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Hey everyone, my last post got next to no response so I thought I would try better here. So far I have these:

Absylonia
Carnivean
Angelius
Ravagore (converted using all the spare parts from the heavy warbeast kit, has the ravagore head, arms and weapons so it is conversion legal)

That is 25pts, I am planning to buy either of these to bump to 35pts
4x Shredders
2x Forsaken

or

Forsaken
Seraph


What do you think?

I'd Take the first one for fury control with the forsaken

Ok I shall go with first list, one other thing however. I am making a purchase soon, but cant decide what to do, either:
1) Get my army up to 50pts with this list:
Absylonia
Shredder x4
Carnivean
Scythean
Ravagore
5 ogrun Warspears
Angelius

or

stay at 35pts and buy myself pThagrosh as a second caster for use when having seperate lists and to use for other times. My main issue at the 50pts is I heard absylonia isnt great at 50pts and it breaks her tier list by having warspears, but I heard pThagrosh is damn great and can keep one of my heavy warbeasts (like angelius) safe for an assassination run. What do you guys think?

Abby's problem is that her tier is very appealing but lacks any real ranged threats outside of a Ravagore. Its an excellent melee beater force, but it will come across some very difficult match ups, along with being completely shut down by Purification casters and denial feats which are very popular.

Don't be afraid to play her outside her tier and introduce more ranged elements to compliment her melee force such as Raptors, deathstalkers or Striders+UA. The Warspears+UA isn't a terrible idea either.

So whats the best bet to make competative 35pts absylonia? So far I have Absylonia, carnivean, ravagore and angelius. As I said I am debating either a seraph and forsaken for more ranged and more fury management, or 4 shredders wit 2x forsaken as everysone tells me shredders are a must have and forsaken are great. Or pThagrosh with the same options of either seraph and forsaken or shredders and forsaken. Cant quite tell whats the best idea. Wanting peoples opinion.... :(

Are you building this for an event? If so what kind, ie. SR, Journeyman, Tooth and claw, hardcore?

Do you have multiple lists or are you going for an all comers list? Abby has issues against Purification casters and if you stick to her theme force you'll have a lot less ranged threat so a Seraph to increase your melee threat range might be warranted.

Are you opposed to building a list outside of her tier to introduce more ranged elements that are available to our faction such as Striders+UA, Deathstalkers or Raptors?

Honestly havent even had my first game yet, but I want to have a competitive 35pts army that I can learn and grow up with. I have the money now and know I wont very soon. So its my time to get the stuff now before I finish. I personally am not a fan of units, I personally want a competative beast army that can work just as well against warmachine as hordes. I heard that hordes infantry pales in comparison to warmachine ones but hordes warbeasts are better than warmachine. But I am not strictly sticking to her tier list. I also believe seraph has ranged attack similar to ravagore. It was suggested I also pick up pThagrosh as a way of having alternate caster. Thanks for taking the time to respond btw

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NOTE: As a new player, I'd recommend sticking to lower point games early on to learn the game if you are new. Move up slow, perhaps 25 then to 35 later, get a good grasp on the game and your models then move to 50. Moving up too fast can overcomplicate the game for new players and cause serious play issues, games drag on forever, and can be difficult to play. Just a warning.
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I'm a big fan of pThags. He's a lot more forgiving than Abby is, and while they both suffer from Purification, I feel pThags can power through it better than Abby due to a much more effecient feat and his strength debuff which can't be purified away. He's also better in melee than Abby.

He is an armor skew list caster and excells at lower point levels due to being able to feat back a beast (assuming it was not RFP'ed, watch out for any RFP effects including snacking, carnivore, takedown and a slew of other abilities).

Also, you might not be a fan of infintry, and its true the Warmchine infintry is strong, but legion has plenty of great choices and I'd argue we mix our heavy beasts with infintry very well. Legionnaires + the pot is a great 9 pts module to spawn more lesser warbeasts and really helps the attrition fight. All of our ranged units (except the archers) are very versatile and add a lot to our list compositions and help deliver our beasts.

To the lists:

Abby has three upkeeps and they are all amazing. Carnivore is fantastic on the Scytheans since Mat 8 almost guarantees them to hit with both their initials to trigger their chain attack. Playing god is amazing on a number of beasts but Typhon loves it a great deal because reach is one of the best abilities in the game. Raeks should also be considered to give them two open fists and reach giving them a lot of interesting utility. Forced evolution is a baller spell and coupled with tenacity and an Angelius you can sport a hefty DEF 17/ARM 18 beast. Its very resillient against those lists who do not have an answer for it especially since Serpentine means they can not be knocked down.

Blight field is a fantastic control spell that allows you to prevent focus allocation or beast forcing and enables you to protect your beasts.

Her feat is situational, which reading it the first time seems silly. Most players who know her feat, will focus fire on one beast till it dies instead of slowly grinding multiple heavies down which is what that feat LOVES. I've played her a number of times and often it helps heal one beast up to full that they failed to kill, but a lot of the time it's less than effective.

List:

Abby+5 (Tier 4) (Melee Focused)
Typhon 11 - Playing God
Angelius 8 - Forced Evo + Tenacity
Scythean 8 - Carnivore
x2 Shredders 4
Harrier 2 - Truestrike animus for Abby late game is amazing, especially against high def casters.
Shepherd 1
Forsaken 2
Forsaken 2
Forsaken 2

All of the lessers get Adv. Deployment and since you have 3 forsaken all of your heavies get adv. move. This puts your force way up the board.

If you are interested in pThags as an alternate choice I'd recommend really going with an armor skew and back it up with either Legos+pot or the Warspears+UA.

pThags +5 (Lots of beef, low model count, fury issues)
Carnivean 11
Scythean 9
Ravagore 10
Warspears+UA 10

Or

pThags +5 (Less offensive threat, more attrition, better fury management)
Carnivean 11
Scythean 9
Ravagore 10
Legionnaires 6
Spawning Vessel 3
Shepherd 1

Thanks for your input. I plan to start with 15pts games using absy, carni and angelius. And then work up. I wont jump right into 35pts. As much as I love your lists, sadly they are just out of my price range. I have £30, and my local FLGS to buy it from is 4tk (www.4tk.co.uk). So its hard to do those lists. And I really dont like legionnares models :( I hope i do not come across as debunking all your help, sorry if i do :(


Im thinking of doing this:

15pts
Absy/pThag
Carnivean
Angelius

25pts
Absy/pThag
Carnivean
Angelius
Ravagore

35pts
Absy/pThag
Carnivean
Angelius
Ravagore
Seraph
The Forsaken

This gives me good fury management, a feat to bring back one of my big beasties, and the seraph both offers extra ranged alongside ravagore and can slingshot pThag into good range due to his low speed or catapult the carnivean into a combat it wants to be in or even help the angelius set up a charge lane. What do you guys think?

No worries, you have to work within your limits.

My lists are what I run, not the end all be all hehe. I think your lists are fine, but again, I feel you need a shredder, especially with Abby to really abuse the DEF bonus for the Angelius. Not sure you can fit it in, and the Carni fills its spot in a way, but if you're playing legion there are certain models you'll need to make more diverse lists.

Shredders
Forsaken
Shepherds

You'll find that being so beast heavy can be as beneficial as it is a liability on the table. Smaller model count armies tend to have to really position themselves well and get the most from their models, where Infintry can allow more fluid gameplay and will enable other models to perform. Also, a small model count army tends to be more vulnerable to infintry swarms and unable to deal with waves of dudes. The Seraph is a model I hardly ever use now days since a really good ranged game entices the enemy into my threat ranges.

So it is better to take the 4 shredders instead of the seraph?

Really depends on what you're facing across the table.

The seraph's role in any given list generally is to extend our threat ranges for melee beaters while providing some ranged support including key solo and UA removal. We needed this a lot before the Ravagore came along in order to force the engagement.

Now days, since the Ravagore has such a long range and by the nature of our faction, we can bring the pain at range which forces the engagement, therefore decreasing the need for the seraph.

Shredder spam is not very effective and you'd be better served (IMHO) by an 8 pt infintry unit, but since you don't want that, I'd say try out different options and see what you like. Shredders are great, but they are not very sturdy, and are usually one shotted by weapon master infintry which is flying around the board frequently in my experience.

Ok, so I have the following:
Absylonia
Angelius
Ravagore (converted)
Carnivean

thats 25pts

I have £30 I can spend at 4tk gaming of which the link I posted above. What do you suggest I do with it? You don't seem to agree with getting another caster so what is best options? Really intrigued Thanks!

Getting another caster is good times, I just feel those two suffer from the same match up problems. If you were to pick up another caster I'd say pick one up that really pairs well together.

I'd get Forsaken, and shredders and keep her in theme at that level.

Abby +5
Carnivean 10 - Playing God + Spiny Growth
Ravagore 9 - Carnivore (Helps its mat 5)
Angelius 8 - Forced Evolution + Tenacity
Shredder 2
Shredder 2
Harrier 2
Forsaken 2
Forsaken 2
Forsaken 2
Shepherd 1

Its a 35 pt list that has all the pieces needed to run hot every turn. Forsaken load up and can be used to remove infintry or boost/buy attacks against key targets. Shepherd is the Ravagore's buddy, helps remove fury and extend forcing range so they can hold a flank and apply ranged pressure. 1 shredder for transfer target for Abby and Tenacity battery. Other shredder to throw at key solos and keeps Tenacity on Angelius. Harrier is in the list to move up, kill something and then sprint back. Keep it safe if you can for late game to use Truestrike animus on Abby so she can get in there, which can enable her to assassinate.

Remember to cast blight field to help protect your beasts and cause your enemy problems (For Warjacks you'll want to cast it on them in order to prevent allocation of focus, while against warbeasts you'll want to cast it where they'll end their charge to prevent forcing). Avoid purification casters if possible, but if you can't, instead of using all upkeeps, use only the ones you need to punish the enemy since defensive ones are going to be purified off. There is something to be said about forcing the enemy to cast Purify every turn also.

Good luck!

Thank you! I will ask also then for the sake that I am now tempted, if I were to not stick to her tier, and include troops... what should I add?

Out of tier go with the Gatorman Posse and witch doctor. Even without buffs, they are amazing. But you can throw carnivore on them to make them really shine.

My post was eaten by internet gremlins!

So to sum up what I had:

Abby will benefit from ranged elements to help antagonize and threaten the enemy and force engagement. That said, she can also benefit from nearly any type of infintry that allows her to get her beasts up the field and into the enemies face.

Ranged elements:
-Striders+UA - Fantastic. Reform, stealth, CRA, and Hunter. They get the job done. Good tactic for them is to move up shoot, scoot back, then the following turn, move up, shoot, then reform into the enemy lines. Due to their high DEF, they are a great tarpit to gum their lines up after two rounds of shooting.
-Deathstalkers - Great solo, gives swift hunter to Striders and can remove two single wound models a turn with snap fire and sniper. They have stealth and are very fast.
-Raptors - Awesome light cav unit. Fast, light cav move enables them to hit and run, and they have poison on their bows which is ranged weapon master vs. living models. Great for killing heavy infintry and putting some damage on beasts, while still being a threat to casters. They are also weapon masters in melee so they can be lethal on the charge.
-Annyssa Ryvaal - Great solo, gives rat bonus to Raptors. She has stealth and snap fire enabling her to kill multiple single wound models along with poison for ranged weapon master vs. living.

Non-ranged elements:
-Legionnaires- Great tarpit, especially coupled with Spawning vessel.
-Spawning Vessel - takes corpses from living models and creates lesser beasts! Its fantastic and cheap. 9pt module of Legos+POT is tough to chew through and creates little monsters.
-Ogrun Warspears - They have a ranged attack, but it is short range and they have assault so I define them as a melee centric unit more often than not with some verstility with the new UA giving them real hitting power with Prey and relentless charge for pathfinder.
-Swordsmen - Our weaponmaster unit, I love them but feel they need casters who make them shine.

There are other options such as Incubi which are also good and I'd recommend you play with.

Avoid Grotesques, Archers, and Warmongers for now. They are less used and generally not viewed as being very reliable models as of yet. The Striders are (IMO) just better than the Archers. Grotesques do not have a UA yet, and their CMD stat is aweful making them bunch up. Warmongers are decent in a few lists, but generally not as good as the Warspears+UA.