hive commander, Dual BL-devs, Biomancy
Flyrant++++260 pts
-Dual BL-devs, Biomancy
-Warlord
Elite
Doom of Malan'Tai with pod++++130 pts
5 ymgarl genestealers ++++115 pts
5 ymgarl genestealers ++++115 pts
Troops
10 Termagants++++50 pts
10 Termagants++++50 pts
Tervigon++++210 pts
-3 psychic powers, AG + TS, Cluster spines
Tervigon++++210 pts
-3 psychic powers, AG + TS, Cluster spines
Heavy support
mawlock++++160 pts
mawlock++++160 pts

defence line with comm relay+++++70 pts


I always take the strategic warlord trait because 4 out of 6 results really helps the tyranid army. First roll biomancy for the flying hives. If the got Iron arm or not makes a huge difference for your strategy. After that you roll biomancy for the tervigons and that result decides which one you wanna outflank. Your deployment decides the outcome of the whole battle so think about it! I always deploy the defence line with comm relay waaaaaaay back in the deployment zone and simply drop a tough tervigon with the termagaunt units next to the comm relay. If your flying hives got iron arm you can also deploy them behind the tervigon and protect them from shooting and make sure the turn on iron arm next turn. Second turn you unleash hell and get in their face.

These days I really like the mawlock because their deepstrike template can hit wave serpents with a S6 ap2 hit on their rear armor. The can still use their coversave but if one mawlock pulls it of you can deepstrike the doom next to the passengers and suck the life out of them.

Dont forget! you need to win the mission even if it means that most of your army will be destroyed! Once I assaulted a unit of 30 guards with runepriest on a objective with 2x5 ymgarl genestealers. The guard unit got atsknf so I kept on fighting the unit until the end of the game and contested the objective with ease. With a big iron arm tervigon on my own objective the game was decided at turn 2.

hope this helps..!

Jpat1213 wrote:
IMO id drop a biovore unit and the gargoyles for a unit of 3 Carnifex

That doesn't equate very well. A base unit of 3 carnifex costs almost 500 points with no upgrades...

Ultimately, when building this competitive TAC list, I really want versatility. While that means it isn't the best matchup against all other comers, I am trying to set myself up for flexibility. That's why I have Zoans. Yeah, they have a lot of rolls to make their codex powers to work, but Zoans aren't just for their ACTUAL damage. They are great POTENTIAL units. They have LOTS of potential, and typically are high on priority lists, especially if they are the only unit that can destroy AV14 at range (in my list).

Idk, I gotta be honest about losing the biovores but I'd be willing to give it a try for buffed gargoyles....they have just been useless for me in the past...

Lose one Zoanthrope Pod and use those Zoanthrope to act as dedicate synapse unit for the Biovores. Depending on the powers you roll you can make those biovores a really durable unit or have a really hard nut to crack acting as a rear guard with them.

That's not a bad idea. So what should I do with those extra 40 points then? More gargoyles?

So, I notice that the gargoyles are 152 points...what do you guys think about including Shrikes with LW/BS into this list? They are 150 points, and the smart opponent will target them AFTER the Flyrants....

Then when I ram them into a tough unit and it disappears I'm happy ;-)

Any thoughts? It's a little different of an approach, but it could also throw people off...Yeah taking overwatch from bolters sucks, but endurance from a nearby psyker should help mitigate that...

Nope. Shrikes are poor. T4 means they are ID bait, and will die extremely rapidly. Not worth it. Gargs are far better, so definitely take them.

Shrikes are fine as long as you have a screen of gargs to take fire, provide cover and to soak up overwatch.

roxor08 wrote:
So, I notice that the gargoyles are 152 points...what do you guys think about including Shrikes with LW/BS into this list? They are 150 points, and the smart opponent will target them AFTER the Flyrants....

Then when I ram them into a tough unit and it disappears I'm happy ;-)

Any thoughts? It's a little different of an approach, but it could also throw people off...Yeah taking overwatch from bolters sucks, but endurance from a nearby psyker should help mitigate that...

I've used them, but they need they gun, and you just about have to DS them in to terrain, which can hurt. They are a nice glasscannon, just don't go after TH/SS with them. For this list though, I would think the 25 bare Gargoyle would be more nasty, possibly run as 13 and 12 to be fast moving screens.

Thing is though, with the Flyrants taking fire turn 1 and 2 shrikes should be relatively ignored.

I agree that gargoyles might be a good screen, but an opponent can ignore them, they aren't on a priority at length. The heavy weapons will be targeting the Flyrants/Tervigons, remember FMCs get the same cover save from intervening units as they do in area terrain. The heavy weapons are the same weapons that will ignore the shrikes (due to better targets) originally.

The weapons that will tear up the garoyles (bolters and the like) are less effective against the shrikes, when these 2 units become a priority. This means T2 or T3 at the latest, you are forcing your opponent to deal with the shrikes/gargoyles. Which are you more afraid of?

The Shrikes



The Gargolyes



So what do you think? Both have different uses, but they also have different targets...but then again looking at them I don't have a good answer either.